newbie 2001 1500hd

I made way more modifications to engine than I can tune, but it seems to be running decent.
main issue is cruising at around 2k rpm I'm getting engine ping
I would really appreciate any pointers or help

My setup is as follows:
2001 Silverado 1500hd
LQ4/4L80e
212/22x 107.5 lsa truck norris cam with springs
shorty headers stock cats true duel exhaust
hpi-42lb-ls3 injectors
706 heads
AEM 30-0300x wired into serial to usb
nbss intake, 16249939 map sensor
92mm cable tb with factory sensors
corvette filter 58 psi
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Originally Posted by SmokeyOkie

main issue is cruising at around 2k rpm I'm getting engine ping

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fix this
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I took your tune and put into SD so you can tune the VE. Youre lean in most the areas youre getting knock, as was pointed out. I changed your injector data to what i had for 42lbers on a gen3 system. Works well with the setups ive used so far. Data is originally from blindsquirrel. I also alter the spark tables for the knock and smoothed the area out, then applied it to the idle spark tables for uniformity. Try this and if itll run get a data log and we can apply it to the VE table. You need to get the air model more accurate, MAF and VE.

Dont try to do idle tuning until your airflow model is accurate. Idle air scalars and tables are based on the main air model. (I noticed you had the Idle Adaptives zero'd in the tune)

Just a word of wisdom, you have stock cats installed and have COT turned off in the tune. That can get dangerous for cat longevity. These cats dont have nine lives lol

Thanks Guru, I loaded your tune and this is the log.

Attachment 162436

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Originally Posted by SmokeyOkie

Thanks Guru, I loaded your tune and this is the log.

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Does it run any better?

Hers your tune with the VE changes from the log applied. Its still gonna be pretty far off. Load the tune, Clear the fuel trim data in the scanner special functions before you start the log. Then get another log. Remeber when youre logging that pedal movement causes transients, so try to keep pedal adjustments to to a minimum. I cant see your wideband in the log, so either post a screenshot of the wideband VE data or blend it into the VE table on your own.

Also, if its running better, try to fill in as many of the cells as possible on the next few logs. That means stop and go driving, mid throttle, light throttle, up hill, down hill. Data in all areas is helpful. 3000RPM going uphill is a much different load than 3000RPM going downhill.

Attachment 162439
still has pinging at above 50+ mph at 2300 rpm and below
and Im very new at tuning so anything that needs changed, please feel free to change it Attachment 162440

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SmokeyOkie

Attachment 162439
still has pinging at above 50+ mph at 2300 rpm and below
and Im very new at tuning so anything that needs changed, please feel free to change it Attachment 162440

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Im assuming that the lean condition in the idle area is more than likely a false reading based on idle "misfire" (valve overlap). The 107 LSA of the cam will cause that. Since the O2s are still active and we're in CL, I used the data from the O2 sensors to alter the VE map. Past 2400rpm added in another 10% and changed the PE settings. Id rather be fat and happy than lean and damaged.

I also averaged you timing tables between what you had and a stock truck. If theres no knock than we can start raising it in areas until we get to what it likes.

Awesome info Guru, I will get on it and Thank you for all your help so far

Definitely better the ping is not as bad and is now only under 2k rpm
I did try taking away 2 deg timing from low and high octane in just those areas but almost made it worse
Attachment 162473

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SmokeyOkie

Definitely better the ping is not as bad and is now only under 2k rpm
I did try taking away 2 deg timing from low and high octane in just those areas but almost made it worse
Attachment 162473

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Remember that knock retard is caused by noise, and not all noise comes from the engine pinging. If you still have KR on the logs after your fueling is good and you have reasonable spark advance numbers, start looking for things like exhaust hitting the frame or loose parts rattling somewhere. Also, some cams combinations will trip the knock sensors at a specific rpm range. However, make sure fuel and base spark are good before chasing random noises.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SmokeyOkie

Definitely better the ping is not as bad and is now only under 2k rpm
I did try taking away 2 deg timing from low and high octane in just those areas but almost made it worse
Attachment 162473

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Heres the same tune i sent earlier with the new log reading applied to VE and i lowered spark in the area it was seeing knock. Go to higher rpms if its not knocking. If its only pulling a degree or 2 and quits at higher rpm i would let it go and get more data for the VE. The knock retard system is there for a reason and its doing its job. Its capable of pulling much more timing than a couple of degrees, so we're still in the safe controllable range. Plus those timing tables are yours averaged with another stock file plus hand smoothing from me. Perfectly fine if it needs a little more work.

Gametech I hear ya its an old farm truck it definitely has exhaust rattle (exhaust tip banging on receiver hitch), but this noise is internal and it only does it when its lugging down the highway and gets worse the more the throttle blade opens but as soon as it downshifts or gets above 2k its all good. I've just been keeping it out of overdrive and its fine, but I'm sure it has something to do with 33 tires with 3.73 gears
may just have to change the shift points in trans.

Guru i will get a better log tomorrow and remember to screenshot the afr. Sorry about the shitty log, I was in a bit of a rush to start cutting hay.

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Originally Posted by SmokeyOkie

Gametech I hear ya its an old farm truck it definitely has exhaust rattle (exhaust tip banging on receiver hitch), but this noise is internal and it only does it when its lugging down the highway and gets worse the more the throttle blade opens but as soon as it downshifts or gets above 2k its all good. I've just been keeping it out of overdrive and its fine, but I'm sure it has something to do with 33 tires with 3.73 gears
may just have to change the shift points in trans.

