Need help with 2017 Silverado 6.2l Pulling timing from Tq mgt from a stop/slow roll

So I am starting to get real frustrated with this timing pull. If I'm just driving and come to a stop and then start to take off again with 50% throttle and under at times tq mgt will pull a shit load of timing. I think I know where it is pulling it from, the minimum spark tab 12701 under advance. I have certain areas put to 0 to test this theory. What I don't understand is why is it pulling timing in the first place. In the log its not spinning tires. What am I missing here? Traction control turned off makes no difference. The only time it wont pull any timing is when Traction control and stability control are off together but it only keeps off stability control until it hits 35mph then automatically turns it back on. :banghead::banghead:


I have attached my tune file as well as the latest run I just did. At the end of the drive is where it is pulling timing down to 0 Degrees. time stamp 08:57.663 and on.

Any help or thoughts are appreciated. Thanks in advance.

Ryan

Its pulling timing during the shift, pretty normal.

I'm not referring to the timing pull during the shift. I'm referring to the massive timing pull on take off at the exact time stamp I place in the original post 08:57.663

I find it odd that torque management advance is 0 during this event. Have you tried adding all of the other spark modifiers to the log?

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Originally Posted by sevinn

I find it odd that torque management advance is 0 during this event. Have you tried adding all of the other spark modifiers to the log?

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It shows in the log at 08:56.096 for 16.1 degrees of timing pulled. I had the polling interval to 200ms is all. :doh:

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Originally Posted by FastV

It shows in the log at 08:56.096 for 16.1 degrees of timing pulled. I had the polling interval to 200ms is all. :doh:

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Ah yeah, I dragged through it too fast at first.

what are your modifications

[QUOTE=Higgs Boson;595848]what are your modifications[/QUOTE/


Kooks 1 3/4 long tubes to 3 inch kooks y pipe no cats to slp catbcack exhaust, S & B cold air intake to factory TB, 160 Degree tstat and my own tune.


Ryan

From what I am seeing, your immediate torque source is Trans S = Transmission Short term tq mgt (things like shifting, generally using spark only), however its not completing the shift until later down the line. This is the only thing that is immediately noticeable to me




Attachment 95770

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Originally Posted by ZincGT

From what I am seeing, your immediate torque source is Trans S = Transmission Short term tq mgt (things like shifting, generally using spark only), however its not completing the shift until later down the line. This is the only thing that is immediately noticeable to me

So do you suggest I up the Trans output max in ft to say somewhere around 7000 ftlbs? See if this helps?

Ryan


Attachment 95770

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So Zink Gt do you suggest I up the Trans output max in ftlbs to say somewhere around 7000 ftlbs and see if that helps?

Ryan

I would definitely try it

Monitoring this thread, as my 2015 Yukon Denali started a very similar anomaly, right after GM dealer flashed my vehicle's ECM (recall concern).

There was an "update" by GM, they applied that update, and since then I've had a local tuner evaluate. He noticed that it was pulling a load of timing, during a hard launch, but only right after a "rolling stop". This GM dealer agreed that it is a tuning issue, but GM will not authorize a "fix" for it, citing that the updated application is a fix for protecting the transmission. I've always suspected that the vehicle had a delayed 2-1 downshift, but was told that mechanically the transmission is "solid". That's good to know, but why the issue with excessive reduction in timing?

*edit*
Added Screenshot of Transmission>Torque Management>General>Torque Reduction: During Accel versus Decel. Not sure how much "effect" this would have, but have seen up to 12-degrees in timing reduction under full load (accelerating) after decelerating from 50mph to 05mph. Image on the left is configuration when I bought the vehicle, and the image on the right is after the dealership loaded an update.

Zink Gt, So I up'd it to 7000 and made no difference so I put it back to the stock setting. Thing is my 2015 5.3 2wd Didn't have this issue and I didn't change any of those columns. In case you ask, the 2015 5.3l has the same bolt on mods as the 2017 does now.

1badc1, So I compared my 2015 to my 2017 Silverado under tables 15403 and 15404 and they are both the same it reads 15 in all the columns under tab 15403, and reads 148 in all columns under tab 15404, and like I said above the 2015 5.3 didn't have these issues. My only issue is if I'm slightly rolling a few mph say 3-5mph after a decel and then hitting the throttle to say 50% and under. It starts off fine then pulls the shit out of the timing In what feels like forever but its only a few milliseconds. I know what tab its pulling if from, just don't know why. its pulling from tab #12701 or #12793 under spark/advance/minimum spark. I have both those tables set the same. I have feeling if I copy my High octane table to those tables 12701,12793 in the columns giving me trouble it won't be able to pull that timing anymore. Just not sure if that the correct way to do it. I really would like to know what's telling tq management to pull the timing in the first place.


