This will help make sense of the Mapped Points on the newer Fords...

I have a 2014 Taurus SHO and was looking at the Speed Density settings, trying to figure out what to change if I install modifications that normally require changes to the MAF transfer function. But I see about 15 mapped point tables, only Mapped Points 0-5 have data. What do the mapped points correlate to and which one(s) need to be changed? I see Eric mentioning Mapped Point 0 at idle, so what about 1-5 on the EcoBoost 3.5 V6?

Or do we even need to bother tuning Speed Density for simple parts like a cold air intake and downpipes? I'm not planning anything serious with the Taurus because I am sure the AWD transmission can't handle much more than 350 ft-lb of torque for the long term.

http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showth...=ford+equation

this helps a lot with the speed density.

As far as MP they are blended constantly. The different modes, distance tables, arrays along with the snap to point and snap to line shows you a path it try to take through them. There are many things working with each other so you really need to log MP weights in the scanner to follow it correctly.

I'm playing with this equalizer style bar graph layout to help me see how the mapped points act.
The video is kinda grainy but you can see what's happening. I just did it tonight so I want to play around with it some more

https://youtu.be/yM7WI0USUkM

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Originally Posted by GapRider

I'm playing with this equalizer style bar graph layout to help me see how the mapped points act.
The video is kinda grainy but you can see what's happening. I just did it tonight so I want to play around with it some more

https://youtu.be/yM7WI0USUkM

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Nice!

Anyway to set up a graph to populate weighted mapped points vs rpm vs load. I can only set up one mapped point per graph, but would be nice to have the heaviest weighted mapped point populate the graph in a rpm vs load table, just to compare it with advance, vct, knock etc..

No you would need a 3d model for that. Even if it was just the heaviest weighted point you would be missing a bunch of data in a 2d graph. The best you can do is compare where in a related MP table the values are and how much weight is on them at a given point. It would be cool to watch a live 3d flow dance around in a scanner you could at least get a general idea of the path it trys to take.

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Originally Posted by murfie

No you would need a 3d model for that. Even if it was just the heaviest weighted point you would be missing a bunch of data in a 2d graph. The best you can do is compare where in a related MP table the values are and how much weight is on them at a given point. It would be cool to watch a live 3d flow dance around in a scanner you could at least get a general idea of the path it trys to take.

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Yeah, figured it wasn't possible with the current scanner configuration, and honestly isn't required to tune, but would make an awesome reference tool. Finding the drivability tables and WOT tables is pretty straight forward and easy enough to tune with having the DMR weighted mapped point readout, so no complaints from me.

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Originally Posted by toyoguru

Anyway to set up a graph to populate weighted mapped points vs rpm vs load. I can only set up one mapped point per graph, but would be nice to have the heaviest weighted mapped point populate the graph in a rpm vs load table, just to compare it with advance, vct, knock etc..

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I was trying to see that same relationship by putting the 5 bigger bargraphs above the mapped point equalizer display but I need to arrange something differently so I can watch MAF, load, RPM right along with the mapped points dancing around. I did think it was cool how the mapped point percentages sort of traveled in a wave as I accelerated through the gears and reversed quickly while I was shifting gears.

I think the nice wave pattern is an indicator for a happy ecu. That's how it is stock. It's when you start getting weights split across three or more points with bouncing back and forth is when the ecu is working to find better values. Bits here and there are normal, but when it starts to look crazy and random that's not good. Makes tuning harder trying to get then to flow in the direction you want them to.

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Originally Posted by murfie

I think the nice wave pattern is an indicator for a happy ecu. That's how it is stock. It's when you start getting weights split across three or more points with bouncing back and forth is when the ecu is working to find better values. Bits here and there are normal, but when it starts to look crazy and random that's not good. Makes tuning harder trying to get then to flow in the direction you want them to.

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I wish I knew more. I want to know what it is that drives the weight and to which mapped point and I still don't understand the "distance" in distance tables.
Looking at the VCT mapped points - emissions reduction, fuel economy and optimal stability tables; then the distance tables for the same and finally at the snap to point table, I try to find a relationship to understand how it all works but I'm still lost.

For example:

What are these two tables telling me? Why only 4 rows in the emissions table but 14 rows in the fuel economy table?

Those are both array tables. One is the emissions array the other is the economy array. The correlating distance tables tell you the load and rpm relationship and distance along those arrays. The emissions array is just a larger part of the over all line.

Those arrays are then put into the snap to line table to form a relationship between them and what I believe is either a torque or load demand scale.

Once Eric works out the ?'s it should at least show us the line the ecu tries to follow with a relationship to the some form of driver demand.

I've also played around a lot with the knock retard and advance and I know the more these are working the father the weights get from any sort of line what's so ever. More like just a blob of percentages from random tables trying to minimize the knock retard to as close to 0 as it can.

To get a better understanding you need to look at the more complicated ones like the 3.5 eco boost or the 15/16 gt with it's imrc.

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Originally Posted by murfie

Those are both array tables. One is the emissions array the other is the economy array. The correlating distance tables tell you the load and rpm relationship and distance along those arrays. The emissions array is just a larger part of the over all line.

Those arrays are then put into the snap to line table to form a relationship between them and what I believe is either a torque or load demand scale.

Once Eric works out the ?'s it should at least show us the line the ecu tries to follow with a relationship to the some form of driver demand.

