E85 tuning

[cc-rider]

Curious if there is any good reading out there that anyone can point me towards regarding E85 tuning? I?ve finally got my rebuilt LS3 Camaro back on the road and tuned by a local tuner. Of course, couldn?t help but pirate my computer back and start to have a look and data log. I know the basics of E85?need a ton more fuel but can put more timing at it. Haven?t ever studied up on fueling. Target the same AFR? Go leaner or richer? Would like to just start to learn. Did a search and didn?t come up with much. Though I get that some trade secrets kept close to the vest. But if anyone can point me to some good reading and learning?would be much appreciated.

[5FDP]

Honestly there isn't much to it.

Do the basic setup for the E85 tables. Use the flex fuel stoich table. If your computer has a alcohol PE EQ ratio, set that up. I run leaner than when running pump gas. Like 12.4 on pump and 12.9 on E85. If you are turbo or supercharged, you can still run a little leaner just fine but your target air fuel ratio or lambda will obviously be different.

More timing can be used in most applications with E85 blends, there are flex fuel spark adder tables on many tune files. A dyno would be best to see what timing works the best and same with fueling but overall it's not real hard to dial things in.

With the stoich set and the sensor settings changed the computer will auto adjust the stoich ratio for you. You don't have to go in and just smack it with a ton of fuel right off the bat. If fueling was good before the E85 switch, it should still be pretty close with the sensor added.

[Josue Galban]

Curious if there is any good reading out there that anyone can point me towards regarding E85 tuning? I?ve finally got my rebuilt LS3 Camaro back on the road and tuned by a local tuner. Of course, couldn?t help but pirate my computer back and start to have a look and data log. I know the basics of E85?need a ton more fuel but can put more timing at it. Haven?t ever studied up on fueling. Target the same AFR? Go leaner or richer? Would like to just start to learn. Did a search and didn?t come up with much. Though I get that some trade secrets kept close to the vest. But if anyone can point me to some good reading and learning?would be much appreciated.

hi bro, mainly these cars really like spark advance a lot, the fuel mixture will depend on your location but for reference at sea level they like it a bit rich maybe a 12.2 AFR although this is relative all cars are different but since you run with good octane I guess you run full E85 or 50;50. I advise you to start by mounting a Flex fuel sensor if you have it, enable it and start working on it. If you are at sea level you could run with max 25* spark advance in WOT and look for a mix of 12.7;13.0 keep in mind that running always richer you will be much safer. any help let me know

[cc-rider]

Thanks fellas. Appreciate the comments. But note that I’m supercharged. PE enrich in the 12’s is not for me.

[cc-rider]

Honestly there isn't much to it.

Do the basic setup for the E85 tables. Use the flex fuel stoich table. If your computer has a alcohol PE EQ ratio, set that up. I run leaner than when running pump gas. Like 12.4 on pump and 12.9 on E85. If you are turbo or supercharged, you can still run a little leaner just fine but your target air fuel ratio or lambda will obviously be different.

More timing can be used in most applications with E85 blends, there are flex fuel spark adder tables on many tune files. A dyno would be best to see what timing works the best and same with fueling but overall it's not real hard to dial things in.

With the stoich set and the sensor settings changed the computer will auto adjust the stoich ratio for you. You don't have to go in and just smack it with a ton of fuel right off the bat. If fueling was good before the E85 switch, it should still be pretty close with the sensor added.

So pretty much target the same AFR either way? If supercharged and targeting say…11.5 afr…then same for E85? Or lean it out a bit?

[Josue Galban]

Thanks fellas. Appreciate the comments. But note that I’m supercharged. PE enrich in the 12’s is not for me.

ohh ok you are supercharged, how many psi? do not work with more than 18 spark advance this is a danger, your AFR can work well in 11.8 with E85 with regular you can use 11.5 to be safer it is preferable to lose a little more HP but run safe and avoid exploding

[5FDP]

You can run low 12's on E85 no problem on a boosted engine depending on what psi you are running.

