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Thread: Idle Tuning How-To & Guide (w/pictures)

  1. #121
    I try to load the .cfg file and it says that the file is from an old version and may not work. Is the Idle airflow desired table supposed to be one cell?

  2. #122
    These pics are not working on my end. Anyone else having issues?
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  3. #123
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    Guys I am new to tuning and am having issues with hard starts. I have a 5.3 with a GM Hot cam in it. The motor is in a C10. It seems to take a long time while cranking to get the truck to get up in RPM and start idling. I have read and followed the tread as much as I can. The truck will idle one started. He is the latest log and tune. I hope this is the correct info needed. Thanks for the help
    Attached Files Attached Files

  4. #124
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    Quote Originally Posted by amr84ss View Post
    Guys I am new to tuning and am having issues with hard starts. I have a 5.3 with a GM Hot cam in it. The motor is in a C10. It seems to take a long time while cranking to get the truck to get up in RPM and start idling. I have read and followed the tread as much as I can. The truck will idle one started. He is the latest log and tune. I hope this is the correct info needed. Thanks for the help
    your startup airflow instantly goes away upon startup.
    1997 30th SS. Torqhead 24x, TFS heads, 223/235 cam, 4l80e, S60 D1SC 14psi

  5. #125
    For new(er) tuners check out some of my guides on this stuff. I put a text version of the IAC tuning procedure a few years back, but I since changed my name. Videos are a lot easier to reference than typing. I have guides on most of the common stuff, like idle, VE, IAC, etc. The idea is for new tuners to teach themselves and learn through a little experience. Tunes vary so greatly, that it's easier to just focus on the basics.

    Guides are in my signature. Feel free to check them out. Also have some tricks and some more advanced physics concepts for the guys that want to know more about what they are really doing when adjusting "x" value. I feel it's more important to know why behind something rather than the "what" because that is easily forgotten. If you know an engine creates more torque at higher spark values, depending on compression, etc, then you know how to get it to stop hanging, bucking, surging, and so forth. Hence my approach to teaching the why behind the values.

    I sincerely hope they help. I have researched this stuff for way too long and experimented with all kinds of things not to share at least some of what is in my head lol. Trust me, most of y'all don't want the rest that's in there lol.

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChopperDoc View Post
    For new(er) tuners check out some of my guides on this stuff. I put a text version of the IAC tuning procedure a few years back, but I since changed my name. Videos are a lot easier to reference than typing. I have guides on most of the common stuff, like idle, VE, IAC, etc. The idea is for new tuners to teach themselves and learn through a little experience. Tunes vary so greatly, that it's easier to just focus on the basics.

    Guides are in my signature. Feel free to check them out. Also have some tricks and some more advanced physics concepts for the guys that want to know more about what they are really doing when adjusting "x" value. I feel it's more important to know why behind something rather than the "what" because that is easily forgotten. If you know an engine creates more torque at higher spark values, depending on compression, etc, then you know how to get it to stop hanging, bucking, surging, and so forth. Hence my approach to teaching the why behind the values.

    I sincerely hope they help. I have researched this stuff for way too long and experimented with all kinds of things not to share at least some of what is in my head lol. Trust me, most of y'all don't want the rest that's in there lol.
    I have your videos on a loop LOL

    They are a great tool to reference.

  7. #127
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    Hey guys, BRAND new to this tuning efi stuff!! Doing a 4.8/4l60e swap into my lexus
    IS300 as we speak, I will be tuning it as soon as I am through with the swap(hopefully by sunday night at latest). It has the sloppy stage 2 cam (283/286 adv. duration, 585/585 lift, 112* lsa). I am looking through this on how to get my idle wrapped up and this is EXCELLENT info!! My only concern is that I can't find an app on my win10 computer to view the correct format of the cgf file that was attatched in the second post. Could anyone possibly tell me what I can do to view it? When I open it in notepad, which the google search I did says it was the app to use, I can see the text, although it definitely isn't in order, but the values(I'm assuming that's what they are)are coming back as a bunch of funky symbols.
    Thanks for your help!

