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Thread: Can LNF knock sensors be seen independantly

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    Can LNF knock sensors be seen independantly

    A customer of mine is having some serious false knock issues, since I cant connect to a LNF at the moment (mine is apart) can someone look while connected to their LNF to see if knock sensors 1/2 and 3/4 be seen independantly?
    It will greatly help us diagnose which one is going crazy.
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  2. #2
    Senior Tuner Iam Broke's Avatar
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    Here's the Knock PID's listed in the scanner. Looks like you can see all of them independently.
    '12 Camaro T3 2SS/RS LS3 M6, SLP TVS 2300, Flex Fuel

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    Sweet, much appreciated!
    Me love boost long time.

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    Added individual KR meters. See screenshot. Now, to find which one is giving us the bird

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    Quote Originally Posted by XXL View Post
    Added individual KR meters. See screenshot. Now, to find which one is giving us the bird
    Last time I tried to set mine up like that it broke something in windows and I had to reinstall Windows to get HPT working again. I dont remember exactly what it was. I think it said something about Microsoft visual blah blah... Stopped Responding everytime I started up the Scanner. That was with Vistax64 btw.

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    I heard over at landover baptist church that windows vista is the devil!
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    I added the individual KR PIDs as seen in the screenshot above. This evening I had a chance to drive the car. No workie. So, did I do something wrong in what appears to be an absurdly simple task of creating them? Or are they dead?

    Here's what I did...

    1. In existing config file, right-click on empty space and choose Add | Meter
    2. On newly created meter, right-click and choose Properties
    3. Click to add PID, and browse PID list | Dnbind | Retard
    4. Double-click KR1
    5. Give it a name in the Label field
    6. Size as needed
    7. Click "up arrow" on toolbar to commit (who designed this User Interface???!!!)
    8. Rinse and repeat for KR's 2, 3, and 4


    Note: Default Max and Min values in this PID don't make any sense. 1) the default max = 45 and min = -45. Aside from 45 sounding just a tad too high to expect (as in... maybe 40 too high), why would there ever be a negative value in the first place (or, depending on your personal logic, vice versa... in other words, when would we ever expect to see "KA"?).

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    If it isnt being recorded in the "table display" screen the rest of them, histogram, chart etc will be dead Ken.
    Give that a swappin and retry.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baldturbofreak.com View Post
    If it isnt being recorded in the "table display" screen the rest of them, histogram, chart etc will be dead Ken.
    Give that a swappin and retry.
    I don't understand what you are asking me to do.

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    open up the table (primary), right next to the save button on the toolbar.
    erase 4 slots that we arnt using. Then right click, hit "insert" and add the 4 knock cyl to the primary table.
    Then they will show up in the "guages" screen.
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    Individual KRs are gone. I'm in the house, and have the MPVI plugged and lit up. Drivers are installed and the OS thinks they're working. This is the system where I created the first config file that I added the KR1-4's to the other day (see screenshot above). That was all done in the "gauge" UI itself. Per BTF's post and a couple of text messages back and forth, I did the following--

    1. open the Table (primary)
    2. delete 4 "<unsupported parameter>" entries
    3. right-click on newly empty field, and choose Add
    4. On Insert PIDs window, expand PID List | Engine | Retard


    Individual KR's are no longer present. I only have what's listed in the screenshot attached below. Same MPVI, same license, same credits, same car, same ECM, same me, same "WTF???" look on my face.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baldturbofreak.com View Post
    A customer of mine is having some serious false knock issues, since I cant connect to a LNF at the moment (mine is apart) can someone look while connected to their LNF to see if knock sensors 1/2 and 3/4 be seen independantly?
    It will greatly help us diagnose which one is going crazy.
    Quote Originally Posted by Iam Broke View Post
    Here's the Knock PID's listed in the scanner. Looks like you can see all of them independently.
    Is the presence (or now disappearance per my previous post) of 4 separate KR PIDs meant to infer that there are actually 4 separate physical knock sensors on the motor? Or, as I believe, there are only 2 physical sensors on the motor... and if true, what are supposed to be expecting to see in 4 distinct KR PIDs? If cyl 1 is banging like Niel Pert, and the "1/2 sensor hears it," is HPT expecting that the single sensor will decide WHICH cyl has the knock, and report it up through KR1? Or are we going to see a single message coming up, and both KR1 and KR2, while distinct in the tables, will both report the same thing? Or is the fact that there are 4 KRs and only 2 sensors an indicator that the HPT code has no idea what's really going on and so this whole stream of data cannot be trusted?

    Jeebus cripes... I just want my POS car to ficking run right.

  13. #13
    Senior Tuner Iam Broke's Avatar
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    I added the 4 individual sensors to my cfg table & gauge display, but won't have the chance to try it until Monday. I loaded a very aggressive timing tune so I expect to see a lot of KR.
    I haven't tried to log all 4 before, sorry.
    '12 Camaro T3 2SS/RS LS3 M6, SLP TVS 2300, Flex Fuel

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    Quote Originally Posted by XXL View Post
    Is the presence (or now disappearance per my previous post) of 4 separate KR PIDs meant to infer that there are actually 4 separate physical knock sensors on the motor? Or, as I believe, there are only 2 physical sensors on the motor... and if true, what are supposed to be expecting to see in 4 distinct KR PIDs? If cyl 1 is banging like Niel Pert, and the "1/2 sensor hears it," is HPT expecting that the single sensor will decide WHICH cyl has the knock, and report it up through KR1? Or are we going to see a single message coming up, and both KR1 and KR2, while distinct in the tables, will both report the same thing? Or is the fact that there are 4 KRs and only 2 sensors an indicator that the HPT code has no idea what's really going on and so this whole stream of data cannot be trusted?

    Jeebus cripes... I just want my POS car to ficking run right.
    It does so by correlating the knock sensor with crank/cam position withing ht engine cycle
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iam Broke View Post
    I added the 4 individual sensors to my cfg table & gauge display, but won't have the chance to try it until Monday. I loaded a very aggressive timing tune so I expect to see a lot of KR.
    I haven't tried to log all 4 before, sorry.
    Would you be willing to share the cfg file?

  16. #16
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    Sure, but you'll prob have to add a custom pid or two to make everything work.
    It's set up for a 1024x600 netbook so it may be a bit small.
    '12 Camaro T3 2SS/RS LS3 M6, SLP TVS 2300, Flex Fuel

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    Thanks. I'll give it a try tomorrow. For now, I'm just trying to pinpoint some excessively high knock (like maybe a bad sensor).

  18. #18
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    XXL,
    I logged mine today with the config posted here and it def sees all 4 cyl KR independently. I had to add total KR and knock retard back in so all my histograms work. Here's the latest cfg file with all 6 knock pid's.
    '12 Camaro T3 2SS/RS LS3 M6, SLP TVS 2300, Flex Fuel

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    Well, you beat me to it. I got sidetracked today. I'll try your 6-meter version on my way to work tomorrow. Thanks!

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iam Broke View Post
    XXL,
    I logged mine today with the config posted here and it def sees all 4 cyl KR independently. I had to add total KR and knock retard back in so all my histograms work. Here's the latest cfg file with all 6 knock pid's.
    Just dl'd the one you posted immediately above. I'm only seeing the KR1-4. Was this the one you meant to post?