Torque max protection source- Injector limit?

I have a 2016 F150 3.5 ecoboost and cannot seem to get around the Injector limit for the Torque Max Protection Source. Here is my file, stock file and log. Please help.

Attachment 76332Attachment 76328Attachment 76331

This is just the source of the current maximum torque source for protection, not necessarily the one that's actually limiting you.

Looking at it, when you actually are limited (Torque Airlimit Source or Torque Source directly), its from Popcorn.

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Originally Posted by Steven@HPTuners

This is just the source of the current maximum torque source for protection, not necessarily the one that's actually limiting you.

Looking at it, when you actually are limited (Torque Airlimit Source or Torque Source directly), its from Popcorn.

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Thank you. I’ve been beating myself up over this for a few days. What does the popcorn limit mean on these?

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Originally Posted by 02reaper

Thank you. I?ve been beating myself up over this for a few days. What does the popcorn limit mean on these?

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You're right at the border of several tables.
-Popcorn is the LSPI tables (I recommend just changing nominal and high, that way if you ever get gas that's less than 87 octane it will limit your load).
-Combustion Stability limit is probably coming from the popcorn limit (it may go away when you get popcorn taken care of)
-Cyl. Pressure Limit is under spark, you're running as much spark advance as you can at the load you are at (according to the table).
-The fuel injector limit and turbo air flow (turbo 2 fmem) are other limits that you may or may not run into, but they're not one of your current limits, just a max protection for the engine for now.

So raise your LSPI tables for high and nominal, raise your cyl. pressure limit table on the 1.8 air load row, and see where that gets you.

You are also logging too many pids, that's why you air load and rpm lines are so straight and curve at all, the graphs are going off inputs that are comparatively far apart. You probably need to take out most or all of the mapped points while you're trying to get everything else dialed in (if I want to log mapped points with other parameters I'll just log the 3-4 I hit during WOT). You can also try changing refresh rates on some of your PIDS to allow you more usable values. You may also want to log actual not SAE values due to the tables working off the values the truck sees, not necessarily SAE. I would recommend also logging engine brake torque and air load requested by torque so you can see when you are hitting the max tq limit in the transmission (it won't show up under any of your source limits) and also if the truck is hitting the air loads it thinks it needs to to make the power it wants to.

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Originally Posted by Puggyberra

You're right at the border of several tables.
-Popcorn is the LSPI tables (I recommend just changing nominal and high, that way if you ever get gas that's less than 87 octane it will limit your load).
-Combustion Stability limit is probably coming from the popcorn limit (it may go away when you get popcorn taken care of)
-Cyl. Pressure Limit is under spark, you're running as much spark advance as you can at the load you are at (according to the table).
-The fuel injector limit and turbo air flow (turbo 2 fmem) are other limits that you may or may not run into, but they're not one of your current limits, just a max protection for the engine for now.

So raise your LSPI tables for high and nominal, raise your cyl. pressure limit table on the 1.8 air load row, and see where that gets you.

You are also logging too many pids, that's why you air load and rpm lines are so straight and curve at all, the graphs are going off inputs that are comparatively far apart. You probably need to take out most or all of the mapped points while you're trying to get everything else dialed in (if I want to log mapped points with other parameters I'll just log the 3-4 I hit during WOT). You can also try changing refresh rates on some of your PIDS to allow you more usable values. You may also want to log actual not SAE values due to the tables working off the values the truck sees, not necessarily SAE. I would recommend also logging engine brake torque and air load requested by torque so you can see when you are hitting the max tq limit in the transmission (it won't show up under any of your source limits) and also if the truck is hitting the air loads it thinks it needs to to make the power it wants to.

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I’ll try this. Thank you. What is popcorn?

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Originally Posted by 02reaper

I’ll try this. Thank you. What is popcorn?

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For all intents and purposes its a term Ford made up and uses. I believe it is supposed to reference the sound of detonation or knock, but it shows up when preignition tables are off, and pre-ignition wouldn't sound like popcorn. In editor they mention it under load limiting low and high, but typically its the LSPI tables that actually cause your torque source to go to popcorn, so again it doesn't make a ton of sense heh.

Interesting, maybe Ford engineers were fans of Grosse Point Blank: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wPH2B1U-PcM

Thank You all for your help. I will keep chugging along and try this at a better angle.

Good LSPI description here, and why it's more important in DI engines than port injected.

http://www.engineprofessional.com/EP...ml/page44.html

Just noticed this page shows them using HPTuners for the test!

http://www.engineprofessional.com/EP...ndex.html#p=49

Good info there on how oil additives are causing LSPI events in turbocharged DI engines.

-Don