I've also played around a lot with the knock retard and advance and I know the more these are working the father the weights get from any sort of line what's so ever. More like just a blob of percentages from random tables trying to minimize the knock retard to as close to 0 as it can.

To get a better understanding you need to look at the more complicated ones like the 3.5 eco boost or the 15/16 gt with it's imrc.

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Wow, thanks for the reply. Still too much for me but I'll use it and keep studying. I'm addicted to this thing.

OK, I think I am starting to figure some of this out. Can one of you guru's check my logic, tell me if I'm right or wrong?

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Originally Posted by GapRider

OK, I think I am starting to figure some of this out. Can one of you guru's check my logic, tell me if I'm right or wrong?

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That's the way I see it. and in the 15+ you also have the imrc distance tables. They are load based but go from 3-9 along the fuel economy array. The drive ability array also follows the fuel economy array. Three separate distance tables one array.

The snap to point and snap to line describe the three arrays interaction with each other. The emissions and stability values somewhere in the middle of the fuel economy array.

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Originally Posted by murfie

That's the way I see it. and in the 15+ you also have the imrc distance tables. They are load based but go from 3-9 along the fuel economy array. The drive ability array also follows the fuel economy array. Three separate distance tables one array.

The snap to point and snap to line describe the three arrays interaction with each other. The emissions and stability values somewhere in the middle of the fuel economy array.

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Ok thanks! And I think you confirmed my suspicions about the "snap to" tables. The one table seems to describe a path the goes in numerical order 0-7 I think. Is that right? So if instead, the table values had a different order like 0-2,2-7,7-3 etc; that would be the order the ECU traversed through the mapped points?

I would say that's the order you would like it to try to use. Wether it actually does depends on if the ecu find your path the best path. This is my guess. Changing the order and getting the path "happy" again is very difficult and almost not worth trying to change the path like enabling OP mp on a 15+. I think the criteria for the best path is very complex. You could possibly reduce the amount if used MP and make every thing simpler, you just lose variability between the different systems. Intake exhaust cam timing. Spark timing. Torque requests. Ect.

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Originally Posted by murfie

I would say that's the order you would like it to try to use. Wether it actually does depends on if the ecu find your path the best path. This is my guess. Changing the order and getting the path "happy" again is very difficult and almost not worth trying to change the path like enabling OP mp on a 15+. I think the criteria for the best path is very complex. You could possibly reduce the amount if used MP and make every thing simpler, you just lose variability between the different systems. Intake exhaust cam timing. Spark timing. Torque requests. Ect.

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Ok thanks again. Plenty to mull over. I need to experiment and log some more now.

Just curious, is this logic based on some kind of mathematical concept or programming logic? I'm just interested in researching this kind of logic, Or am I reading way too far into this?

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Originally Posted by AKDMB

Just curious, is this logic based on some kind of mathematical concept or programming logic? I'm just interested in researching this kind of logic, Or am I reading way too far into this?

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I would say auto cad programs using snap to dimension lines would be something to compare it to and get a better understanding of the HDFX. I think the MP are layers of a larger 3d model. Allowed mapped points are allowed layers. Snap to points are points allowed to be combined into a single point.(or you think the ecu should try to pinch) Snap to line is the path of combined points you think the ecu should pinch together. The ecu can use any enabled layers.

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Originally Posted by Higgs Boson

Going from memory,

For the cams, the path starts on the lower right side with the Desired Air Load tables. Basically, they will tell the ECM how much you are pushing the gas and choose Stability, Economy, or Driveability (or Optimum Power).

Next, the Distance tables will look at RPM and load and decide which Distance Point to use. Now for all of them except for Driveability, the Distance Points reference another table just above those that relate the Distance Point to a Mapped Point in the IVO and ECV MP tables in that same area.

Driveability, as best I can tell, Distance Points related directly to the Mapped Point cam angle tables.

Now you can follow the path from Air Load to Distance Point to Cam Angle.

I have been playing with different settings and ended up enabling Optimum Power (2016, should already work on 11-14s), and editing the Air Load tables to suit my preferences. I ended up leaving the Distance Point and Mapped Point tables stock because changing those gave me misfire codes since now the spark tables would be wrong.....I don't have time to reinvent Ford's wheel on this VVT/Spark relationship so it can just stay stock (with stock cams) and Optimum Power tables can handle all the WOT/heavy throttle stuff just fine.

With aftermarket cams I suppose it would take a lot of work to fine tune the part throttle stuff, but I wouldn't really see an issue leaving it stock as long as the cams were installed like the stock cams, obviously with more duration and maybe lift....use Optimum power tables to handle overlap amount and location just the same.

With locked cams however, I would think you just disable the VVT system entirely with the drop down box and mapped points would not even be a factor.

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That was great explanation.
So:

Distance tables points to MP ER/FE/OS, in this tables left colums is Distance and on right is specified MP,
this is correct for all tables in Distance Tables except BD.
Is that correct?

I have 2014 roush file and they disable MP7 and they command 7 in best DB table, so i'm stuck now.

Then in 2015 i'm getting occasionally OP mode after tweeking some setting, but looks it's used to use MP25 instead of OP in spark. He takes correct valve settings that are set in OP mode and MP25 is not set in any MP Distance tables configuretion and also in Distance tables itself. Any ideas why?