2013 Audi Q5 3.0 ZF 8HP - odd behavior

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04-23-2019
tmoe

2013 Audi Q5 3.0 ZF 8HP - odd behavior

I'm running a dual pulley Q5 3.0 Pulley Ratio (PR) of 3.1 with following MVPI2 mods, TCM rev limit under general to 7500 from 6950, change max mode counter to 255 (max for my version of OS, not the 65,535 newer versions of the 8hp most Audi's have), changed the shift maps to shift at 7000 rpm's in Aggression 3 shift maps 3, 8, 13, 23, 28 and under TM general changed torque limit gear based for normal to 500 and stall to 500. Life was good, I was getting WOT shifting at 7000 in sport/manual mode and AMAX was working.

Well fast forward to a week ago and I installed with a slightly large crank pulley 179mm -> 189mm, (PR 3.28) I data logged iat's, timing, knock and boost 3rd gear pull, everything looked good. I went out and tried run from a stop through the gears and both first and second gear short shifted around 5200, I know in some cases if there's wheel spin the trans will short shift but I don't believe the wheels were spinning. Traction control was off in both cases.

My question: other than wheel spin is there something in the tcm that could cause this behavior? I've looked at what I can log and I don't see it, could it be that I've changed shift maps? I don't see how to log which aggression and shift id that you're using with scanner. Any thoughts on where I could take a look.

Thanks in advance for any insight into this.

Tom
04-24-2019
Steven@HPTuners

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmoe

I'm running a dual pulley Q5 3.0 Pulley Ratio (PR) of 3.1 with following MVPI2 mods, TCM rev limit under general to 7500 from 6950, change max mode counter to 255 (max for my version of OS, not the 65,535 newer versions of the 8hp most Audi's have), changed the shift maps to shift at 7000 rpm's in Aggression 3 shift maps 3, 8, 13, 23, 28 and under TM general changed torque limit gear based for normal to 500 and stall to 500. Life was good, I was getting WOT shifting at 7000 in sport/manual mode and AMAX was working.

Well fast forward to a week ago and I installed with a slightly large crank pulley 179mm -> 189mm, (PR 3.28) I data logged iat's, timing, knock and boost 3rd gear pull, everything looked good. I went out and tried run from a stop through the gears and both first and second gear short shifted around 5200, I know in some cases if there's wheel spin the trans will short shift but I don't believe the wheels were spinning. Traction control was off in both cases.

My question: other than wheel spin is there something in the tcm that could cause this behavior? I've looked at what I can log and I don't see it, could it be that I've changed shift maps? I don't see how to log which aggression and shift id that you're using with scanner. Any thoughts on where I could take a look.

Thanks in advance for any insight into this.

Tom

Tom,

Have you tried logging the Shift Source Base? That should show you if something outside of the Aggression maps were responsible for commanding the shift.
04-24-2019
tmoe

I'll log, here's what I was planning on logging but does the shift base id show which map you're using? at idle it just shows aggression. Thanks Tom

https://oi1365.photobucket.com/album...psaumj2fh7.png
04-24-2019
Steven@HPTuners

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmoe

I'll log, here's what I was planning on logging but does the shift base id show which map you're using? at idle it just shows aggression. Thanks Tom

Looks like Source Base is in your list. The Shift ID parameter will show the most heavily weighted table being used at the time the shift occurs. On some calibrations we also show the Upshift OSS and Downshift OSS currently being targetted by the TCM that might help narrow down things.
04-27-2019
Kaploww

Looks like someone’s running an E85 blend.
05-04-2019
tmoe

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaploww

Looks like someone’s running an E85 blend.

Yep - need to up it a bit after my last log and the 189 crank pulley I'm running.
05-04-2019
tmoe

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steven@HPTuners

Looks like Source Base is in your list. The Shift ID parameter will show the most heavily weighted table being used at the time the shift occurs. On some calibrations we also show the Upshift OSS and Downshift OSS currently being targetted by the TCM that might help narrow down things.

Steven - so I finally got time to log today - you know the weather in chicago hasn't been the greatest lately. How did you like those last 2 snow storms? :-)
When I look at the logs it shows I'm still using aggression but even though I have the shift id selected, its greyed out and nothing shows. So I'm not sure which map I'm using any thoughts on how I can find?
05-06-2019
Steven@HPTuners

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmoe

Steven - so I finally got time to log today - you know the weather in chicago hasn't been the greatest lately. How did you like those last 2 snow storms? :-)
When I look at the logs it shows I'm still using aggression but even though I have the shift id selected, its greyed out and nothing shows. So I'm not sure which map I'm using any thoughts on how I can find?

I'm not in the Chicago region, but I've heard ;)

That sounds like it believes the parameter is there but it errors during logging.
You could try doing a Repoll for Supported Parameters (in the vehicle menu of the scanner), and if that doesn't fix it, we may need to see if there are further issues. A ticket to [email protected] with an Infolog and the Debug.dat located in Documents/HP Tuners/Settings would be needed to investigate!
05-06-2019
tmoe

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steven@HPTuners

I'm not in the Chicago region, but I've heard ;)

That sounds like it believes the parameter is there but it errors during logging.
You could try doing a Repoll for Supported Parameters (in the vehicle menu of the scanner), and if that doesn't fix it, we may need to see if there are further issues. A ticket to [email protected] with an Infolog and the Debug.dat located in Documents/HP Tuners/Settings would be needed to investigate!

thanks, I submitted ticket after I tried repoll.
05-24-2019
tmoe

Quote:

Originally Posted by tmoe

thanks, I submitted ticket after I tried repoll.

Great support, they added shift id and driver to scanner for my TCM and now looking at the logs and they make a lot more sense; I can see the maps I need to modify. HP Tuners support staff - great job again!!
04-09-2021
rdmelton

I know this post is a couple of years old but I can not find much info on tuning a Q5. Is there a guide for TCM tuning for a Q5 ? This post sort of gives that info but was curious if there was something more complete.
04-09-2021
4wheels

Quote:

Originally Posted by rdmelton

I know this post is a couple of years old but I can not find much info on tuning a Q5. Is there a guide for TCM tuning for a Q5 ? This post sort of gives that info but was curious if there was something more complete.

Most of the info here is for Dodge vehicles, which also use the ZF8 trans and TCU. It's a complicated trans, so give it a good read to see if you "get" the concepts.

Changing basic stuff like shift RPM is easy, doing more complex stuff like modifying the shift characteristics & time gets trickier. NOTE: there's a stock SQ5 TCU tune posted here and that gives a pretty good indication of how to optimize shift pressures and timing.
04-11-2021
bb-tt

try reading these

https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...se-for-updates

https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...ight=downshift

https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...nverter-tuning