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Thread: NAG1: How to get AutoStick Auto Upshift to work?

  1. #1
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    NAG1: How to get AutoStick Auto Upshift to work?

    I tried setting Auto Upshift to Enable, and TCM RPM Limit to 100 RPM less than my rev limiter, but it still just hits the limiter. Any tips? Car is a 2006 SRT8 Magnum.

    Thanks.

  2. #2
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    Post your tune, you prob still have your engine rpm limit too low or your shift RPMS too high

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    Tune: USSM_449_base33_less-startup-injpw.hpt

    RPM Limit Drive is 6400. TCM RPM limit is 6300. I've tried setting Autostick WOT to both Enabled and Disabled.

  4. #4
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    Put your RPM limit drive to 6700, try again. Needs more than 100rpms, your torque reduction table for the rpm limit allows it to go 150rpms over your rpm limit in drive before it reduces 100% of power, takes longer than that to shift.

  5. #5
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    I tried setting TCM RPM Limit to 5,500. When the tach hits 5,700 rpm or so the transmission forcefully shifted out of gear, and stayed in N until the car was restarted. So that didn't work.

    My WOT Upshift RPMs are set to what amounts to 6,300 RPM in each gear, and the trans tends to shift around 6,400. I could try lowering them, but since they work as advertised in auto mode I doubt that will do anything.

  6. #6
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    Youre missing what I am saying.

    When in autostick, If you have all three General switches to "Enable" it will shift at the rpms you specify in the Autoshift speed tab, using the WOT Normal Upshift table.

    Right now you have it set to shift at 6300, which is when it will first command an upshift. It takes anywhere from 2-300rpms to do so. If you want it to shift at 6400 when in autostick mode, you need to give it room to shift otherwise itll go into limp mode. Again, set your TCM limit to 6700. It will still try to shift at your WOT table set points.

    What I think youre missing is what each item is for. TCM limit is a failsafe shift rpm limit, where no matter what else you have in your tune, its going to shift at that rpm. The TCM will monitor how far past the TCM limit you go, if you go about 100-150rpms over it, itll release all pressure from the trans and go into limp mode. Setting it to 5500 resulted in a 5700 limp mode.

  7. #7
    Advanced Tuner 2therock's Avatar
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    Hi, I was doing a search for the same symptoms and found this thread.

    I would like to get in line to get 06300CSRT8 to look at my tune and tell me what I need to do.
    I am reading you but mine is a 2013 R/T stock but for a Corsa, K&N Drop In, and a 180?F T-stat.

    I would follow your lead in the instructions to Grant but feel mine may be a different case. I see some values set to 7000k and wonder if that's too high.

    Anyways, I get the same thing, put it in Autostick and hold the pedal down and it revs instead of shifting. Same for the 2-3 if I do the same.

    Thanks
    Attached Files Attached Files

  8. #8
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    Change TRANS>Autoshift Properties>Autostick>Autostick Upshift to Enable

    Your WOT shifts are controlled by TRANS>Auto Shift Speed>WOT>Normal Upshift. Looks to me like these are all set to around 5500 rpms, leave these for now and do your test after changing the first item, but then once you want to up the RPMS a bit, this where you want to change them. Remember to multiply the values in this table by the current gear's gear ratio, found in TRANS>Auto Shift Properties>General tab, to know just what engine RPM you are commanding

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  10. #10
    Advanced Tuner 2therock's Avatar
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    Ok, I figured out whats going on in this tune. Its setup for the driver to shift before it spaz's out. I'm not that kind of driver.
    I want it to get up into the power band more than stock before shifting, and if I don't shift when I should I want it to shift without hitting the limit wall acting like a missed gear.

    I did the enable with no change. It was factory with disable and still shifted on its own.

    Can you help me?

  11. #11
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    Attaching the factory tune in case you need to compare.

    Attaching the factory tune in case you need to compare.
    Attached Files Attached Files

  12. #12
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    Lightbulb Thank You, Thank You! 06300CSRT8!

    I can be as hard headed as the next guy and kind of like @Grant I was not hearing you. Like not seeing the forest for the trees.

    Being a VERY green novice especially to the MOPAR side of it I had to read, re-read, go look at tables, look at my stock file and compare it to my modified tune.
    I paid for this tune and they did a great job but for this part.

    I want to shift in the neighborhood of 5800 RPM @WOT in Auto Stick if I opt out of shifting sooner.
    My humble mods are a K&N drop-in, a 180?F t-stat, and a Corsa Sport Cat Back, and a Dyno Tune.

