3.5 EcoBoost Advice?

[andrewzpsu]

It looks stock to me. There are more tables missing for sure, but it has the WOT shift RPM parameters that are missing from my 2014 SHO.

Anyone got a successfully modded 2010 SHO version they would share? I've been trying everything and I am either missing it, or its just not there. Thanks!

[metroplex]

The first problem I see is that there are numerous tables missing. I've tried everything on my 2014 SHO, but there's another set of torque tables and/or desired TIP tables that I can't access. Even with driver demand and all available torque tables maxed/increased, the scheduled torque/expected torque is stock and the desired TIP is stock no matter how hard I push. I was able to look at the SCT value file for the EcoBoost SHO and saw several tables not found on the 2014 SHO HPT file:

Function to Clip Inverse Torque Table
Inverse of Flange Temp
Max Torque Engine Indicated Limit
Rev Limit 3 On (not sure what this does, but SCT always has several of these rev limiters for many of the calibrations)
Rev Limit 5th Gear (not sure if this is really useful)
WOP Clip Switch
Axle Torque Limit

I found several tables on F-150/Mustang EcoBoost files that I didn't see for the SHO:
21239 Torque Limit TCC Locked
2843 Max Torque WOT
9690 Trans WOT Shift RPM
28936 Expected TIP

Someone else mentioned a PTU Torque Limit table in SCT that I have yet to see in any of HPT's repository files, so I am sure there are other important tables I haven't listed. The easiest way at this point for a DIY tune is to pony up the $500 ($399 for SCT X4 and $100 for vehicle license) to SCT if you already have their SCT Pro Racer Package. Alternatives are to buy a tune from a vendor, or wait for HPTuners to add the missing parameters and hopefully we'll have all of the necessary tables.

At this point, I can't even raise the WOT shift points for my 2014 SHO which should be a simple task assuming all tables are available.

[zfgracing]

Interesting, all those tables you just listed are in the f150 ecoboost definitions.

[metroplex]

The last 4 I mentioned are from the F-150 files. The first 7 I couldn't find in HPT, but are in the 2014 SHO calibration via SCT, just not in HPTuners.

[96gt4.6]

I would need to pull up both tunes and compare directly, but I have a stock read from a '14 SHO, and my '15 F150, and it seems in my mind as well that there are quite a few things missing or not listed for the SHO's.

[metroplex]

I still haven't been able to get a 2015 or 2016 SHO calibration to check, but I believe Ford did a lot of changes for 2015-up.

[metroplex]

I found a 2015 Explorer Sport file in the repository, and it has a lot of the tables that are missing from the 2014 SHO. Being that both vehicles are essentially identical (same engine/PTU/trans), a lot of the tables are actually making sense like 50539 Clip Inverse Torque, 2843 Max Torque WOT. I don't have these tables in the 2014 file, but these need to be raised most likely.

Hopefully the EcoBoost update will be available soon.

[zfgracing]

Any updates Eric?

[zfgracing]

^why are you here again?

[Vlad@NSI]

Been hitting an "insufficient fuel flow" limit on a 2011 F150 ecoboost. Closes throttle on me and cant seem to figure out how to get around it. Fuel trims stay in check and it never goes lean. It wont do it every pull either.

[metroplex]

What's your fuel pressure look like in your data logs? My SHO will go up to about 2500+ psi. At what conditions does the fuel flow become insufficient (RPM, airload, actual TIP boost, etc...)?

The fuel trim data seems useless for my SHO, it shows up to +13% lean (LTFT+STFT) bone stock from the factory using 87 or 93 octane. I'd normally correct this with a MAF system, but no one has revealed a logical way of correcting this on the speed density system.

[Vlad@NSI]

What's your fuel pressure look like in your data logs? My SHO will go up to about 2500+ psi. At what conditions does the fuel flow become insufficient (RPM, airload, actual TIP boost, etc...)?

