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Thread: Surging when coming to a stop

  1. #21
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    I did a comparison in the tune and it looks like the BRAF, BRAF ETC multiplier, along with the ETC scalar was changed. I'm not sure if it was all at once or not but if you are changing all of those at once, it will be really hard to dial in your Airflow. I would only change one at a time. I lowered your airflow based on your log. Looked like your idle timing was set at 18* and in the scanner it showed 16.7, and that was a short log. Would have went lower more than likely. That tells me that the ecm is pulling timing to keep your idle @ 900rpm. If your BRAF was too low, the scanner would show more than your commanded 18* @ idle. I didn't mess with anything but the BRAF and IDLE ADAPTIVE SPARK. See if that helps at all.

    Camaro SS3 Tune best 2 with speed o correctiontry -braf adaptive idle.hpt

    I should add, i am not a tuner.
    Last edited by LS ROB; 01-31-2023 at 09:39 PM.

  2. #22
    Advanced Tuner morepowerjoe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LS ROB View Post
    I did a comparison in the tune and it looks like the BRAF, BRAF ETC multiplier, along with the ETC scalar was changed. I'm not sure if it was all at once or not but if you are changing all of those at once, it will be really hard to dial in your Airflow. I would only change one at a time. I lowered your airflow based on your log. Looked like your idle timing was set at 18* and in the scanner it showed 16.7, and that was a short log. Would have went lower more than likely. That tells me that the ecm is pulling timing to keep your idle @ 900rpm. If your BRAF was too low, the scanner would show more than your commanded 18* @ idle. I didn't mess with anything but the BRAF and IDLE ADAPTIVE SPARK. See if that helps at all.

    Camaro SS3 Tune best 2 with speed o correctiontry -braf adaptive idle.hpt

    I should add, i am not a tuner.
    You took the tune that was reworked by reubone. That's not my current tune but I can see what you did and copy and paste it over to my current tune. Here is my current tune.

    Camaro SS3 best tune.hpt
    short run.hpl

    Thanks I'll try what you did this weekend when the weather is better here.

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  4. #24
    Advanced Tuner morepowerjoe's Avatar
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    Am I missing something in my scanner by not updating to the latest version because I haven't updated it since 2021.

  5. #25
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    There's updates to show monitors related to emissions and some other little things but nothing that would hinder your ability to see everything you need to see on your vehicle.

  6. #26
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    Its possible, but switching over timing tables is not difficult. Test out the changes to see if they positively effect your idle stability issues. If so, Change over what you like from your original tune and retest. Is this tuned to run on race gas or ethanol blend? I may have missed that part.

  7. #27
    Advanced Tuner morepowerjoe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LS ROB View Post
    The only thing you changed was the idle adaptive spark underspeed and underspeed in park, that's not even when I'm coming to a stop and you lowered my braf to the point where it won't even start. No cigar sir. Thanks though.

  8. #28
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    in that case, I would just add back in some BRAF until it starts in the 800-1000 range, then blend into the upper rpms. Just looked at the tune again and the scalar is 0'd out?? id put that back stock. Put the scalar back and see what happens with the scalar change only. If that dont work then you can try the above.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by morepowerjoe View Post
    The only thing you changed was the idle adaptive spark underspeed and underspeed in park, that's not even when I'm coming to a stop and you lowered my braf to the point where it won't even start. No cigar sir. Thanks though.
    Camaro SS3 Tune best 2 with speed o correctiontry (1).hpt

    Are you sure you loaded this one? I had changed more than just the timing for idle. If so Id like to see that data. No worries though

  10. #30
    Advanced Tuner morepowerjoe's Avatar
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    I'll have to wait until Friday when the weather is better here because it's 30* outside and everything is covered in ice.

  11. #31
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    Ok guys so I've got it running a lot better now. I returned the braf ect multi back to where the tuner had it and lowered the idle adapt spark control a little bit in gear and in coast. It now only surges when it's like below 40* outside and when it is fully warmed up it doesn't do it at all so, I guess living in Texas I can live with it for a while. lol
    I appreciate everyone help. Just for reference here's my current tune.

    Camaro SS3 best tune 2 test.hpt

  12. #32
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    I had a very similiar issue coming out of gear coasting to the lights in neutral the car would hunt. We replaced teh double row timing chain with a single row genuine GM one and the issue has gone away completely. Have also got a mate with the exact same problem and he is still running the Rollmaster doubel row timing chain. If you have one I suggest removing it.

  13. #33
    Advanced Tuner morepowerjoe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LS ROB View Post
    in that case, I would just add back in some BRAF until it starts in the 800-1000 range, then blend into the upper rpms. Just looked at the tune again and the scalar is 0'd out?? id put that back stock. Put the scalar back and see what happens with the scalar change only. If that dont work then you can try the above.
    Hey Rob just wanted to thank you for your recommendations on the idle adapt spark. It actually worked with my current braf settings. Thanks again.
    L99 A6 - DSS FX Forged Piston's, Eagle ESP L19 Rods, ARP Head and Main Studs, LS9 Head Gaskets, GPI SS3 VVT Camshaft, GM Performance Racing Lifters, CHE Trunnion Upgrade, TSP Chrome Molly Pushrods, BTR .660 Valve Springs, GM Hollow Intake Valves, Melling 10355HV Oil Pump, IR EGM-205 Oil Pan Baffle, CAI Intake, Fast LSXR Intake Manifold, Nick Williams 103 TB, ZL1 Pump, TSP 1 7/8" Longtubes with 3" TSP Exhaust, Mishimoto Oil Cooler, Tru Cool 40k Tranny Cooler, 3600 Circle D Converter

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by morepowerjoe View Post
    Hey Rob just wanted to thank you for your recommendations on the idle adapt spark. It actually worked with my current braf settings. Thanks again.
    BRAF setting can be a pain sometimes especially with different throttle bodies. Mine is really odd and takes a very small increase in g/s over stock. If I recall correctly, i think the scalar plays a role in that too which is why I originally suggested one change at a time. Glad to hear you are making some progress!