Ryan

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Originally Posted by FastV

1badc1, So I compared my 2015 to my 2017 Silverado under tables 15403 and 15404 and they are both the same it reads 15 in all the columns under tab 15403, and reads 148 in all columns under tab 15404, and like I said above the 2015 5.3 didn't have these issues. My only issue is if I'm slightly rolling a few mph say 3-5mph after a decel and then hitting the throttle to say 50% and under. It starts off fine then pulls the shit out of the timing In what feels like forever but its only a few milliseconds. I know what tab its pulling if from, just don't know why. its pulling from tab #12701 or #12793 under spark/advance/minimum spark. I have both those tables set the same. I have feeling if I copy my High octane table to those tables 12701,12793 in the columns giving me trouble it won't be able to pull that timing anymore. Just not sure if that the correct way to do it. I really would like to know what's telling tq management to pull the timing in the first place.

Ryan

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Similar scenario... I noticed this when I was attempting to merge onto a populated highway. Coasted down to ~10mph (short merge lane), gave it 100%, and the Yukon fell on its face for a second or so, then hauled ass. I thought it was a fluke, but I am able to repeat it on demand. Took the dealership's regional service manager for a ride, and he is aware of the issue. That information got communicated to GM, and his instruction was to not do anything to change the loaded application (configuration). I suspect GM is covering their tail, but cannot prove that. LOL

Haven't actually studied logs excessively. Table 15404 was modified in GM's update, and I'm suspecting that has something to do with it. It's been some YEARS since I've used HPT (tuning a 5.3L LM7, back in 2006-2007). With all these "newer" parameters, I don't know if I'm barking up the wrong tree, but am hoping this thread can help with resolving this ANNOYING scenario of timing being pulled. I'm attaching screenshots of the comparison log, showing what tables were modified. This update was applied to correct transmission "issues", according to GM.

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Originally Posted by 1badc10

Similar scenario... I noticed this when I was attempting to merge onto a populated highway. Coasted down to ~10mph (short merge lane), gave it 100%, and the Yukon fell on its face for a second or so, then hauled ass. I thought it was a fluke, but I am able to repeat it on demand. Took the dealership's regional service manager for a ride, and he is aware of the issue. That information got communicated to GM, and his instruction was to not do anything to change the loaded application (configuration). I suspect GM is covering their tail, but cannot prove that. LOL

Haven't actually studied logs excessively. Table 15404 was modified in GM's update, and I'm suspecting that has something to do with it. It's been some YEARS since I've used HPT (tuning a 5.3L LM7, back in 2006-2007). With all these "newer" parameters, I don't know if I'm barking up the wrong tree, but am hoping this thread can help with resolving this ANNOYING scenario of timing being pulled. I'm attaching screenshots of the comparison log, showing what tables were modified. This update was applied to correct transmission "issues", according to GM.

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Its not table 15404 That's causing my issue and I doubt its yours either. I got rid of it by copying the high octane table from 3000 rpm and lower to the minimum spark table base and long term. #s 12701, 12793 This is under the engine side. It doesn't pull timing out anymore. Post up the tune before the reflash from Gm and the one after. Also if you have a log of what its doing id like to see it..


Regards,
Ryan

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FastV

Its not table 15404 That's causing my issue and I doubt its yours either. I got rid of it by copying the high octane table from 3000 rpm and lower to the minimum spark table base and long term. #s 12701, 12793 This is under the engine side. It doesn't pull timing out anymore. Post up the tune before the reflash from Gm and the one after. Also if you have a log of what its doing id like to see it..


Regards,
Ryan

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I hear ya... I looked to change those tables weeks ago, but those two weren't modified. My thoughts were to address what were actually modified by the dealership. That brought me over to 12792, and consequently looking at other modifications.

Have attached the two tune files in question. I've also snapped a screenshot of the differences in changes, compared "As-Found versus Dealer Re-flash". As for logs, the computer I am on doesn't have the log file. I'll provide something later. ;-)

Here's a recent log file. Look at 1m25s mark. That was one spot where timing was excessively pulled.

Not making any further changes, until my I/M Readiness Monitors are "complete". Past due for SMOG check (inspection sticker). I need that done, in order to pass, and reinstall window tint. Nothing super dark, but Louisiana is so damn strict, but not as bad as Cali. :P

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Originally Posted by 1badc10

Here's a recent log file. Look at 1m25s mark. That was one spot where timing was excessively pulled.

Not making any further changes, until my I/M Readiness Monitors are "complete". Past due for SMOG check (inspection sticker). I need that done, in order to pass, and reinstall window tint. Nothing super dark, but Louisiana is so damn strict, but not as bad as Cali. :P

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Baton Rouge, you're local to me. I'd love to take a look and see if we can get this figured out.

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Originally Posted by sevinn

Baton Rouge, you're local to me. I'd love to take a look and see if we can get this figured out.

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Actually, out of Prairieville, since I moved back from Texas. ;-)