is there more left?

[02GTP]

just posting up my tune and hopefully some experienced people can look at it and see what i should change if any. the spark tables show 32-33* but it only runs 29*. i guess you have to tell it 2-3 more degrees than desired to get it. a/f ratio is perfect at 12.7 to 12.8 to one WOT. thanks agian for looking!

[mustangjonGT]

What mods do you have in the vehicle? Any 1/4 mile et's?

[02GTP]

no track times yet. ive only had the car less than 3 months. plan on going very soon though. but i have intake, delete plates, pullies, off road h-pipe, axle back and 4.10's.

[RWTD]

#1: You also need to disable "Flange Temp Control" and "O2 Sens Temp Control". They work identical to COT (Cat Temp Control).

#2: Set OL Delay Ramp to 0.1, and set OL Delay Blend Ramp to 0.50. This will get you into OL as quickly as possible once you exceed the values in the "OL Fuel TPS Thresh" function, otherwise there will be a transition delay.

#3: Your MAF transfer is obviously off. Why do I say this? Because your "Fuel Base" Table is set to 0.850 (14.64 stoich * 0.85 = 12.444 AFR) up to 3000 rpms and 0.820 (14.64 stoich * 0.82 = 12.0048 AFR) above that. This is what the pcm is "Commanding", yet your Actual AFR is 12.7 to 12.8 (based on what you said). See what I mean?

So, set both the 0.85 and 0.82 values in the "Fuel Base" table to 0.8743169, which is exactly 12.8 AFR when you do the math (12.8 Desired / 14.64 stoich = 0.87431693989071038251366120218579), then redial in your MAF transfer until your Commanded AFR = your Actual AFR.

Furthermore, this will get your estimated calculated Load correct, which all the main spark tables are based on Load (and RPM).

Now, to specifically answer your question:

the spark tables show 32-33* but it only runs 29*. i guess you have to tell it 2-3 more degrees than desired to get it. a/f ratio is perfect at 12.7 to 12.8 to one WOT. thanks agian for looking!

This is because HPT is missing yet another parameter (on top of the tons they are already missing) that lowers MBT Spark based on Commanded AFR from the "Fuel Base" table. It works like this:

Lambda	Advance
1.300	10.000
1.000	 0.000
0.920	-3.300
0.890	-3.700
0.870	-3.900
0.820	-4.400
0.750	-2.500

Since "MBT Spark" takes precedence in regards to maximum spark allowed, then regardless of what you set your "Borderline Knock" table to, spark will never exceed MBT.

There's an easy way around this, however (no, it's not the "correct" way, but it'll get you to where you need to be, for now). Set the "MBT Spark" table to approx. 4 degrees above your "Borderline Knock" table, then dial in the "Borderline Knock" table to be exactly what you want the Actual spark to be, keeping in mind that adders, such as IAT and ECT, can curtail back spark as needed for safety.

Last, I see that you already raised your "Combustion Pressure Limit" table up some. Go ahead and max this table out to 63.5, otherwise this could inhibit Desired spark, as well. As for the "Octane Plug Adder" table, this table has no effect on your tuning, UNLESS the dealer turns it on at the dealership. Ford gives this option to the dealer if the customer continues to complain of spark knock.

In the case of Rear O2 Delete, I'd also set "O2 Rear Config" to "0", and then P0420 and P0430 to off. What you already did previously should be fine (including disabling the OBD2 Test/MIL for them under "Engine Diagnostics, OBD", which will prevent the local testing station from failing you, lol).

[02GTP]

thanks for all the info. ive already changed all that stuff. just waiting to load it till i can borrow a wideband. im assuming im going to have to add to the maf table. cause allthough it runs a perfect a/f now but its commanding a richer mixutre. so when i command the new number of .87 its commanding leaner so ill have to add to keep it from leaning out. ill start out by adding 8%. am i on the right track here?

