2016 Mustang GT MAP Sensor

[athlon2k2]

When I was installing the Roush Phase 2 Supercharger kit on my car there was an extra part that wasn't in the instructions. I called Roush and it was a MAP sensor they said was used to measure atmospheric pressure. I added the channel to VCM scanner and it looks like it is accurate.

I've been trying to add another MAP sensor to measure actual manifold pressure to dial in my speed density using the AC pressure sensor wires to read the sensor.

Does anyone know, if I'm using my own tune is the external MAP sensor for barometric pressure is still needed? Can I just connect that MAP sensor into the tee I made off the manifold and use that instead?

My assumption is the Roush strategy uses the external sensor or it's a F150 things and it isn't being used either way.

Thanks.

-Dustin

[smithspeed]

yes it's still used, max map vs bp and a couple of other things will still refer to it. on the 2016 I think it's slightly less sensitve then the 2018+ gen 3's, but it still does need to be there for a boosted application.

https://www.vmpperformance.com/Ford-...-Boost-and-IAT

[athlon2k2]

Thanks Smithspeed. If I?m looking at your link correctly it references F150 which I know they use MAP sensors for actually manifold pressure. I know NA mustangs only use MAF and calculate MAP from that.This sensor is just floating under the hood. It isn?t installed in the intake manifold.

[smithspeed]

Thanks Smithspeed. If I?m looking at your link correctly it references F150 which I know they use MAP sensors for actually manifold pressure. I know NA mustangs only use MAF and calculate MAP from that.This sensor is just floating under the hood. It isn?t installed in the intake manifold.

I think your correct the sensor is not required for the Mustang it just uses "MAP" values in certain tables. sorry for the confusion.

[Pistol_91]

MAP is inferred in mustangs.

[athlon2k2]

I guess I?m going to hook the MAP sensor into the line from the intake manifold and see what VCM scanner says. I?m assuming if things don?t start getting weird I?m ok to keep it that way. Thanks for the replies. Not sure why Roush sent me the MAP sensor. Maybe because it?s the same kit for the Mustang and the F150.

[Rob@HPTuners]

I'm not sure I'm understanding, but if you intend to feed an input intended for barometric pressure with manifold pressure, you are probably in for a bad time. Throttle control comes to mind

[Pistol_91]

It's possible... Call them and ask them. Mustangs don't have map sensors.

[Davem3261]

Does the roush kit use the stock mass airflow sensor on the intake? If it does the MAP value in the scanner is an inferred value as stated above. I thought that the roush kits used a custom OS that used a map sensor on a mustang.

[athlon2k2]

@Davem3262 My kit reused the stock mass airflow sensor. I ended up tapping the supplied MAP sensor into the manifold line. I'm now reading 26-141kpa ish. Everything seems to be ok but I'm not getting into boost much at all. I think I have a lot of work to do on my tune though.

@Pistol_91 Ford must have used a lot of the same parts between the F150 and the Mustang GT since the plug for the MAP sensor was there. I can't remember if it was connected to something before or not, but it sits right behind where the stock intake manifold was. I thought I also read the Ecoboost Mustangs use MAPs but this whole tuning thing has been like drinking from the firehose.

[Pistol_91]

Hahaha yeah it's tough brother. Mustangs have a MAF and infer MAP. Ecoboosts and f150s use a MAP sensor instead of MAF. If you already put the MAP sensor in, then it's not going to hurt anything. I would still use the MAF sensor though. But with a MAP sensor installed, you can tune Speed Density accurately.
You said you're using your tune right? What exactly does that mean? You're building a boosted tune from your old Stock file? Do you have a roush file?

[athlon2k2]

@Pistol_91 My only goal is to use the MAP sensor for tuning speed density. Honestly, I just started tuning because I can't find a good tuner here and my car won't go ready for emissions even though it was fine with the bolt-ons before the supercharger and original tune. I've been taking courses on Evans Performance to understand how the HP Tuners Mustang strategy works. It's a lot but I think I'm grasping most of it. He provided some template for a base tune but a lot of the FI stuff is missing. Probably not the best idea to start tuning on a FI car but here we are. I've done a lot of comparisons to the Roush tunes I've found online but to honest they don't make a lot of sense. Most of them aren't scaled for air load in some areas and they seem to pick and choose which mapped points they use. I thought about starting with a Roush tune and just adjusting my 02 delays for my headers and exhaust but my goal is to learn how to tune this car. Preferably without blowing my car up.

I've attached my last log. It's locked into MP14 to start SD tuning and I had to update the default baro to match my altitude. The tune is still pretty far off. I'm logging Manifold Absolute Pressure and comparing it to Calculated to find correction. If the MAP looks off to anyone please let me know.


drive after baro update to 30.hpl

[Pistol_91]

Post the tune file you're working on. I'll help you out best I can. I learned on my N/A car and learned enough to tune my now boosted car and have since tuned a few friends cars successfully.

[veeefour]

@Pistol_91 My only goal is to use the MAP sensor for tuning speed density. Honestly, I just started tuning because I can't find a good tuner here and my car won't go ready for emissions even though it was fine with the bolt-ons before the supercharger and original tune. I've been taking courses on Evans Performance to understand how the HP Tuners Mustang strategy works. It's a lot but I think I'm grasping most of it. He provided some template for a base tune but a lot of the FI stuff is missing. Probably not the best idea to start tuning on a FI car but here we are. I've done a lot of comparisons to the Roush tunes I've found online but to honest they don't make a lot of sense. Most of them aren't scaled for air load in some areas and they seem to pick and choose which mapped points they use. I thought about starting with a Roush tune and just adjusting my 02 delays for my headers and exhaust but my goal is to learn how to tune this car. Preferably without blowing my car up.

I've attached my last log. It's locked into MP14 to start SD tuning and I had to update the default baro to match my altitude. The tune is still pretty far off. I'm logging Manifold Absolute Pressure and comparing it to Calculated to find correction. If the MAP looks off to anyone please let me know.


drive after baro update to 30.hpl

I solved few issues of this nature - let me know if you want professional help.

[athlon2k2]

Thanks @Pistol_91. I think I still need to dial in my speed density in at higher MAP. I haven't had a chance to get a good log after installing the MAP sensor. Right now I'm locked in at MP14. So far I tuned the MAF, adjusted the 02 delay and did a couple baseline adjustments to MP14 Speed Density.

@veeefour thanks for the offer. I'm going to try to fight through this one but if I run into a wall I'll reach out.


16 Mustang GT PP MT - Emissions Tune - ltft disabled - locked into MP14.hpt
drive home from work with MAP installed.hpl

[athlon2k2]

Well I just wanted to circle back and say that the connector that the MAP was plugged into wasn't working. I'm pretty sure it for a barometric reading if enabled on some version of the coyote. Apparently the PID for calculated MAP and MAP are both calculated but aren't exactly the same. The whole time I was setting is bounce in and out of being perfect, so I assumed it was working. Also found out the MAP was a 1 bar. I ended up connecting it to the AC Pressure line to see how things looked below 100kpa. My speed density table for MP14 looks fine. I should have a 3-bar MAP here tomorrow so I can make sure things above 100kpa are dialed in but I'm not expecting any surprises.

[athlon2k2]

I got the 3 bar MAP hooked up. Is there a good way to see if my formula is accurate. I used the Bosch slope and offset and just adjust offset with the car on but not running to match what my local barometer was saying.

The sensor is a Bosch 0281006076 and this is the formula I'm using: ([7101.10]*65.882)-1.645