The fuel trim data seems useless for my SHO, it shows up to +13% lean (LTFT+STFT) bone stock from the factory using 87 or 93 octane. I'd normally correct this with a MAF system, but no one has revealed a logical way of correcting this on the speed density system.

So I tried taking a log to capture the insufficient fuel flow (stupid me didnt save it earlier) and now its closing throttle due to exhaust temp control. I have tried disabling all temp controls I could find with no luck.

[Witt]

So I tried taking a log to capture the insufficient fuel flow (stupid me didnt save it earlier) and now its closing throttle due to exhaust temp control. I have tried disabling all temp controls I could find with no luck.

I usually find the culprit is "Exhaust Temp Inverse" under the COT tab. Some strategies don't have this defined yet.

[zfgracing]

I'm currently hitting a condition that triggers the the fuel source to go from wot, to cl causing the afrs to go from where I want it to 1.0 under full load wit has no warning. Also my throttle angle is still limited by combustion sablitly... I'm just having no luck what so ever getting the truck to demand or run an air load of more than 1.8.

[Nissmotion]

Been hitting an "insufficient fuel flow" limit on a 2011 F150 ecoboost. Closes throttle on me and cant seem to figure out how to get around it. Fuel trims stay in check and it never goes lean. It wont do it every pull either.

The 2015 SHO I'm tuning hit this a few times for me as well. You'll need to log fuel rail pressure. In order for this limit to activate the fuel pressure will drop significantly. The problem with the fuel systems is their mechanical limitations. They can only flow so much fuel at a given RPM. Some people can have found upgrading the low pressure system helps, but ultimately we run out of fueling VERY fast. After the SHO would warm up a little bit, the fuel pressure drops would stop happening. I've since installed a methanol injection kit to help keep it safe but the fuel pump is the limit for us on these engines. There isn't any tables active in the HPTuners software that can let us tune beyond the car thinking it's out of fuel.

[Eric@HPTuners]

Just an update guys, I am working on these issues full time now and have been for about a week now. I'll keep you guys updated.

[zfgracing]

Well it worked! Played around for 30 min this afternoon and now have the truck demanding air loads over 2.0, going to need a few more tweaks to get everything lined up but at least the air load demand is there

[96gt4.6]

Can you summarize what all you had to do to achieve this for us? At this point, there have been so many replies I can't jive what's all what!

I'm FINALLY onto experimenting with my '15 this weekend, i'll be updated with results there as well.

[96gt4.6]

Well, I made some progress finally on the '15. I intend to try and be as open about how i'm going about all of this as possible. The results i'm sharing now are of my own origin, using some of the methods described in this thread. Although I have tunes for this truck already, I want to learn the tuning process on these, and that only way that will happen is through trial/error and logging of course.

So, starting off I wanted to be able to use all 14 psi to launch with on this truck, vs. what it cuts you back to when you try and brake boost things up. As you can see, in stock form you are cut back to around 10psi. You can see it in this screen shot. I have created a custom boost Math parameter that will show Actual boost instead of the raw MAP values which do not account for resting atmospheric pressure (around 13 psi at my altitude). This Math parameter uses the measured BARO the ecu is reporting, so it will be accurate at any altitude.



Did a little tweaking to the tune, and can now get the full (or very nearly full) 14 psi by power braking. Nothing in the Torque Inverse/Load/Driver Demand/Turbo settings has been touched to achieve this. I'm finishing up on the write up for this particular deal right now, I just need to start from scratch again on the tune, punch in my values and verify the results are repeatable before I cement it in:



As stated before on this thread, 14 psi is what these truck shoot for all stock. You will see boost spikes and less than that at the top of each gear (creeps back to 9-10 psi all stock), which is all in the tuning. That is next up on my list.

I had a little more time getting the scanner/gauges set up and doing the User Defined Math's than anticipated, so it slowed me down yesterday. More coming this weekend.

Here is the Math config file for the boost gauge, and the gauge layout file:

Actual Boost.MathParameter.xmlEco 3.5 Tuning.Gauges.xml

[reubone]

Sweet!