[Josue Galban]

ohh ok you are supercharged, how many psi? do not work with more than 18 spark advance this is a danger, your AFR can work well in 11.8 with E85 with regular you can use 11.5 to be safer it is preferable to lose a little more HP but run safe and avoid exploding

no not with good fuel the best you can use and max is 11.8 with regular 11.5 is enough

[Josue Galban]

You can run low 12's on E85 no problem on a boosted engine depending on what psi you are running.

correct that will depend a lot also the psi are the ones that will tell you how much AFR and spark you can use

[sgod1100]

ohh ok you are supercharged, how many psi? do not work with more than 18 spark advance this is a danger, your AFR can work well in 11.8 with E85 with regular you can use 11.5 to be safer it is preferable to lose a little more HP but run safe and avoid exploding

18 deg on E seems extremely low and he will be leaving alot of power on the table. I've got a CTSV and most guys with these cars are running low to mid 20s on E

[NotSure]

Tune (and discuss) in lambda? 11.** is a good gasoline AFR for a boosted application?

[sgod1100]

Yeah with E there shouldn't be talk of an afr reading.....should be talking lambda reading and that's it

[edcmat-l1]

18 deg on E seems extremely low and he will be leaving alot of power on the table. I've got a CTSV and most guys with these cars are running low to mid 20s on E

How do you make that claim about 18 degrees seeming extremely low, when you have no idea the compression and/or boost level? The amount of timing the engine needs or will tolerate is as dependent on compression and boost as it is the fuel its running on. If he's stock LS3 compression, stock pistons and rings, 10+ PSI of boost, you're not gonna want much more than 18 degrees even on good E85. You can't compare an LSA to an LS3 the compression ratios are drastically different.

[sgod1100]

How do you make that claim about 18 degrees seeming extremely low, when you have no idea the compression and/or boost level? The amount of timing the engine needs or will tolerate is as dependent on compression and boost as it is the fuel its running on. If he's stock LS3 compression, stock pistons and rings, 10+ PSI of boost, you're not gonna want much more than 18 degrees even on good E85. You can't compare an LSA to an LS3 the compression ratios are drastically different.

well, ASSUming that he is referring to what's in his signature, his engine is anything but stock...

[edcmat-l1]

well, ASSUming that he is referring to what's in his signature, his engine is anything but stock...

Good point, I did not read his sig. But again, that's only one part of the equation. 18 degrees at 9:1 and 10 psi might be light but 9:1 and 18 psi is a little different.

[cc-rider]

I’m 9:1 compression and 10 psi of boost fellas. Right now…I’m 18 timing on pump gas. E85 is 24 degrees of timing. AFR is running at 12.3ish under boost. Which seems high to me. But it’s running well and no KR. And tuned by a well known tuner in the area. So I’m just trying to learn for myself a bit.

[JayRolla]

I’m 9:1 compression and 10 psi of boost fellas. Right now…I’m 18 timing on pump gas. E85 is 24 degrees of timing. AFR is running at 12.3ish under boost. Which seems high to me. But it’s running well and no KR. And tuned by a well known tuner in the area. So I’m just trying to learn for myself a bit.

You won't knock on E so can't judge off that. That is a bit lean. I would run .77-.79 EQ ratio. Safer and won't lose much if any power.

[Josue Galban]

Tune (and discuss) in lambda? 11.** is a good gasoline AFR for a boosted application?

It always depends on fuel quality but something like 93 octane with 11.5 AFR is fine, after using something like E85 you could get closer to 11.9 without risk

[Josue Galban]

How do you make that claim about 18 degrees seeming extremely low, when you have no idea the compression and/or boost level? The amount of timing the engine needs or will tolerate is as dependent on compression and boost as it is the fuel its running on. If he's stock LS3 compression, stock pistons and rings, 10+ PSI of boost, you're not gonna want much more than 18 degrees even on good E85. You can't compare an LSA to an LS3 the compression ratios are drastically different.

you are absolutely right on this

[Josue Galban]

I’m 9:1 compression and 10 psi of boost fellas. Right now…I’m 18 timing on pump gas. E85 is 24 degrees of timing. AFR is running at 12.3ish under boost. Which seems high to me. But it’s running well and no KR. And tuned by a well known tuner in the area. So I’m just trying to learn for myself a bit.

It will depend on your boost, but keep in mind that you are running pretty lean when it comes to forced induction, give it a little more copmfuel, how many psi are we talking about????