Fuel Tables UNLOCKED

[fr0stb1t3]

Unfortunately there's no standalone that works with direct injection yet.

You guys want to know your best bet at getting this shit unlocked? Pull the binary yourself and find it and then spoon feed it to HPT support. Thats how a lot of stuff for the v8's got unlocked, like lean cruise tuning and the ability to switch from america to Australia in the pcm.

Yes there is, it will cost in excess of $13k though. Bosch makes an aftermarket version of the LNF PCM with a lot of nifty features (launch control, NLS, etc.). I contacted the U.S. distributor and they said the ECU itself would be $4k, the injector driver will cost $3200, engineering/setup another $4000, and then calibration which they didn't have a price for (I gurantee it's high though). It also auto blips the throttle on downshifts :P

http://www.bosch-motorsport.de/pdf/e...MS_4_Sport.pdf

[Leafy]

Yes there is, it will cost in excess of $13k though. Bosch makes an aftermarket version of the LNF PCM with a lot of nifty features (launch control, NLS, etc.). I contacted the U.S. distributor and they said the ECU itself would be $4k, the injector driver will cost $3200, engineering/setup another $4000, and then calibration which they didn't have a price for (I gurantee it's high though). It also auto blips the throttle on downshifts :P

http://www.bosch-motorsport.de/pdf/e...MS_4_Sport.pdf

Why is it alpha-n? shouldnt it be maf with speed density backup?

[mkriebs]

First off, as I have said quite a few times before, anyone looking for massive power, talk to Haltech. Pretty sure they have a standalone that can power DI, if not, I know damn well they can make it.

Second, anyone with goals less than 550whp, please, stand aside. We have found the limits of the stock fuel system, stock pressure, stock motor, EVERYTHING stock (even the valve springs), AND on 93 octane, ONE A MUSTANG DYNO. 442whp is the limit to stock fuel pressure. If you know how to tune the car, you can replicate it. Some people find this hard to believe (*cough* ZZP), but this car has been running this for a yr now. Granted, its OUT of fuel at this point, but it still runs like a champ.

So, that said, if you can't make over 400whp with stock fuel pressure, maybe its time to hang up the ol' cable and call it a day?

I don't see many people shooting for over 450 whp, but to those people... keep pushing for this.

[fr0stb1t3]

First off, as I have said quite a few times before, anyone looking for massive power, talk to Haltech. Pretty sure they have a standalone that can power DI, if not, I know damn well they can make it.

Second, anyone with goals less than 550whp, please, stand aside. We have found the limits of the stock fuel system, stock pressure, stock motor, EVERYTHING stock (even the valve springs), AND on 93 octane, ONE A MUSTANG DYNO. 442whp is the limit to stock fuel pressure. If you know how to tune the car, you can replicate it. Some people find this hard to believe (*cough* ZZP), but this car has been running this for a yr now. Granted, its OUT of fuel at this point, but it still runs like a champ.

So, that said, if you can't make over 400whp with stock fuel pressure, maybe its time to hang up the ol' cable and call it a day?

I don't see many people shooting for over 450 whp, but to those people... keep pushing for this.

What turbo was that and at what RPM?

[mkriebs]

PTE 5557 and stock redline. Peak power is at 5600 rpm, but the graph levels for the most part at 4600 ish.

[sky888]

How about the GT3582r of my friend Anthony with the Sky Redline that WERKS tuned and built?

He has built internals.......w/ water/meth spray........pump gas.........

it dynoed at around 440whp as well.

did you guys use Trifecta overlapped with HPtuner on that, to raise the fuel pressure to 2800psi?

or is he purely HPtuned? and the fuel pressure wasn't raised to 2800psi?

[mkriebs]

How about the GT3582r of my friend Anthony with the Sky Redline that WERKS tuned and built?

He has built internals.......w/ water/meth spray........pump gas.........

it dynoed at around 440whp as well.

did you guys use Trifecta overlapped with HPtuner on that, to raise the fuel pressure to 2800psi?

or is he purely HPtuned? and the fuel pressure wasn't raised to 2800psi?