    My RPM Limit Drive was 6500. I took it down to 6200.

    My TCM RPM Limit was 6500. I set it to 5800.
    My Autostick 1 was 6500. I took it down to 6200.
    My Maximum RPM was 6000. I took it up to 6200.
    Fuel Cut off is at 6200. Leave this?

    My Trans/Auto Shift Properties/General/ WOT, Autostick WOT, & Auto Upshift selections were all "Enabled". I Set the Autostick/Auto Upshift to "Disable".

    I am now happily and joyfully shifting in Autostick right at 5600 for the 1-2, and 5800 for the 2-3. If I could get them both at 5800 I would be real happy but for now I am glad to be rid of the spastic behavior of violating the limiters.

    Do you see anything wrong or unnecessary I need to refine? How can I get the 1-2 up to 5800 without effecting the 2-3 5800?

    Thanks Again

  13. #13
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    Glad you are getting somewhere, basically the way you have it now setup, you are using your TCM limit to force it to shift. In doing so, you have only one shift RPM to command, and in 1st gear itll always shift a little earlier and then pretty much spot on for the rest.

    Can you post your latest tune? Based on your original tune, you are commanding 5,058rpms in 1st gear Autostick, then 5,500rpms or so 2nd and 3rd.

    Question - do you by chance have your car still married to a diablo handheld?

  14. #14
    Advanced Tuner 2therock's Avatar
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    For some reason I think I may have already did this but I don't see it so if this is a duplicate..............?

    Quote Originally Posted by 06300CSRT8 View Post
    Glad you are getting somewhere, basically the way you have it now setup, you are using your TCM limit to force it to shift. In doing so, you have only one shift RPM to command, and in 1st gear itll always shift a little earlier and then pretty much spot on for the rest.
    Thanks, nice to know its normal.

    Can you post your latest tune? Based on your original tune, you are commanding 5,058rpms in 1st gear Autostick, then 5,500rpms or so 2nd and 3rd.
    OK
    Question - do you by chance have your car still married to a diablo handheld?
    No I don't.

    Attached. It shifts just under 5800 RPM in Autostick if you let it. K&N drop-in, 180?F t-stat, Corsa Sport catback. 362.63HP / 389.58TQ
    Attached Files Attached Files

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by 06300CSRT8 View Post
    When in autostick, If you have all three General switches to "Enable" it will shift at the rpms you specify in the Autoshift speed tab, using the WOT Normal Upshift table.
    Which three switches? The only similar ones I see are Trans>General>>General>Manual Transmission, A580 Equipped, 4-Speed Transmission. Only A580 Equipped is set.

    Quote Originally Posted by 06300CSRT8 View Post
    Change TRANS>Autoshift Properties>Autostick>Autostick Upshift to Enable
    Mine is, of course. What about Autostick WOT? Is that enabled? Mine is currently, but I think I've tried it disabled as well.

    Quote Originally Posted by 06300CSRT8 View Post
    Your WOT shifts are controlled by TRANS>Auto Shift Speed>WOT>Normal Upshift
    My last attempt had these set at 6,000 engine RPM with a 6,400 rev limit, and it did not shift. I could try lower, but if there's no way to get it to auto shift in autostick without a big gulf between the rev limiter and shift points then I probably will not bother.

  16. #16
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    Make sure you are here.
    autostic_switches.JPG

    Then in TCM RPM Limit do this. Mine is set to 5800 and shifts just under that. My dyno chart says shift about there. And I have stock springs and cam so I don't need overkill or damage.
    autostic_switches_02.JPG

    Now go here and see my example. I have Auto Stick 1 and Max RPM @6200, with Fuel Cutoff (don't ask me why 6400, my tuner did that) @ 6400 RPM.
    Copy mine and if it works you should be good and then you can increase the numbers if you like. If not, you have something else conflicting.
    autostic_switches_03.JPG

  17. #17
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    I know it can get confusing. Start with this understanding...

    Trans has three ways it will command a shift:
    TCM Limit: if you arrive at this set rpm first, it'll shift here, all gears same rpm
    WOT, Normal Upshift Limit: If your auto shift properties have the WOT/WOT switch set to enable, and as long as this is LOWER than your TCM limit, it'll shift each gear at these rpms. If you set these higher than the TCM limit, it will continue to shift at your TCM limit and ignore these.
    Part Throttle/Normal: If your auto shift properties have the WOT/WOT switch set to disable, and as long as these are LOWER than your TCM limit, it'll shift each gear at these rpms. If you set these higher than the TCM limit, it will continue to shift at your TCM limit and ignore these.