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by LS ROB View Post
    BRAF setting can be a pain sometimes especially with different throttle bodies. Mine is really odd and takes a very small increase in g/s over stock. If I recall correctly, i think the scalar plays a role in that too which is why I originally suggested one change at a time. Glad to hear you are making some progress!
    Yeah I actually returned my scalar back to stock for my NW 103mm since that seems to be the consensus among most post that I've read and based on your recommendations. My braf setting are still kinda funny but's the only way I can get it to start and not die.

    Camaro SS3 best tune.hpt
    L99 A6 - DSS FX Forged Piston's, Eagle ESP L19 Rods, ARP Head and Main Studs, LS9 Head Gaskets, GPI SS3 VVT Camshaft, GM Performance Racing Lifters, CHE Trunnion Upgrade, TSP Chrome Molly Pushrods, BTR .660 Valve Springs, GM Hollow Intake Valves, Melling 10355HV Oil Pump, IR EGM-205 Oil Pan Baffle, CAI Intake, Fast LSXR Intake Manifold, Nick Williams 103 TB, ZL1 Pump, TSP 1 7/8" Longtubes with 3" TSP Exhaust, Mishimoto Oil Cooler, Tru Cool 40k Tranny Cooler, 3600 Circle D Converter

  16. #36
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    got a recent log? you may want to take a look at the dynamic airflow tab. Are you trying to run a blended tune? maf & vve?
    Last edited by LS ROB; 03-02-2023 at 11:37 PM.

  17. #37
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    No I haven't even began to start on vve yet I think it is all still stock. Maybe you could tell me a couple things? Here is the last two logs with drastically different fuel trims with minor differences in maf settings. Also I forgot to check and make sure my wideband was logging so these are without the wb hooked up. One other thing I noticed is when I'm driving sometimes it will pull timing for not reason at all.

    Different logs without wb
    maf tune 5.hpl
    maf tune 6.hpl

    And here's one where it pulls timing for no reason @ 2:11:52
    maf tune 4.hpl

    Thanks
    L99 A6 - DSS FX Forged Piston's, Eagle ESP L19 Rods, ARP Head and Main Studs, LS9 Head Gaskets, GPI SS3 VVT Camshaft, GM Performance Racing Lifters, CHE Trunnion Upgrade, TSP Chrome Molly Pushrods, BTR .660 Valve Springs, GM Hollow Intake Valves, Melling 10355HV Oil Pump, IR EGM-205 Oil Pan Baffle, CAI Intake, Fast LSXR Intake Manifold, Nick Williams 103 TB, ZL1 Pump, TSP 1 7/8" Longtubes with 3" TSP Exhaust, Mishimoto Oil Cooler, Tru Cool 40k Tranny Cooler, 3600 Circle D Converter

  18. #38
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    To get you some more data to work with; add these to your channels and go for about 20 minutes of normal driving. If you flash in a change in the tune before logging, I'd recommend a longer driving time due to rich after flash. Are your injectors stock or did I miss that somewhere? Honestly, the tune looks like someone just went in changing stuff and if it didnt work, they changed something else and never put the first thing they changed back as it was. I think you would be better off to start with stock settings and work from there but ill try to help out where/when i can. The BRAF table needs some major attention. Your idle is set to 925 but from the log it idles around 1krpms and thats with the spark being cut 18* or so. Way too much airflow. I would suggest copying a stock BRAF table then add 3 g/s to get started. I think if you were to do that though, it may not work well since everything seems so far off. Stock injectors?

    Spark State
    Spark Torque Management Type
    Fuel Cut Torque Management Type
    ETC Torque Management Type
    Dynamic Airflow
    Volumetric Efficiency
    Mass Airflow Sensor State
    Mass Airflow Sensor
    Mass Airflow (SAE)
    Last edited by LS ROB; 03-03-2023 at 08:54 AM.

  19. #39
    Advanced Tuner morepowerjoe's Avatar
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    I made a 21 minute log but it won't upload for some reason. Too big?
    L99 A6 - DSS FX Forged Piston's, Eagle ESP L19 Rods, ARP Head and Main Studs, LS9 Head Gaskets, GPI SS3 VVT Camshaft, GM Performance Racing Lifters, CHE Trunnion Upgrade, TSP Chrome Molly Pushrods, BTR .660 Valve Springs, GM Hollow Intake Valves, Melling 10355HV Oil Pump, IR EGM-205 Oil Pan Baffle, CAI Intake, Fast LSXR Intake Manifold, Nick Williams 103 TB, ZL1 Pump, TSP 1 7/8" Longtubes with 3" TSP Exhaust, Mishimoto Oil Cooler, Tru Cool 40k Tranny Cooler, 3600 Circle D Converter

  20. #40
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    Shouldn't be. Ive been able to successfully upload 45min logs