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I have a car with an ls-7 run by an E38 ecm. The fans are relay controlled. With the fan type set as pwm electric, when the fan turns on the relays buzz. If i change fan type to discrete the fan runs all the time. How do I get the fan to turn on and off at specified temps without the relays buzzing?
Guessing your are running a Corvette calibration (tune) in the E38. Corvettes use a single fan output from the ECM (C1 pin 58) - which is transmitted via PWM to a Fan Control Module - which then controls the speed of a single electric fan.
Trucks use a two electric fan, 3 relay setup. Truck calibrations have 2 fan outputs from the ECM - C1 pin 58 (Low) and C1 pin 17 (High).
Your relays "buzz" when they received a PWM signal (rapidly cycling on / off). You will need to alter the parameters of the Fan "State vs Desired %" and "Output Control vs State" in your Corvette calibration, to those parameters used by trucks.
I believe it was a corvette calibration. I did finally get the fans to work properly after searching through alot of tune files. The stock 2010 camaro file has discrete fan operation, so I copied it and tweaked the setting a little bit. The fan now comes on at 220 and off at 205 without the buzzing relays.
nice job!Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucra Cars
Could you write your settings? I have the same Problem.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucra Cars
Doesn't it suck when people refuse to post thier fix and help others, yet they started off asking for help them selves. I have the same issue.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jake666
Try these.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stevinas
https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...the-fan-states
https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...trol-discovery!
https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...r-lack-thereof
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stevinas
copy fan settings out of a vehicle that had on/off type fans. 2010 camaro's are an option. Several trucks are also set up this way. You can download tune on the
repository.
It sucks almost as much as software companies that sell you their software via proprietary hardware, lock you into restrictive usage parameters, and then instead of providing any support, they just let the blind lead the blind in an internet forum.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stevinas
Quote:
Originally Posted by LJS3SP
Haha - so many people purchase tuning software thinking that everything is easy - and that they will be an instant expert.
It is a bit like purchasing a scalpel and thinking that you are now a surgeon.
It takes years of experience to become proficient with tuning software.
If you do not have the time, nor the inclination, to take courses and / or self educate, then perhaps procuring the services of a knowledgeable professional tuner would be a better course of action.
They make the interface and the definitions. What you do with those tools is completely different. Your complaint is like asking the MS Word devs to teach you how to write. Dumb.Quote:
Originally Posted by LJS3SP
You can't very well self-educate if there is no repository of terms.
Good luck teaching yourself Chinese entirely in English without any documentation of how the Chinese language structure differs.
Then when you don't understand why people say good night when you say good morning, some forum loser tells you to hire someone to speak Chinese for you.
Time, inclination, are not issues.
It takes years of experience to be proficient in ANY software. That is beside the point.
This software does a very poor job to simply define the terms/values used in these fan tables. Any "proficient" tuner from the world of Haltech, Ecutek, etc etc shares this sentiment.
With a few years myself in the software industry, I know the practice very well.
Some companies take the time to lay down the knowledge base themselves, as a value proposition to their customers that their customers won't have to waste time in trial and error chasing their own tails, some companies actually have a support staff, and then other software companies do nothing and in effect outsource it to the user base who do the software company's job for them for free (and typically poorly, and requiring time wasted in sifting through bad or inaccurate information, not to mention the losers who have nothing to contribute beyond snark).
Of course those who actually do become proficient then turning around and maintaining language/terminology barriers to keep novices as far from proficiency as possible in order to profit for themselves is nothing new either, that is precisely how lawyers make money.
Fine company to keep.
What is it about software engineers on here who think tuning with HPT is just using software? And I hope you don’t include SiriusC as someone who is trying to keep others from having the knowledge. He spends a LOT of time on here helping others.
Could HPT do things differently to make it easier? Probably. But I assume they have a reason for how it ends up like it does.
Idk man. I started getting into this hobby for real last November. I didn't even know what injector characterization was. Didn't even know how to tune a MAF or why. I used the info found on this forum and the descriptions of what tables do when you hover over them in the tune. I'm still learning, but I've come a long way in a short time. It's inclination. I've never blamed my deficiencies on HPT lol.
Thank you :)Quote:
Originally Posted by gtstorey
Quote:
Originally Posted by LJS3SP
Would you like some cheese with your whine ?
You must find it difficult to walk around with your lower lip dragging on the ground like a pouting 3 year old.
Most professional tuners are self educated. When I started nearly 25 years ago there were very few resources available. Today there are books, videos, online courses, and a sprinkling of in class courses available.
I started learning how to tune by using my own LS powered vehicle as the test subject.
The first thing to learn is how to effectively use the scanning software. I would log vehicle data to and from work every day. In the evenings I would review the data logs, adjust the PIDs to log the following day, and attempt to see the relationships between PID data and vehicle operation.
Then came making minor adjustments to the vehicle calibration (tune) and assessing the overall change in driving behavior / feel.
I flashed different tunes into that vehicle over 800 times, while creating my own "how to tune" manual.
I then started to do some basic tuning for friends and car club members - at no cost - to continue learning on different PCM / ECM / TCM combinations.
The turning point in my tuning career was becoming involved with an ultra high end project at a local build shop. The vehicle owner knew about me through a local car club - and brought me in on the project - as the build shop had exhausted their expertise.
I got things sorted out for them - and shortly thereafter decided to start my own diagnostic / tuning business.
The moral of the story - nothing was handed to the experienced tuners that support this Forum in their spare time - they all learned from their own individual efforts.
So, roll up your sleeves and begin the learning process - or hire a reputable professional tuner - but stop whining.
It's the twenty-first century, old man. Nothing wrong with asking for better documentation on software nor asking for help when someone is genuinely lost. Some people exhaust their efforts and genuinely do not know what to do next. Just because you had it easy doesn't mean everyone else will; okay, boomer?Quote:
Originally Posted by Shrek
That's not fair. I don't see anywhere in his post that "Just because you had it easy". This software as with all common software like efiLive would take an encyclopedia Britannica to document every nuance to tuning. Not to mention it changes daily.Quote:
Originally Posted by fls350z
There is a plethora of info from countless sites that dig deep into specific tuning styles and areas to tune and the process or tuning order to follow. Demonstrated by the 10's of thousands of posts on this forum. I give back like a MF'r and yes I'm a boomer. I have thousands of hours at GM schools but most of what I have is self learned.
Biggest errors I see with younger folks like you is you think everything can be fixed with a tune or parts swapping. Fast example. Car came into the dealer as a no start. Open the hood and thousand or so dollars of coils, sensors, wires etc. Been to 4 separate shops for diag. Went out and customer walked out into the shop. Had a lot lizard crank it. Bam no cranking rhythm. No compression. $140 please. "What? it only took you 5 minutes!!". Yep, and yet you spent thousands to get to an old fkr who gave you the right diag.
You get more from honey then vinegar. Be polite and we are much more likely to help.