The SAVE MY ENGINE! thread. A SAFE place to post logs and get feedback.

[gmtech16450yz]

TJ regarding your KR, I would suggest trying to lower those timing areas that are getting KR and smooth out the adjoining areas. you may want to add cylinder air mass to your chart view to better help with locating the exact cells on your high octane timing table, you could also add a new histogram that instead of having MAP in your row you have cylinder airmass as I'm pretty sure that is the same as spark airmass...please correct me if I'm wrong but this has worked for me. anywhere that I was getting KR I would adjust those cells down until I got it under control. I still get the occasional KR but never over .9 degress and only maybe once a week.

All of us coming from the same tuner are getting excessive KR. Insomniac we DO infact have the same guy who tuned our cars, I had forgot to look in the tell tale areas of timing (where he fat fingered some data) that are the same as my file that I got after my tune (which is vastly different from what I have now).

look in your max torque timing table where you have some random 600's (low RPM low load) and your IAT base timing table where there is a random 9 in -7 to -10 areas (higher temp low load). that has confirmed it for me. you guys might as well fix that too.

TJ I don't know what to tell you about your start up, I would try out what John suggested on the other site. I still plan to do the same for my off idle surge. I had played around with the idle airflow table but didn't help. I think KR should be your primary area to fix right now...but that's my personal opinion.

and I'm jealous guys LOL, my trans had more or less not been tuned, he touched 3 tables in there and that was it. you guys have all kinds of tuning in your trans.

YES!!! Good detective work there Josh! The 600's in the max torque table are stock, I've seen those in many bone stock files. Not sure why GM did that but I've seen random values that don't make any sense in stock files before. The one I DON'T think is stock though is the 9 in the IAT Base table. I don't believe I've ever seen that before in a stock file. I DO however have that in some files that guys have sent me. I believe you just found that particular tuner's digital signature or watermark in a way. Whatever you call it, yes some tuners do put random values in a table so they can easily tell if somebody is stealing their tunes.

So guys, check your tunes for the 9! lol. It would be interesting to see how many have it. And let us all know if anyone finds that value in a stock file, it too could be one of GM's little easter eggs. I looked through a few and didn't find it, and I don't remember every seeing it. I have seen the 600's though. I think sometimes they're 700's also, right in a virgin stock file.

[JBZ]

You may be right on some of the pcms having the 600's and 9's but i do know that my factory 2010 file does not have either. Another i noticed and did not mention in all 3 tunes are the weird injector data not following id's data and the PE table is exactly the same as well.

[schpenxel]

I noticed that +9 too--looks like he fat fingered it, should be -9. Doubt you'll get to see IAT's that high regardless though.

[defconfire]

I'm extremely glad I found this thread. Its always good to have another set of eyes looking over something especially when you are learning.

I'm relatively new to HPtuners but I've noticed an issue with KR today and I'm not sure if its a genuine problem or if its false knock from another source. It seems to happen mostly around (after) shifts but there were a few exception.

Being that this is a FI car I really do not want to turn down the gain on the knock sensors unless I have to.

The setup is a bone stock 5.3 (lmg) Silverado with a 76mm on3 turbo kit and 850cc FAST injectors, running very rich.

I've attached a few logs. Any feedback on this would be great!

[JBZ]

I'm extremely glad I found this thread. Its always good to have another set of eyes looking over something especially when you are learning.

I'm relatively new to HPtuners but I've noticed an issue with KR today and I'm not sure if its a genuine problem or if its false knock from another source. It seems to happen mostly around (after) shifts but there were a few exception.

Being that this is a FI car I really do not want to turn down the gain on the knock sensors unless I have to.

The setup is a bone stock 5.3 (lmg) Silverado with a 76mm on3 turbo kit and 850cc FAST injectors, running very rich.

I've attached a few logs. Any feedback on this would be great!

Im a novice so take my word with a grain of salt...with that said it looks like your high octane timing table is really high in the low RPM high load areas and really low in the high rpm low load areas. to me...it looks like your timing tables need some work. that could be why your getting KR. I was getting a lot of KR and have changed mine to where im getting none to maybe 1 degree of KR for short moments on occasion.

here is a screenshot of my timing table (with your vertical access values because mine are different normally) so you can compare against what you have. you could change it to this and go for a run and see what it does, if its better keep it and work it to your liking if its worse changes your back in.

edit: my timing table may need work too (as for KR I don't get any or very little at worst) but if others would like to chime in if they see any issues...please do.

[defconfire]

Thanks for the input!

Luckily the turbo doesn't spool in that area but it certainly wouldn't hurt to pull some timing. Typically at WOT I see 10-12 degrees of timing at ~10.7-11.1 AFR, and I think that's very conservative.

I was looking at my IAT Spark Advance Correction Table it might need to be tweaked. Even on hot days my IATs don't climb quickly above ambient (it was above 80*F when logging) I'm not sure if this is because of the size of my intercooler or a function of poor sensor placement.

I'm also looking at burst knock retard, I'm not exactly sure what the function of that is.

