changing vss

[patrol_maverick]

Vss seems to be there in the software, but not the hardware.

[sideshow]

ive tried afew things with no luck

ill just have to charge double and use my other dongle compared to using hp tuners
ive got a couple of hp tunes with speed signal disabled but it would cost me credits to test it on another ecu
so if it doesnt work and then i have to do it the other way it would cost me 600 bucks in credits

[misk]

would you mind sharing a hp file wth it disabled?
and i've used many bf pcm and tunes and have gotten it to read speed signals from a normal outputshaft speed sensor or using an abs wheel speed sensor fed in to the same wire (pin b7) although it may not be _as_ linear.
fg is more difficult and i've been asking on this forum since i joined on what needs to be addressed in the tune to avoid it going in to limp with no speed signal and people just reply with make changes and data log which is rather frustrating. i've done it on an fg 5spd pcm by enabling the auto even when using a manual and upping the neutral rev limits for the auto but it would be good not to have to do this.

[sideshow]

sorry i do looms for a living and its costs me alot per tune twice as much as hp tuners credits
because i now just read the tune with sniper and send it to a ford tuner and pay him to sort it out

last custoemr sent his car to a proper tuner and he tried to fix the issue using hps and was a waste of 600 bucks
so i used sniper on it and got tune done by ford guy and fix the issue
just send your ecu to bullet performance tuning

[misk]

i do looms also, bullet have just as many issues sorting the vss problems as anyone else. not sure why the ford community cant share any info with this kind thing but its getting to be a bit much.
i understand it costs some of us money, but we're never going to get anywhere if people that have solutions never share anything.

[sideshow]

if its that important then sen your ecu to batten at perth
once u get it back then u can study what they have done and try to reverse engineer it
plus until hp tuners sorts the speed problem out its useless using hp tuners on fords when they r in conversions

also what do u mean by ford community
there is no community
there is 50 guys playing with holdens to one ford guy so this is why the info is not out there easy to find

anyway ive told u a way out of it unfortunately its not cheap
if anyone wants a cheap job ill send them your way
i got sick of paying credits with hps and then needing to buy credits with sniper
in the end i have to pay for it so ive stopped using hps on fords unless they are running a speed sensor on the box

[Menice]

if i'm reading this correctly, why don't you send hpt a tune from before and after having the speed input fixed so they can work it out for us so you and the rest of the guys trying to do conversions can have a way to do it with hpt?

[misk]

thats what i'm trying to do. sorry sideshow didnt mean for it to come across like i was having a go, i agree that there is a lack of community unfortunately.
if i can be assured that the tune i get back will have the correct things changed for no speed sensor - specifically in FG then i'd be happy to pay for it then would send it to hp to compare and add any missing features to the tune.

sideshow, have you had luck with fg tunes with the method you are currently using to disable the speed sensor and any limiting conditions that no speed sensor can cause?

[patrol_maverick]

Sideshow I'm curious to know why you get the speed source turned of with Sniper then finish off with HP, rather than do the whole lot with Sniper to begin with?
Wouldn't it be cheaper to just do the whole lot with Sniper

[misk]

bit off topic - how much is the sniper gear?

[sideshow]

its 600 to 700 for dongle and i got one credit
and all i do is suck tune out and email to barry at batten tuning
otherwise its around 2600 bucks to buy the software and do it yourself but u still need a credit per ecu so i cant justify it
if they dont want to pay for something i know works they normally go elsewhere
the way i see it is if i do it this way it will run good and i wont get heaps of phone calls about problems
if hps can disable the speed signal and do afew other things to stop it going into limp then il go back to it for fords

hey patrol maverick, i dont finish it off with hps i just use sniper and sometimes i read the tune with hps once i get it back but with the latest version u cant do it anymore
i just email the tuner that i use what i need done to ecu
i dont tell custoemr that im doing a performance tune, i just say
its a std tune with the fans and speed problems adjusted and afew other things
if they want it tuned i just tell them i wont charge them for ecu flash and they can get it tuned elsewhere

ford ecus are abit less forgiving than gm ecus as they do fail more regularly so i dont chop and change ecus or files when it comes to fords
gm stuff i have heaps of spare ecus and can play and much around with tis2web often

i once got an eb 302 efi v8 running on an ls1 ecu with help of my friend so as you can see gm stuff rocks and ford stuff is a headache

[Grant LS1]

I just stumbled across an interesting thing, I had a BA XR6T on friday & it had a completely FF'd area for VID block so I used the exact same VID block out of the same OS & changed the VIN to suit the car & eventually figured out the correct checksum for that block & once it was corrected it came up with VSS error!!

It had the same U2197 speed error in all modules just from changing that block without vehicle even running or moving so it HAS to be a code change & may be a way to work around VSS signal setups?

So I changed the VID block back to FF's except for VIN & correct checksum for that area & VSS issues gone again!

[sideshow]

i depends what u want to do

im sure hps cannot turn off the spd into ecu and im sure even if u can turn it off u still have to max out some settings if its a turbo to get full boost

if its non turbo u need to be able to turn off the need for a speed signal so u dont get the 3000 rpm limp problem

hps can only change where the ecu gets the speed signal from, most fords its the abs
if u change it to sensor on the gearbox u still need to feed a speed signal into the box
which sometimes means also fitting a module if the speed signal is way to fast or too slow

either way u need to fit something
thats y i gave up hehe

[misk]

once i get the next manual conversion done i'm going to try having the speed sensor plugged in but not in the box, it may be like most other sensors where the pcm is looking for either a resistance or voltage value, the brake switches for example like something like .5-.8v through even when the switch is open.
i've used abs wheel speed sensors directly in to the VSS in as a sine wave and that works, was also going to try a pulse width generator.

just unsure how this has been an issue for several years and kinda seems hp don't wanna know about it.

[patrol_maverick]

I had a pluse generator with my BA conversion which made no difference although I wasn't the one that set up the tune. Would be nice to know someone else's expreience.

[sideshow]

maybe someone could try the trick i used to do on the old toyota 20v 4ags

wire the speed signal input wire onto one of the injector pulse wires or even tacho rpm wire

[patrol_maverick]

Not a bad idea except you would have to step the voltage down to 5v.

[sideshow]

i know the toyota ecs didnt care about it being 12v signal
i just neve get the chance to try things on the cars because most fo the time i send them out mail order
so this means i have to charge more to do it properly so the customer doesnt have issues
there are shops doing them cheaper but then when there are problems they dont give a shit

[misk]

ive done it off crank and cam signal and it does work off crank signal, cam signal throws things out of whack. i havent had a chance to test it well enough though.

[sideshow]

ive got little modules i use for tachos
i have used them for dong this type of stuff so there is no feedback thru to crank signal
they are hard to find these days

maybe try a gps module that spits out a square wave and run that to the spd signal

but until hps can turn off the spd signal we r all wasting our time