  8. #128
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    Save the cfg file. Open the VCM Scanner and the folder icon for Channels>Open channel config>> go to the file name you saved > click it.. It is a cfg file which is for an older HP tuners version. Your new HP tuners uses a different format but will try to convert it. Make a note of the Channels listed in cfg and open another VCM Scan with Channels.XML and add those cfg channels you want to the .xml
    You should have good results with that cam.
    Hope that helps.

  9. #129
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    Heya,

    Followed OP instructions up to the first start and loaded it up. Engine fires right up but then idle breaks up and then it dies after about 10 secs. I've attached the tune and logs. The logs aren't in the OP cfg format as I just figured out how to load it. Can relog if the attached ones are of no help. Pedaling it only helps briefly but still ends up dying. Appreciate any assistance!
    Has a 223/226, 113 LSA , 109 ICL Cam. 5.3 gen 3 L33. LS6 intake. Stock injectors. Cold air 4" intake with an LS3/LS7 MAF
    Attached Files Attached Files

  10. #130
    Tuner in Training Jim Brown's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chris Tanghe View Post
    Heya,

    Followed OP instructions up to the first start and loaded it up. Engine fires right up but then idle breaks up and then it dies after about 10 secs. I've attached the tune and logs. The logs aren't in the OP cfg format as I just figured out how to load it. Can relog if the attached ones are of no help. Pedaling it only helps briefly but still ends up dying. Appreciate any assistance!
    Has a 223/226, 113 LSA , 109 ICL Cam. 5.3 gen 3 L33. LS6 intake. Stock injectors. Cold air 4" intake with an LS3/LS7 MAF
    Did you make all of these changes all at one time ???,
    Not a good plan, especially a Cam and a MAF a the same time, the other changes are mostly insignificant as far as Idle Quality goes.
    Put your stock MAF back on, and see if that makes for any improvement.
    That Cam could use a small Compression Bump for best results,
    the lack of that corresponding Compression Bump will negatively affect Idle Speeds more than any other area, this tends to make the Idle "mushy" and weak,
    not to mention the Overlap is getting close to being a little "Choppy", especially with a Smaller Displacement Engine.
    You will need a High-Stall Converter, (~2500 rpm), for best results,
    along with, setting the Idle Speed up to at least ~800 to ~900 rpm,
    1000 rpm would be preferable, with a ~3000 rpm Converter, (some Trans Re-Tuning might be in order too).
    This Cam is not "Plug-n-Play" on a small displacement Engine.
    Compression and Displacement must be considered when choosing a Cam.

    Always make ONE change at a time.
    Put your stock MAF back on, and then see if it will Idle, if it will, then you have something to start Tuning from.
    After you get it Idling really well, (or the best compromise you can get),
    then you can start thinking about changing out the MAF, and then re-Tuning the MAF Curve.
    A bigger MAF is going to be more difficult to get right with a Big Cam making things mushy around Idle, even the stock MAF won't like it much.
    You now have much more substantial "Reversion" going on in the Intake Manifold,
    and more Exhaust Gas Dilution of the Fresh Mixture coming in to the Cylinder,
    this will trash a stock Tune anywhere below ~2000 rpm.
    .
    .
    02 GMC Sonoma, 4.3 V6, 3" exhaust, no cats, modified/completely insulated intake tract/air box, de-screened MAF,
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    all tubular front suspension w/ Bilstien shocks and stiff springs, dropped 5", rear dropped 4", 18 x 10 wheels, Continental Conti-Sport Contacts,
    1.25" front sway bar, Battery relocated to the bed, 4L60 trans,


  11. #131
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    Thanks for the info Jim. This isn't a stock truck that I've modified but rather a Frankenstein drift car that I've been working on as a hobby during quarantine. I bought the long block and started building. I don't have a stock maf to revert to, unfortunately. I have the idle at 850 but will try going up a bit. It has a T56 so no worries on the torque converter and tuning. I have no idea what "reversion" is but will research it. I'm thinking I need some professional help to get it up and going and then learn tuning basics from there. At least it runs and I didn't totally muck it up during the building phase!