    Two other Autostick options....
    Autostick Upshift: if you begin a WOT pull and you are ALREADY in autostick mode, having this set to enable means it'll shift automatically using the same rules as above
    Autostick WOT: this one seems to be a bit buggy, depending upon your specific TCM model, but I have generally seen this behave as follows: you are in autostick mode, nail the throttle, the shifter becomes completely useless, it wont upshift or downshift while the pedal is to the floor, and the TCM will shift automatically (if you have the previous switch set to enable) in the same rules as above. If set to disable, the shifter will function as normal but I have also seen this result in it no longer autoshifting when in autostick. Bit of info here...DS handhelds have basically three options to choose from to make your vehicle autoshift while in autostick, and they basically tell you to trial and error to figure out which one works. I believe it is simply trying either of these two switches to see if itll autoshift. You may have to do the same thing. Try disabling both. Enable one not the other.

    So now comes the myriad of options to tune your car. Most customers enjoy having two different shift patterns: in D (not autostick) a slightly lower shifting pattern and in Autostick manual mode a balls to the wall higher rpm limit but still shifts on its own. Couple of ways to do this, but generally this is what I do:

    Set all three of the Autoshift Properties as follows:
    WOT>WOT: Enable
    Autostick> Auto Upshift: Disable
    Autostick> Autostick WOT: Enabled

    Set your WOT Normal Upshift table to where you want it to shift in Drive, set the TCM limit to where you want it to shift in Autostick. Make sure the Limp offset is AT LEAST 500rpms. Lastly make sure your RPM Limit in Drive is equal to the TCM Limit + Limp Offset - 250 rpms, same with your Maximum RPM. What this does is NEVER let you go into limp mode. In sequence...if you go past your TCM limit (car is trying to shift but just taking a bit longer than expected) the next limit it will hit is your engine limiter, so power will get cut gently and without shutting you down permanently, you can usually ride this out for a second and it will eventually shift or let out for a second and lay back into it, but you wont be in limp mode, then youll have to adjust your tune. Most guys leave their rpm limit in drive HIGHER than their TCM Limit + Limp Offset, which will almost surely always result in limp mode.
    Last edited by 06300CSRT8; 05-26-2016 at 06:58 AM.

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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by 2therock View Post
    Make sure you are here.
    autostic_switches.JPG

    Then in TCM RPM Limit do this. Mine is set to 5800 and shifts just under that. My dyno chart says shift about there. And I have stock springs and cam so I don't need overkill or damage.
    autostic_switches_02.JPG
    Got all that, though most of my testing has been with Auto Upshift enabled.

    Quote Originally Posted by 2therock View Post
    Now go here and see my example. I have Auto Stick 1 and Max RPM @6200, with Fuel Cutoff (don't ask me why 6400, my tuner did that) @ 6400 RPM.
    Copy mine and if it works you should be good and then you can increase the numbers if you like. If not, you have something else conflicting.
    autostic_switches_03.JPG
    This may be the problem; I do not have an Autostick 1 field anywhere in my engine calibration. I don't have ECM or EOT RPM Limit tables either.

    Quote Originally Posted by 06300CSRT8 View Post
    TCM Limit: if you arrive at this set rpm first, it'll shift here, all gears same rpm
    TCM RPM Limit does not have this affect on my car. It doesn't appear to do anything except trigger limp mode if RPM > TCM RPM Limit + Limp Offset. I've got it set to 5500 at the moment and in D it shifts per my WOT>Normal>Upshift table.

    Quote Originally Posted by 06300CSRT8 View Post
    WOT, Normal Upshift Limit
    These work as expected for me.

    I'll probably write this one off. I'm planning on a manual swap anyways; the NAG1 trans is never going to work well for me unless someone gets it to match-rev downshift.

  20. #20
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    I have followed ever avenue these friendly people have posted for the tune. I have recently switched from Diablo trinity (91 tune, 6200 shift point, raised firmnes) to HP tuners. I have been trying all night but whatever I do it won't go past 5500RPM. I have done exactly as you have said (using TCM as the auto stick shift point). Nothing. If it's in D it shifts at 5500, autostick is the same. The torque management and other items I have changed work perfectly. Any suggestions?

    I should also mention that it doesn't matter what I said the shift parameters to, it's always 5500.

    2005 Chrysler 300C 5.7L
    Last edited by Kyle_300C; 05-29-2017 at 08:39 PM. Reason: Add car info