[RWTD]

Yeuppers, you got it, bud. Start at the cell that is actually 1 lower than the lowest one you record for WOT. Basically, do a pull from no higher than 1500 rpms, this way you can get a nice amount of range and data.

[02GTP]

hey thanks again man. u have been so helpful with all of my questions. RWTD FTW!!

btw, one more question not related to this subject. what gains have you seen with long tubes? ive searched and searched but come up with conflicting results everywhere i go. i see people claim 25whp with a retune and ive seen people get no more than 8whp anywhere in the rpm range. like i said i pretty much have everyother bolt on and could use a bit more power but dont have the money for boost. i just dont wanna spend $500-700 for less than 10hp, thanks.

[RWTD]

Absolutely ZERO gains! Don't waste your money. The stock manifolds are good to well over 500 rwhp.

[02GTP]

lol u just keep saving me money. thanks. while we are on the subject, how about aluminum driveshafts. want one but again very expensive for probably not a lot of gain. and to be honest im more concerned about trap speed than i am with e.t. will the alum. ds. help with that?

[RWTD]

If N/A keep you stocker. I'd HIGHLY recommend upgrading once you go forced induction, or you'll prolly break it in half one day.

[02GTP]

i got the new tune all settled. im very happy. when scanning, the numbers appeared smoother. when i go WOT, the timing and a/f are now constant. the timing would jump around a degree or so but now its just perfect, thanks again.

[michael55123]

Hate to bring up a dead thread, but is the missing table now in HP Tuners? I see a Spark Correction Lamda Spark, in my 2.23, is this something different?

[michael55123]

After further tinkering, it does not appear to be the same table. Still losing an invisible ~3 degrees somewhere.

[BlueStreak]

you could be hitting kr as well since you have copied your timing tables from bordeline knock to the mtb table. i have a pretty decent timing set up on mine. it holds 30* pretty well. but i 0 out all the iat and ect tables. i did that to make sure it was doing what i was calling for. to get rid of that 3-4 degrees that disappears, you add 4* over your borderline knock from say 3000rpm and 70%tps to 6000rpm and 100%tps on the mbt table. im going back and putting the ect and iat stuff back in today and ill post it up so you guys can look. im also workin on the maf curve still. i just figured out how to log maf voltage last night.

[BlueStreak]

Theres the tune I have been piddling with. im still in process of tweeking maf. im around +-5 right now and it hits 12.6-12.9 wot. im calling 12.8. if there is anything you guys recommend, let me know. the car had tunable inductions intake, jba equal lengths, o/r x-pipe, slp axle-back, and 4.10s. it made 312whp and 323wtq with stock timing curve and gutted factory cats. surely 5 more * and a nice x-pipe will get it to 325. thats the goal.

[michael55123]

BlueStreak, I have all the adders removed for IAT, Spark Lamda under 1.0, and ECT removed as well. It's very VERY VERY, annoying not to be able to log KR!!!! It may very well be KR, as now that I command 28, it holds 27.5 dead on through the run, why 27.5, I have no idea. I'm thinking of going back to a stock tune, and just adding a few degrees of timing to the BKT, and the MBT table to get there I need to be, instead of copying the entire MBT tables over the BKT table. My MAF is pretty dead on, around +-3, though at WOT it's gotta be off, as I'm commanding 12.5 and seeing 12.0-12.3. I'm also on E10 93 around here, hence the commanding 12.5

[BlueStreak]

im on e10 93 as well. try the timing that i have in mine. im happy with them. just use the compare feature. i have the all the adders and stuff plugged back in and it still is at 30*. i also have a 180 t-stat. if you look at the tables, you will see where borderline knock im calling for 30 and mtb i call 34. it hits 30 just about every time.

[BlueStreak]

and to get your maf right, if you command 12.5 and get 12.0, divide 12.0 by 12.5. it equals .96. now multiply that by where ya need on the maf vs. voltage table.