Guru i will get a better log tomorrow and remember to screenshot the afr. Sorry about the shitty log, I was in a bit of a rush to start cutting hay.

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Since you mentioned it I updated your tune with the tire and gear wizard. I also used bluecat trans tool and updated the transmission shift points and TCC lockup points. I find usually the WOT shift speed is too high and it hits the rev limiter when i use this tool. If this happens you can just lower the mph in that table to a reasonable point. The pcm has to see MPH then RPM to shift WOT. I increased shift pressures just a bit. If it doesnt help or you dont like it, just load the other file without the trans adjustments.

Well that tune almost took away all ping, there is still a little bit left but so much better to drive
and the shifting was better but still would benefit from a set of 4.10 gears

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Originally Posted by SmokeyOkie

Well that tune almost took away all ping, there is still a little bit left but so much better to drive
and the shifting was better but still would benefit from a set of 4.10 gears

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Lets get one more good log like that and then we can tackle the MAF curve. Its nice and fat on the top end in most places once it hits PE and i altered the VE table to go up to around 6200ish, so you can run it up to whatever RPM youre gonna be shifting at for some data. Also, i lowered and smoothed the timing tables some more in the problem area. If that takes care of the knock then we probly need to lower the timing in that area a couple more degrees to get some head room from the knock ceiling.

it still has some ping at lockup in OD in the 1600 rpm range but not to worried about that
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Heres 2 tune files. Load log 5 and go get a short log just to see if the changes takes care of the knock. Im hoping it should be gone under load now. If youre ok with how it runs and dirves, then load the "log 5 MAF only" tune file.

Youll need to be logging MAF frequency in Hz in the scanner channels. Heres a screenshot of how MAF trim histogram should be setup. The x axis comes from the MAF table column axis.
You can clone the graph after you make it (using the clone button at the top) and substitute LTFT+STFT for your wideband so we can get the top end in line...

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Itll be the same process we've been using. Clear trims, take a log, apply changes to MAF instead of VE table. If you see it going lean really hard at any point just let off the pedal and stop the log there. We can extrapolate some data and move the table by hand so that youre not lean on top. Although i did add 10% to the MAF already in anticipation of it being lean in some areas. The good news is MAF curve is just one row, so it doesnt take near as long to log the data.

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I dont think i did something right

Youre not logging MAF Hz Attachment 162675

Was this log after the last tune i sent you? Did it still get spark knock after that tune was loaded?

It looks like you made the histogram, but werent logging MAF Hz

Make one that is the same as the screenshot in post #17, then use the clone buttonAttachment 162681, then change the new histo to your WB instead of LTFT+STFTAttachment 162676

sorry I'm a little slow sometimes
but yes this morning after tune was loaded no ping at all but after it gets hot outside some came back
this also happened with yesterdays tune but just figured I was crazy

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SmokeyOkie

sorry I'm a little slow sometimes
but yes this morning after tune was loaded no ping at all but after it gets hot outside some came back
this also happened with yesterdays tune but just figured I was crazy

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Id compare the 2 logs and see where the knock starts, IAT wise. Id bet you could compare the 2 and alter the IAT spark modifier table to solve the issue. Higher temps usually equal higher IATs

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ok I think i got it right this time

Heres the tune with log data applied. I couldnt do much past this point Attachment 162790 The trims end there and you didnt post a wideband screenshot this time. If you happen to have one you can upload and i can apply it if you dont want to. Lets do one more sweep of the MAF curve after all of this is applied and make sure its falling in line with what we want.

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hopefully this one is correct

The changes from that log are applied and i put it back into blended air, using MAF and VE table and DFCO is back on. Put this tune in, clear the trims and go see how it drives or what other issues you have going on.

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took it out for a short cruise ran great but don't know why its still showing lean

Quote:

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Originally Posted by SmokeyOkie

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took it out for a short cruise ran great but don't know why its still showing lean

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Fuel trims will always push it back to stoich or slightly lean in certain areas for fuel economy. We tuned on fuel trims, so dont compare the WB to the trims. We used them for different areas, so we're not going to pit the results against each other. Ideally, we want one area to blend nicely into the other.

Attachment 162916 The area i circled here is where it went into OL and that is where we started tuning with the WB.

Attachment 162917 This is from your log viewing the LTFT+STFT. Obviously its a little fat while in blended mode at the moment, but these are the trims we were using to tune CL area. Also, as you can see where i circled, The fuel trims hit 0 in the same cells I circled on the WB histogram. Meaning, it was in OL and we used the WB in those cells.


Attachment 162918 Even comparing to just STFT readings from the same log, its not too far off where we tuned it with trims. And again, it hits 0 in the same cells the WB took over at. Alternatively, there is a lean patch in the middle of the 1600rpm columns while viewing STFT. If we use the "C" (count) button Ive circled hereAttachment 162919 you can view how many hits that cell had during the run. Id like to see more hits everywhere, but Sometimes youll get an area of lean or rich that if you view the counts, only had a couple of hits per cell. Low counts arent good data to use. The more hits the better the average for that cell and the more accurate. We tuned it with LTFT+STFT so i dont care what the stft say on their own. Id prefer the LTFT+STFT graph to be closer to Stoich though. More tuning will get it closer.

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This should be a decent log, let me know if I need to include anything else
Thank you

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