  12. #132
    Tuner in Training Jim Brown's Avatar
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    If this is a Race-Car with a Stick, set the Idle at 1200rpm, you may have to figure out how to slightly crack-open your Throttle Blade by adjusting the Stop-Screw, and/or,
    by drilling 2- 1/8" Holes in the Throttle Blade, this is if you are running a Manual Throttle, ETC (Electronic Throttles) don't need any changes to support a high Idle Speed.
    This "may" get you a stable Idle. Do not Knock Yourself Out trying to get your Engine to Idle Smoothly below 1200rpm, there are zero good reasons to go lower in your case.
    Next, Get an After-Market, Wide-Band O2 Sensor and Gauge, Mount it on the Dash, directly in your field of view, and
    give it a few seconds to warm-up and stabilize before starting the Engine.
    This will tell you right away, what the AFR is at any time, and whether Mixture or Timing is the current problem.
    If you have ANY Cam Chop, this will fool the O2 Sensor into thinking that the mixture is Leaner than it really is, so just keep that in mind.
    A longer Duration Cam will REQUIRE a richer Mixture anywhere below 1500rpm, especially if it is creating misfires, (Chop),
    you may need a ~11 or ~12 to 1 AFR to make the Engine really responsive below 1500rpm.
    Next, go over all the Spark Maps and make sure that the timing STAYS at ~15 degrees advanced below 1500rpm,
    you may want to try going as high as ~20 degrees since you have effectively lowered your Compression Ratio with your Cam.
    There are Idle Advance Compensation Maps which will need re-adjustment to match the higher Idle Speed,
    these Maps will be trying to stabilize the Idle by advancing or retarding timing, and
    they will be trying to Retard the Timing as soon as you take your foot off the Gas Pedal.
    Look at what they are doing, then try to duplicate that pattern at 1200rpm, instead of the stock ~650rpm.
    Overall, your Ignition Timing should be gradually advanced over stock,
    starting around ~2500 to ~3000rpm and increasing as you get down to Idle Speeds, by around ~10 degrees,
    this will tend to make the Engine much more responsive to the Throttle,
    this timing change is needed because of the gradual reduction of Compression at lower RPMs caused by the Cam.
    Of course this is not the "best" way to do it,
    you really need to bump your Compression Ratio to around ~13 to 1, but of course there are many more changes needed to survive a High Compression Ratio,
    but THAT is where the Hard-Edged Responsiveness and Power come from.
    Last edited by Jim Brown; 10-15-2020 at 12:43 PM.
    02 GMC Sonoma, 4.3 V6, 3" exhaust, no cats, modified/completely insulated intake tract/air box, de-screened MAF,
    throttle blade mod, new style fuel injection spider, four- 2-speed cooling fans on custom made shrouds,
    all tubular front suspension w/ Bilstien shocks and stiff springs, dropped 5", rear dropped 4", 18 x 10 wheels, Continental Conti-Sport Contacts,
    1.25" front sway bar, Battery relocated to the bed, 4L60 trans,


  13. #133
    Does anyone have an updated .cfg file that loads without need for modification in the newer versions of HPT? I'm flailing over here trying to get the cfg right so I can get this right. Thank you.

  14. #134
    Tuner in Training Jim Brown's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 68C10_408 Stroker View Post
    Does anyone have an updated .cfg file that loads without need for modification in the newer versions of HPT? I'm flailing over here trying to get the cfg right so I can get this right. Thank you.
    Dude ...
    What the hell are you talking about ???
    It would seem that your post does not belong in this thread.
    If you could be more specific about what problem you are trying to solve, you might get some answers.

    Every detail matters.

    It seems strange to me that you would be having a problem with a "cfg" file.
    I may be clueless on this, but as far as I know, .cfg files are generated automatically by the program, and don't require editing, or manual up-dating.
    When you install an updated version of the Program, it will either re-use the old cfg files, or re-write them as appropriate.

