Swapping out complete tune ??

[cmf60]

I have been given the task of an LS1 engine trans swap into a 1960 GMC truck ... doner engine is out of a wrecked Australian Commodore (VZ) with DBW throttle body which was changed to a cable operated TB from an earlier model, due to not being given the throttle pedal, interface ... nor the wiring (cut off).
Aftermarket loom was used and had a no start issue which was eventually traced to all injectors being blocked with old fuel residue.

When seeking help here for the no start issue, a mention was made the the factory computer program will not contain the idle air control parameters and will need to be swapped for a program that does. The computer does contain the electronic hardware to drive the IAC and I found a stock tune in the depository of the prior model (VY) that used a cable TB .... so it should work with what I have.

My question is, are there any beginner "traps" to swapping out the entire program like this (am relatively new to HPT) ??
No doubt need to hand out some more credits ??
I was thinking maybe the change of VIN/serial numbers to one already in use might cause a problem ??
Any help or tips appreciated .... there is bound to be a few.

[gtstorey]

I’d suggest posting both tunes on here to ensure you are getting what you think you are.

[SSUte01]

Without seeing the files and just following the narrative, hopefully this saves you some churn . The VZ was controlled by the P59 (1MB) ECM and the the VY was P01 (512KB) so they are not the same hardware and are not interchangeable from a software perspective in terms of "swapping the entire program out".

Whilst VZ was DBW and VY was DBC, the few times I have come across applications where cable throttle requested using a VZ ECM, all OS/Service Numbers had the IAC drivers and were able to control an IAC motor by changing (reversing) the system options. Allegedly, not all P59 ECMs can, and I don't know if that is true of all the Commodore part/service numbers (limited run being 2005 in Aus makes me guess they were all the same, but not necessarily), but haven't heard/seen one yet that couldn't and you say yours is consistent with that. Been a long time since I have looked at an example of VZ DBC, but memory serves me, enough of the same code/tables are consistent with earlier OS. So, you can copy/paste in realistic values for IAC control and refine from there provided the system options are configured and the drivers present.

Agree that posting your tunes will yield you the best help from others

Hope that helps

[cmf60]

Thanks for the replies.
SSUte - I was told to check out whether the "B67U1" spot on the pcb of the ECM was populated or not .... apparently it is the driver for the IAC motor ?? Did not know there was a memory size change between VY and VX ECM's ..... though the tune files seem to be a similar size.
So does that mean I need to find a VY computer ... or are they "backwards compatible" (meaning you might be able to go VZ to VY ... but not the other way round) ??

Anyway here are the two tunes ...

[gametech]

Your "proposed tune" is indeed from a different type of computer. It is from a p01, and cannot be loaded into your current p59 computer. The only reason the file sizes seem so close to the same is the way HPT compresses them.

[cmf60]

Damn ....
Can anybody suggest a tune for the p59 that is for a DBC LS1/4L60 then ?
Finding a p01 to suit could be a problem down here ....

[gametech]

2004 gto was a DBC/p59 computer, and came with either 4l60 or t56. The same year Monaro should fit the bill perfectly.

[cmf60]

Thank you for that.
I read elsewhere on here some people claiming that you can successfully put a p01 tune on a p59 computer .... but I don't really want to burn up more credits to find out ....

I had a look in the tune depository for a 04 GTO or Monaro tune ... nothing there. I did find a "stock" tune posted in one of the forums ... but a quick look at it told me it has been messed with and there was many unpopulated tables. It might be fixable but beyond my pay grade to go thru it all.
So I have to ask ..... has anyone got an unmolested 04 GTO/Monaro tune they would like to share ??

[RDF1]

Ive got a tune for a 04 GTO with OS of 12587604.
But you cant load a P01 tune into a P59. It just dont work that way.
You can copy over all your settings tho.

[gametech]

Thank you for that.
I read elsewhere on here some people claiming that you can successfully put a p01 tune on a p59 computer .... but I don't really want to burn up more credits to find out ....

I had a look in the tune depository for a 04 GTO or Monaro tune ... nothing there. I did find a "stock" tune posted in one of the forums ... but a quick look at it told me it has been messed with and there was many unpopulated tables. It might be fixable but beyond my pay grade to go thru it all.
So I have to ask ..... has anyone got an unmolested 04 GTO/Monaro tune they would like to share ??

The repository has 1 file each of m6 and a4 2004 gto. I know the m6 file is good, but I have not personally looked over the a4 file.

[SSUte01]

I should apologise for making some assumptions with some the terminology used. Not sure if GM did something with the 04 Monaro when converted to LHD to make it a GTO, but the 04 Monaro was still P01 and cable in Aus. In any case, my point, albeit not well articulated, is that VZ P59s (at least the ones I have seen used for that application) have the drivers and ability for drive by cable i.e they can control an IAC natively without changing OS. Just need to configure the system options as such. I don't know the internals of the boards well enough to know what B67U1 is, I can only assume a physical discriminator that IAC control possible.

