Wow! 4 out of the top/newest 7 topics in the VCM Scanner board now are about wideband

problems

and I just noticed that right under that section is "VCM Scanner External Sensors" with the majority of topics = wideband problems.

WTF?

Why bother with widebands if you're not a pro tuner or don't have a boosted/monstrous car?
Epic unnecessary headache and waste of money just to (hopefully & eventually) get your fuel mixture 1% better than what it was or could've been with narrowbands :rolleyes:


#narrowbandsforlife #thankgodididntbuyawideband #widebandplugnplaymyass(nohomo) #buyawidebandifyouwanttodiebeforeyougetoldfromthes tress

(I don't know what that space is about between "thestress" ^)

Been using wideband input for 6+ years with HPT with zero issues. Most issues I see with analog inputs are user error.

dumb post is dumb

Pretty much every car is boosted these days soooo...............

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Originally Posted by charcoal03silvy

Been using wideband input for 6+ years with HPT with zero issues. Most issues I see with analog inputs are user error.

dumb post is dumb

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What exactly is dumb about my post? You saying my post is dumb is pretty stupid and ignorant. Good for you for not having issues with widebands for 6+ years. YOU'RE A PRO TUNER. You don't count. There are hundreds of people just on this forum who have had problems with their widebands (installing, calibrating, whatevering...). Open your eyes. Yes, "user erorr" still counts as problems.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Slowbalt2000

Pretty much every car is boosted these days soooo...............

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Source? Proof?

Doesn't matter. End of the day, widebands are a pain in the ass (and so not worth it) for the average DIYer/car-modder. And I think most wideband noobs think installing one will be smooth sailing, just plug n play... when reality it's :banghead:

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mr. Smith

Source? Proof?

Doesn't matter. End of the day, widebands are a pain in the ass (and so not worth it) for the average DIYer/car-modder. And I think most wideband noobs think installing one will be smooth sailing, just plug n play... when reality it's :banghead:

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I think youre installing them wrong...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Slowbalt2000

I think youre installing them wrong...

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I think you need to open your eyes and see the countless amount of topics regarding wideband problems.


- I know you're fooling around, but I don't want this getting off topic... I want to get my point across, cement this in peoples heads, stop this epidemic, help my fellow car enthusiasts out...
Joe Blows in their 135hp Civics or lightly modded LS1-powered cars, have no business buying wideband kits. Waste of time and money.

People: *ask for help on tuning help forum*

Mr. Smith: *WHY ARE SO MANY PEOPLE ASKING FOR HELP?!?! WIDEBANDS ARE THE DEVIL*

Rookie at best here. I bought an AEM. Sure it took a bit to get it added as a channel but if this stuff was super easy I guess there wouldn't be a forum. Thank you to the pros who drop helpful tips!

When your narrowband sensors starts telling you real time air fuel ratio's, please get back to me.



It doesn't matter if the vehicle is mostly stock, has camshaft or is turbo/supercharged. Knowing the real time air fuel ratio is a 100% must if you want to be accurate and to learn the proper way to dial fueling in. It doesn't matter if you own a shop, do side work or it's just your play toy. The point of the wideband is to be smart and accurate with changes so you can try to optimize the tune for that engine.

The wideband is a tool, it's there to help.

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Originally Posted by 5FDP

When your narrowband sensors starts telling you real time air fuel ratio's, please get back to me.

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They don't? What, is there a 5 second delay or something?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by 5FDP

It doesn't matter if the vehicle is mostly stock, has camshaft or is turbo/supercharged. Knowing the real time air fuel ratio is a 100% must if you want to be accurate and to learn the proper way to dial fueling in. It doesn't matter if you own a shop, do side work or it's just your play toy. The point of the wideband is to be smart and accurate with changes so you can try to optimize the tune for that engine.

The wideband is a tool, it's there to help.

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So narrowbands aren't tools/parts and there to help too?
How much more accurate are widebands would you say? 0.5%? 1%?
I've read posts like "after hooking up a wideband, I was surprised to see how accurate I got my tune with the narrowbands".
I've never read a post like "omg, what a difference a wideband made! My tune was so off with the nb's. My car feels amazing now".

How much hp did you gain after dialing in your trucks tune with a wideband? 2?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by LittleBlue

Rookie at best here. I bought an AEM. Sure it took a bit to get it added as a channel but if this stuff was super easy I guess there wouldn't be a forum. Thank you to the pros who drop helpful tips!

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So what exactly have you gained from all the headaches and money you spent on it?
Do you think it was all worth it?