    How do you even know that you are having a problem with a cfg File ???
    Re-Installing VCM Suite will re-write all the cfg Files if they've been lost, or don't exist.
    If you KNOW that your cfg Files are corrupt, delete the old Files and do a fresh install, just remember to keep separate copies of all your ".hpt" Files.

    BTW, I just up=dated my VCM Suite and it was completely seamless,
    it installed its self right over the top of the older version, and even retained my old special Folder Locations, and last used File.
    02 GMC Sonoma, 4.3 V6, 3" exhaust, no cats, modified/completely insulated intake tract/air box, de-screened MAF,
    throttle blade mod, new style fuel injection spider, four- 2-speed cooling fans on custom made shrouds,
    all tubular front suspension w/ Bilstien shocks and stiff springs, dropped 5", rear dropped 4", 18 x 10 wheels, Continental Conti-Sport Contacts,
    1.25" front sway bar, Battery relocated to the bed, 4L60 trans,


  15. #135
    Potential Tuner LSCHEVY254's Avatar
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    i literally just recreated it off the values that it was asking for in the old table

  16. #136
    Potential Tuner Trashmetalcustoms's Avatar
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    I'm in the same boat, It's not showing anything in the idle airflow desired graph. I tried to make the graph and log but it's still not logging anything under Idle Airflow Desired. Here's my layout.
    Attached Files Attached Files

  17. #137
    Bring this post back to the top again. My o2 sensors are off when i start the vehicle and it idles well (or should I say, it idles they way i told it to idle) . but they come back on and stay on. I'm not sure if the trigger for coming on is time, or the RPM exceeding the 1400rpm where close loop is allowed to take over. I feel like its the latter however. I have PE vs TPS set to 0% per this article. STFT while open loop is disabled. Long term fuel trims are on. (maybe i need to turn those off and tune it with the short terms for now?) It also has really bad cruise control.

    id appreciate it if anyone has any advice.

    DRIVE - O2 SENSOR ON AT IDLE - BAD CRUISE DECEL.hpl

    IMPROVED Base tune 2.4 IDLE FIX 02 ON BUT DISABLED WHILE OL.hpt

  18. #138
    Advanced Tuner Boost's Avatar
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    I have been fighting a hanging idle issue for a long time about 1400 RPMs. When I come to a stop and press the brake pedal it drops to a beautiful normal idle. Drives me insane
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  19. #139
    Advanced Tuner dhoagland's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Motorsports-X View Post
    Bring this post back to the top again. My o2 sensors are off when i start the vehicle and it idles well (or should I say, it idles they way i told it to idle) . but they come back on and stay on. I'm not sure if the trigger for coming on is time, or the RPM exceeding the 1400rpm where close loop is allowed to take over. I feel like its the latter however. I have PE vs TPS set to 0% per this article. STFT while open loop is disabled. Long term fuel trims are on. (maybe i need to turn those off and tune it with the short terms for now?) It also has really bad cruise control.

    id appreciate it if anyone has any advice.

    DRIVE - O2 SENSOR ON AT IDLE - BAD CRUISE DECEL.hpl

    IMPROVED Base tune 2.4 IDLE FIX 02 ON BUT DISABLED WHILE OL.hpt
    I'm not sure if this has anything to do with it, or if I'm reading your log correctly on my graphs.
    But you are lean as heck.

    Have you done any MAF or VE Tuning?
    Usually you dial those in before attempting dialing the idle in.

    Have you verified fuel pressure?
    Your injector ms seem high for 50% throttle
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  20. #140
    Senior Tuner Frost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Boost View Post
    I have been fighting a hanging idle issue for a long time about 1400 RPMs. When I come to a stop and press the brake pedal it drops to a beautiful normal idle. Drives me insane
    Lower you in-gear idle airflow table at full operating temp. When you stop, idle control goes into closed loop and trims all of that extra airflow with the IAC. There is no closed loop (STIT / LTIT) control when moving. If the "idle" speed is too high there, you just have too much base airflow.
    Steve Williams
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