Yes, you're right. For some reason I always forget about this one, haha. This was purely HPT tuned too. We don't do any of the TF stuff. One bad experience (or lack of an experience, more like) was enough to ruin it. Maybe if he would release an end user interface we would consider it again, but until we don't have to rely on someone else we probably won't be using it.

I think out new EFR line will definitely be pushing the stock systems. I think they will be a pair made in heaven, really.

[sky888]

have you guys tested the new products WERKS released?
the low pressure fuel pump that can handle 500hp and the other one 700hp?


will that help with the fueling issues.........even if you are only using pure HPT software? and no TF stuff?

I wonder if the stock fuel system will be pushed even farther just by these lpfp upgrades?

[Kelu]

First off, as I have said quite a few times before, anyone looking for massive power, talk to Haltech. Pretty sure they have a standalone that can power DI, if not, I know damn well they can make it

Again you don't know what are you talking about.

Haltech has no standalone for DI and doing one as custom order would cost more than the car itself.

P.S. Here you can't delete my posts Mister "Cobalt and Kappa manifolds are different 100%"

[Leafy]

I take it that the lnf doesnt actually sense the high pressure fuel pressure. If you were to increase the low pressure fuel pressure then you should increase the high pressure fuel pressure. If the pump setup works they way I think it does.

[Iam Broke]

It measures it in the fuel rail. There is a sensor next to #1 injector farthest from the HPFP. I haven't been able to log it though. There is a fuel pressure PID in the table, but it is non-functional for me.

I've seen logs of it in EFI Live posted elsewhere though.

[Leafy]

hmmm... Possible to fake this sensor with a potentiometer.

[Iam Broke]

You could keep from popping the P0087 and risk blowing your engine I suppose when the pressure dropped to critical levels when you were faking it out. I'm pretty sure it's closed loop pressure control so anything you do to the sensor feedback into the ECU is going to affect pump output pressure. Better to use another alternative like a layer tune with the pressure setpoint raised or the injector window altered to get more fuel. That's not something HPT currently supports though.

[Jaxon]

I wonder how the rpd displays fuel pressure but cant be logged...

[Iam Broke]

Well, I don't have an RPD in my '08, maybe you can log it. There is a fuel pressure PID in the table but IDK which one it is and it wouldn't do anything on mine when I tried it last year. Could be that HPT doesn't support the PID? Try it.

[Jaxon]

Ill have to check it out next time I log if I remember.

[mkriebs]

RPD runs through a different box. Not sure if the PID is at the wrong HEX address through HPT or what, because I have never been able to log it. Would be interesting if we could trick the sensor with a pot., but like Tom said, not very reliable, and not worth risking an engine failure over.

Like I said though... not worth it for the guys that aren't looking for more than 420-450whp (Mustang dyno numbers).

If someone was really eager... a standalone does exist, and a Motec will work, it just takes slight modification, as will the Haltech and AEM units. But, people are too stuck on OEM ECU control (which I don't blame them for). Until someone wants to exceed 600whp, I don't see a need for a standalone, and I haven't seem many people willing to go past 600whp. Also a standalone GDI injector controller exists. Which means it would be half the cost of an EMS, and we could control everything with the ECU minus the injectors.

The thing with a standalone EMS is that it controls the engine in a very 2 dimensional way, sort of. It cuts out all the BS, and makes the engine run. The engine will lose compensations for drastic weather changes, and driveability may suffer in the end. But, it is the easiest and safest way to make massive power. With all the underlying tables in an OEM ECM, limiters, compensations tables, and the like... end power is harder to attain, and usually at a lower point. When you cut all that bull then it lets the engine do EXACTLY what the computer tells it to, no compensation, its all cut and dry.

Yes install costs are high and tuning costs will be high, and finding someone that wants to modify the EMS tables to work on a DI car is going to be extremely hard to do, if you want more than 600whp, cough up the cash. Otherwise, I think we have all the solutions we need, or the solutions are in the not so distant future.

[Chris@HPTuners]

http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=33449

[mkriebs]

<3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3

[rnjmur]

http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showthread.php?t=33449

Hurrah!