Im not one to stir the pot but...... I am one of the most recent ones to ask a questions regarding how to get my wideband up and running. With that said i am greatly appreciated by the support from most of the people here on the forum, I'll be the first to say that im not well endowed when it comes to the tuning side with all the computers and late model cars running around and i come from the other side where you just change the jets when it comes to adding fuel. But im learning none the least thanks to all those that take the time to answer (what may seem to be a frivolous for them). But to Mr. Smith I believe you mean well with your comments, but i can only speak for myself that once i began tuning with a wideband i did realize how far off my tune was (giving that i was still using a carburetor) and trying to keep it together using a 200 shot, it was by far the best piece/tool i have ever bought at the time. Now fast forward a few years and now ive got a car thats not quite as fast but (like us all here) like to make it run faster/better, so i installed a wideband because for me it was something im use to using and can easily understand whats going on under the hood. Im not saying there are other ways to doing it as im sure your smarter than me when it comes to tuning but for me and others its something i understand and as i progress with learning my way through the HP Tuners program i will become more knowledgeable with it and find other ways for tuning.

I've setup more than a couple widebands . And I must say it was far less difficult than most people make it out to be. This includes setting up wideband error graphs in the scanner. I'de say if your not willing/able to setup, fine tune with your wideband. You most definately shouldn't be tuning others vehicles. By all means keep wondering around those narrowbands trying to assume your fueling is tolerable. Nobody cares if you pop a piston in your personal car. Everyone cares when a vehicle let's go during tuning. And the first questions after the boom is fueling, ignition and engine temp? If your not willing to set up a wideband but willing to explain how worthless they are obviously you have not had to tune any serious heads/cam setups. Some of your posts just seem like rants explaing your inability
to use the standard tuning equipment we all use now days.

I don't consider myself a tuner but I did follow the instructions and found it fairly easy to set up a wideband. Almost got to have one unless you have a Dodge or Ford vehicle that comes from the factory with widebands.

See if these links help.

https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...al-VE-Vehicles

https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...-PRO-Interface)

https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...VCM-Scanner-V3

https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...621#post416621

https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...er-V3&p=419231

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Originally Posted by Mr. Smith

So what exactly have you gained from all the headaches and money you spent on it?
Do you think it was all worth it?

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Well, I don't know if I had any headaches. I have a new hobby I guess. Still trying to get the AFR dialed in. I don't think my o2 sensors could be used anymore as I drastically changed my exhaust and added a turbo but again I'm very inexperienced. As for if it was worth it, I think I needed it but if not I plan to try WOT tuning on my other vehicles for fun so I'm happy with it for now.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Mr. Smith

problems

and I just noticed that right under that section is "VCM Scanner External Sensors" with the majority of topics = wideband problems.

WTF?

Why bother with widebands if you're not a pro tuner or don't have a boosted/monstrous car?
Epic unnecessary headache and waste of money just to (hopefully & eventually) get your fuel mixture 1% better than what it was or could've been with narrowbands :rolleyes:


#narrowbandsforlife #thankgodididntbuyawideband #widebandplugnplaymyass(nohomo) #buyawidebandifyouwanttodiebeforeyougetoldfromthes tress

(I don't know what that space is about between "thestress" ^)

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When you eventually figure out / understand that narrow band O2 sensors are used only in closed loop, please tell us how you're determining and adjusting the air-fuel ratio in open loop - boosted or not.

I guess the concept here is its great to see so many enthusiasts!

Without you and your enquiries it would be hard to gauge the interest out there. Keep the questions coming and Cudos to the knowledgeable ones willing to comment and support.

This is meant to be fun, after all !!

My recommendation would be to go read and update your knowledge on narrow band sensors and what they do.

Narrow band sensors only switch from high to low of the intended target which is Stoich or 14.7 to 1. They do not give an accurate reading on your current AFR.

Now you asked if 1% can make a difference? The answer is yes. Dropping 1% in fueling these days can cause a lean condition which can cause knock and retarding of the timing. Likewise too rich and you can be loosing power as your not getting a good clean burn or flame front to provide the best bang. Yes 1% can make a big difference when looking to get max efficiency and power.


Now since you basically tune VE first you want to know exactly what is happening when that VE table is being used. Since a narrow band can only tell you whether it is above or below it cant provide a complete picture like a WB can of what exactly your current AFR is at a specific cell in a VE table.


And if I haven't already mentioned, yes 1% can make a big difference even when tuning the same make , model and drive train.

New here. Very interesting thread to read. I have the HP Tuner pro and AEM 30-4110, and I'm just wanting to get some help with the wiring. I've seen videos for different models of AEM WB, but none for the 4110. By looking at the wiring diagrams, it looks like I would use the white wire (5V output) from the AEM and attach it to the red wire (analog 1) on the pro link. And the ground of course. Is that even close?