Another thought is the possibility of a bad tank of gas, I'll hopefully eliminate that prospect in a few days.

[SilverV]

YES!!! Good detective work there Josh! The 600's in the max torque table are stock, I've seen those in many bone stock files. Not sure why GM did that but I've seen random values that don't make any sense in stock files before. The one I DON'T think is stock though is the 9 in the IAT Base table. I don't believe I've ever seen that before in a stock file. I DO however have that in some files that guys have sent me. I believe you just found that particular tuner's digital signature or watermark in a way. Whatever you call it, yes some tuners do put random values in a table so they can easily tell if somebody is stealing their tunes.

So guys, check your tunes for the 9! lol. It would be interesting to see how many have it. And let us all know if anyone finds that value in a stock file, it too could be one of GM's little easter eggs. I looked through a few and didn't find it, and I don't remember every seeing it. I have seen the 600's though. I think sometimes they're 700's also, right in a virgin stock file.

Going thru my tune file I have noticed both of these errors, This looks like it has some from GM like that thought because my stock tune file also have them. I corrected them to a more reasonable number but its funny none the less.

Starting to understand this more. I had some dyno tweaking done where they added a tad more fuel, removed 2 degrees under max torque curve and it took care of the KR and I only lost 6 whp, pretty insignificant. Over all they said the tune was good, being that it was remote I cant expect perfect, but the only other adjustment was the maf curve was a little bumpy so they smoothed out a section of it.

It was nice the tuner let me run the car on the dyno and he showed me everything he was doing so my understanding of HP tuners went from no fucking clue, to enough where I now can find things and play with settings. Thats probably both good and bad.

lol

[SilverV]

one other thing, I am comparing my old tune to my new tune. We added a bit of fuel up top and I cant recall how he did it. Ive used the compare function and these are the tables showing differences, is this correct in where the fueling would be adjusted.

He made it look so easy by selecting a few cells and doing something like X 1.01 or 1.05 I cant recall exactly. Just wondering should I need to find where the fueling is adjusted later.

top left corner "Gas Gear" and "Gas P/N"

[Z06-Hammer]

one other thing, I am comparing my old tune to my new tune. We added a bit of fuel up top and I cant recall how he did it. Ive used the compare function and these are the tables showing differences, is this correct in where the fueling would be adjusted.

He made it look so easy by selecting a few cells and doing something like X 1.01 or 1.05 I cant recall exactly. Just wondering should I need to find where the fueling is adjusted later.

top left corner "Gas Gear" and "Gas P/N"

Gas (Gear): This table is used to determine the commanded open loop equivalence ratio when running on gasoline and the transmission is in gear.

This is not where you want to add fuel. You set your PE table then adjust your MAF under WOT using a wideband.

[JBZ]

one other thing, I am comparing my old tune to my new tune. We added a bit of fuel up top and I cant recall how he did it. Ive used the compare function and these are the tables showing differences, is this correct in where the fueling would be adjusted.

He made it look so easy by selecting a few cells and doing something like X 1.01 or 1.05 I cant recall exactly. Just wondering should I need to find where the fueling is adjusted later.

top left corner "Gas Gear" and "Gas P/N"

If you want to see all the differences look at the compare log in the compare menu after you have opened the compare file up. That will show you every difference in the entire tune... You can copy over selected differences or the entire tune from there.

Sounds like your (mine to...well used to be anyways) tuner had you running a bit lean up top. Glad you are finally getting it worked out, hope you got your start up issue taken care of also.

[SilverV]

If you want to see all the differences look at the compare log in the compare menu after you have opened the compare file up. That will show you every difference in the entire tune... You can copy over selected differences or the entire tune from there.

Sounds like your (mine to...well used to be anyways) tuner had you running a bit lean up top. Glad you are finally getting it worked out, hope you got your start up issue taken care of also.

Yeah so what happened was I went to a local tuner and he used the tune I had done remotely. It worked out well because the local guy just adjusted the tune and doesnt touch our transmissions and I am very happy with my transmission tune.

But I goofed up and thought I had brought my most recent tune revision when I actually brought my second last tune revision.

So I wanted to move all those adjustments from the dyno tune to the most recent tune. I know this doesnt sound like the best thing to do but all we did was pull out 2 degrees of timing under the max torque curve and added a little fuel up top. Also smoothed out the maf curve slightly.

Like I said, I got the timing pulled out of it and was able to copy the maf curve over I just couldnt recall how to do the fueling.

Ill look into the compare log, I was just manual going thru everything comparing it. It was nice he let me sit beside him while adjusting everything and I started to understand how the program works a lot more.

[JBZ]

[QUOTE=SilverV;434664]doesnt touch our transmissions and I am very happy with my transmission tune.
QUOTE]

lucky you. I got screwed in the trans department from that guy. I did not get the same trans tune that you did...guess my $750.00 was not enough to mess with the trans...LOL I checked your tune out and both you and insomniac got better trans tuning then I did albeit not the same. I have since modified it and its better now but what I got wasn't much. kind of weird that some are getting a lot and some are not.

as for the 9 in the picture below...only my tune file had that, my stock file did not. every tune from him has had it...like GM tech said, think its his signature

[schpenxel]

Are we talking about a certain someone of Westchester by chance?