[gametech]

I should apologise for making some assumptions with some the terminology used. Not sure if GM did something with the 04 Monaro when converted to LHD to make it a GTO, but the 04 Monaro was still P01 and cable in Aus. In any case, my point, albeit not well articulated, is that VZ P59s (at least the ones I have seen used for that application) have the drivers and ability for drive by cable i.e they can control an IAC natively without changing OS. Just need to configure the system options as such. I don't know the internals of the boards well enough to know what B67U1 is, I can only assume a physical discriminator that IAC control possible.

The 2004 gto was indeed a drive by cable p59 computer. They switched to DBW for 2005-6 with the ls2 engine and e40 computer. If you want more detail on converting a non-iac driver computer to have the iac driver, username Twenglish1 on the pcmhacking forums has a thread with pictures and a link to the needed driver circuit.

[SSUte01]

The 2004 gto was indeed a drive by cable p59 computer. They switched to DBW for 2005-6 with the ls2 engine and e40 computer. If you want more detail on converting a non-iac driver computer to have the iac driver, username Twenglish1 on the pcmhacking forums has a thread with pictures and a link to the needed driver circuit.

Not disputing the 04 GTO configuration, just saying that the 04 Monaro was still P01 and the 05 Monaro was P59 and LS1, whereas the US market was LS2/E40 as you said. The only E40/LS2 combo was reserved for the ?higher spec? HSV GTO

[gametech]

Not disputing the 04 GTO configuration, just saying that the 04 Monaro was still P01 and the 05 Monaro was P59 and LS1, whereas the US market was LS2/E40 as you said. The only E40/LS2 combo was reserved for the ?higher spec? HSV GTO

They did something funny with our anti theft programming on the gto as well, which I am lead to believe is more like (but not exactly like) the HSV security programming. It made it so that for a few years we could not get replacement keyfobs at all until an aftermarket company finally started making compatible ones. The aftermarket ones for the Aussie cars would not program to the U.S. spec cars. Either way, the point was that a 2004 gto file will work what you need in a p59 computer, and if you have a p59 lacking the IAC driver, there is a fix for that as well.

[cmf60]

In any case, my point, albeit not well articulated, is that VZ P59s (at least the ones I have seen used for that application) have the drivers and ability for drive by cable i.e they can control an IAC natively without changing OS. Just need to configure the system options as such.

You wouldn't happen to know which system options to configure ?? Sounds like its atleast worth a try.

[cmf60]

Ive got a tune for a 04 GTO with OS of 12587604.
But you cant load a P01 tune into a P59. It just dont work that way.
You can copy over all your settings tho.

I stumbled onto this site today - https://lt1swap.com/cable_conversion.htm
From the looks of that information the OS of 12583659 is the "common" computer used with 04 GTO ?? Obviously its not the only one used as yours is 12587604 .... the one here is 12583659.
I guess if all else fails, it could be worth a try at copying over all the settings .... but I'm thinking wouldn't it need the actual programmed coding contained within the operating system too ??
Thats something you can't see ... but maybe, like SSUte mentions above .... that can be enabled in system options.

[gametech]

12587604 is the only OS I have ever seen in any stock 2004 gto file. I too have seen that 12583659 number posted, and that is a hardware number, not an OS.

[SSUte01]

you wouldn't happen to know which system options to configure ?? Sounds like its atleast worth a try.

ecm 18150

SysOptions.PNG

[cmf60]

I figured that meant Electronic Throttle Control and had it disabled. I did try turning it back on today but there was no change. I also tried changing the IAC position using the controls in the VCM Scanner program without success. So its looking like the instructions are not in the OS .... I think.

I did find a discrepancy when looking thru the P59 vs P01 ECM pinouts though .... pins 52 and 53 on the P59 connector 2 (both labeled 02s Heater Low Control) ... on the P01 are labeled Generator F Terminal and Spark Retard Signal. I am picking the aftermarket loom is probably pinned for a P01 and I do get a 02 heater error .... which probably explains why

[cmf60]

Ok, am back onto this problem after other distractions. I have tried looking locally for a VY ECM with no luck .... just a VX but they wanted drug money for it ... and adding on the extra credits on top of that to disable the VATS didn't make much sense.
Back the the depository I go and this time I did find the 04 GTO tune mentioned above (look under Pontiac dummy ) and downloaded it.

As far as I can tell, it doesn't look to have any drastic differences to what I have ... tune wise, apart from some of the torque management settings and think its worth a try.
Would it be possible for one of you experienced guys to check it out for any "traps" and also confirm it is for a P59 ECM.
Have no idea on how to do that, but it would be handy to know ??

Thanks again for your help.