[JBZ]

Are we talking about a certain someone of Westchester by chance?

lol...no sir, but my guess is there are quite a few tooners...tuners that are only after a buck and really dont take pride in their work nor care about the quality of what they are putting out. Im not out to bash the shop or guy who tuned my car but will not ever use them again nor will i recommend them to anyone else.
After getting involved and in my infancy of tuning myself, dont think this can be done in an afternoon or even really a day or 2 and i am stock with pulleys and injectors. For me its taking months of logging evey day and making minor adjustments. And some things i mess with are not getting any better...but i am learning what doesnt work.
The idea that a tune can be done in a day with maf only on a dyno with 3 pulls is absurd. But most dont know the difference.
Kudos to all you guys who spend time doing this on your own vehicle or with customers to get it right. Its an art for sure

[ddtech]

lol..
After you do a few vehs it becomes second nature. Normally tuning vehs should take around 45-2 hours depending on how a veh performs and acts. Sometimes it'll take days, sometimes things go so smooth a car is tuned within 20 dyno pulls.. its just the way it is sometimes... Tuning many different veh's as i do, i typically find that its varies. My own personal veh i'm testing alot on, as i'm trying to get bigger in the domestic world, so i tend to spend more time trying different settings to see the differences it makes vs what the internet says.

[kmc forklift]

i have an extemely strange problem with a LS3 engine (swap) .i need someone to look at hp tuner scan if possible.when truck is acelerated real hard the the throttlle kicks closed then open then closed again. tough to explain but i think if someone that knows how to read scan can have pick it up . i do not have knowledge of this stuff. any help will be appreciated believe me.

[JBZ]

lol..
After you do a few vehs it becomes second nature. Normally tuning vehs should take around 45-2 hours depending on how a veh performs and acts. Sometimes it'll take days, sometimes things go so smooth a car is tuned within 20 dyno pulls.. its just the way it is sometimes... Tuning many different veh's as i do, i typically find that its varies. My own personal veh i'm testing alot on, as i'm trying to get bigger in the domestic world, so i tend to spend more time trying different settings to see the differences it makes vs what the internet says.

I wouldnt argue that it cant be done in a short time but in my infancy of tuning i find it hard to believe. Only because there are so many scenarios that can have an effect on the way it runs. Although ive been turning a wrench for a long time i have never explored this side of the coin...honestly kind of always been intimidated by it, but as i dive deeper and deeper i see that with even the smallest mods, they can affect the cars attitude let alone big mods and then throw on top of that transmissions.

I would chalk alot of this up to complacency in my personal experience. I think alot of folks want to get something out the door and rather than take the time to figure out exactly what this particular car needs will instead drop in what worked before on a similar build. Please dont get me wrong, none of that is direected at you, you have been very helpful and i am very appreciative of the support you have personally given me and time youve taken out of your day to help a complete stranger. With that said though the last two professional tunes on 2 different cars ive had by two different people have been less then impressive. That is one of the great things about forums and this particular thread in general...alot of people have known there is an issue (such as myself with acreally high amount of KR that was even shown to me when i picked the car up and was told its no big deal) and have posted for help so they dont go kaboom and folks with alot more knowledge have been able to assist.

Edit: thought i would add this screenshot i had of my first pull on the street after my initial tune. This in my opinion is a great reason the have a thread like this. Folks need a place to go to get help when left with something they believe is not good.

i have an extemely strange problem with a LS3 engine (swap) .i need someone to look at hp tuner scan if possible.when truck is acelerated real hard the the throttlle kicks closed then open then closed again. tough to explain but i think if someone that knows how to read scan can have pick it up . i do not have knowledge of this stuff. any help will be appreciated believe me.

Post up a log file

[schpenxel]

So many tooners out there throw some halfass injector data in there, tweak MAF or VE tables to make WOT fueling close enough and fuel trims not too horrible and send it out the door. Collect $500 and move on to the next one. People doing that can get through cars with a quickness

[Widebody06]

Need to pass emissions...not interested in "cheating". She passed last time but I've been tweaking it for 2 years and pursueing turn key starts has lead to occasional map performance codes...

My main concern right now is low speed/small throttle and hot starts.
No need to spend time with WOT as I'm going to #42 Injectors and Duspeed once emmisions is past and wont be risking running it till its either richer or running the 42s with proper tune. Prior to the last few tweaks I had it starting and going right into cold idle with no throttle "help" Cuirrently its needing a little throttle help for the first 3-4 seconds(but not 8 seconds).

[MadMan]

Just got my HPTuners going and could use some experienced eyes to look over my 1st datalog & tune. What I see scares the ba-jesus out of me but I don't understand why my engine is so lean looking at o2's vs the ltft's showing -13?
It's a 2011 Silverrado with a 2.3 Whipple, headers and off-road Y pipe and I think 72 lb inj. I didn't install it or tune it so I'm not positive on the inj size. It is a flex fuel, non dod truck if that helps.

MadMan