2009 3.8L Jeep Wrangler tuning help

[gtaion]

I may be in over my head here. I bought an HP Tuner knowing that it would take some learning but I'm having some trouble finding good resources. I've found some youtube videos mostly dealing with GM, but when I go back to the scanner I find that those values aren't available for Jeep. Then the help section here on HP Tuners seems to have large areas for GM and Ford, but almost nothing on Dodge, which is the same deal with tuningschool.com. Not much of anything out there for Dodge that I've been able to find.

So my next idea was to pull a tune off of a Jeep that had been tuned by a generic tuner and compare the differences to find what I should be looking for. I found somebody with a Superchips on a 2011 3.8L Jeep and pulled their tune. Today when I went to compare I found that at some point between 2009 and 2011 Jeep switched from a MAP to MAF and the internet is telling me that there is no way to convert the numbers.

I know there is a lot to be desired in the tune and I would like to learn as much as I can. I figured I would make some changes and pull some scans and try to figure out what I'm doing. I figured for Spark I could build a graph to tell me where to make adjustments, I understand what I need for Axis and labels, but I'm not sure which parameter to pole or how to use that data to adjust the tables? I let VCM Scanner load the default channels for the vehicle and did some driving at lunch after loading a first attempt at a tune.

If nothing else could somebody take a look and let me know that the engine isn't going to blow up?

The only Mod on the Jeep currently is a CAI, which is why I tripled the Max airflow limit, but I couldn't find any documentation on why I did that, I was just mimicking other tunes I've seen.

Also the strangest thing happens when reading and writing the tune to the Jeep. The dash starts scrolling a message saying HOTOIL and the radiator fans turn on while reading or writing the Jeep. I've hooked to other Jeeps and this didn't happen, is that normal for some vehicles?

Thank you for any help in advance,
Sean

[MarkTucker]

The only things changed in your tune are EGR disabled, PE Delay, PE, and WOT Spark.
Do you have the EGR valve deleted?

The PE Delay tables are good changes.

And the PE table is not a great change. The changes are as listed below.
Stock Commanded AFR= 12.23
Tuned Commanded AFR=11.67
A bit to rich for commanded afr on a stock naturally aspirated setup. Stock numbers are a lot better than the tuned ones.

And the tuned WOT spark table has 4-5 degree removed from the entire table. So I would definitely run stock table over the tuned one.

So looks like you went the wrong way with things. You richened it up, which is not a bad start. You just went a bit to far. 14.2 commanded afr is a good starting point tho. And normally when you do richen it up it try and add timing to get more power. Or you leave timing and try to lean it out a bit to get more power.

So actually tuning the vehicle in terms of air, fuel, and timing its pretty much the same. There are some really good write ups and guides here on the HPT forum for the Dodge/Jeep vehicles. Just need to read through the Dodge section and find them. So you can understand what all the tables do and what their meaning is.

[MarkTucker]

But as for your logs, your fuel trims seem to be fine. Which they should be if the only thing you have done is a cold air intake.
There is no knock, so that is good as well. But one, you did not do any WOT pulls and two, you did remove 4-5 degrees from the entire WOT table and commanded a richer afr. So I didn't expect to see any knock.

So no your engine is not going to blow up.

And it would be a good idea to create a graph to log spark advance and spark retard with a x and y axis the same as your spark table in the editor.
So put rpm in the x axis and put MAP kpa in the y axis. And log spark advance as the parameter for one graph. Then make another graph with the exact same x and y axis and just log spark retard as the parameter. That way you can compare commanded timing vs actual timing, and also compare commanded timing vs knock retard.

[gtaion]

The only things changed in your tune are EGR disabled, PE Delay, PE, and WOT Spark.
Do you have the EGR valve deleted?

The PE Delay tables are good changes.

And the PE table is not a great change. The changes are as listed below.
Stock Commanded AFR= 12.23
Tuned Commanded AFR=11.67
A bit to rich for commanded afr on a stock naturally aspirated setup. Stock numbers are a lot better than the tuned ones.

And the tuned WOT spark table has 4-5 degree removed from the entire table. So I would definitely run stock table over the tuned one.

So looks like you went the wrong way with things. You richened it up, which is not a bad start. You just went a bit to far. 14.2 commanded afr is a good starting point tho. And normally when you do richen it up it try and add timing to get more power. Or you leave timing and try to lean it out a bit to get more power.

So actually tuning the vehicle in terms of air, fuel, and timing its pretty much the same. There are some really good write ups and guides here on the HPT forum for the Dodge/Jeep vehicles. Just need to read through the Dodge section and find them. So you can understand what all the tables do and what their meaning is.

Like I said, everything I did to this point was mimicry. I realize I have a very steep learning curve here and I truely appreciate your response. Most of my day is going to be spent reading the forum here to see what I can find out. I think I'm going to spend most of my day trying to figure out how to use the VCM Scanner data.

[Monzsta]

Today when I went to compare I found that at some point between 2009 and 2011 Jeep switched from a MAP to MAF and the internet is telling me that there is no way to convert the numbers.


Sean

The MAF value is just a calculated value. There is no physical MAF sensor. It's still speed density.

[gtaion]

[QUOTE=Mark@TuckerPerformance;432463]The only things changed in your tune are EGR disabled, PE Delay, PE, and WOT Spark.

And the PE table is not a great change. The changes are as listed below.
Stock Commanded AFR= 12.23
Tuned Commanded AFR=11.67
A bit to rich for commanded afr on a stock naturally aspirated setup. Stock numbers are a lot better than the tuned ones.
QUOTE]

I think I'm getting lost in the math. I was looking at Commanded AFR as (1 / FA Stoich + FA Power Enrich)
The FA Stoich is set at .0688 and I'm not sure how/if that should be adjusted but when I did the above math I thought it brought the stock AFR to 14.53 all the way to the .78 Ratio on the power enrich chart and then added more fuel above that?

Since I don't have a Wideband is there a way to make a chart to show AFR? I have a feeling it has something to do with the math of adding the STFT+LTFT?

[06300CSRT8]

See marks response below, didn't have my coffee yet, missed the question entirely.

[MarkTucker]

Your stock stoich 0%= .0688
Your WOT PE in peak rpms= .0130

To find your stoich afr.
(14.7 x .0688)= 1.01136
(14.7 / 1.01136)= 14.534883

To find your commanded afr.
[14.534883 x (.0688 + .0130)]= 1.1889534294
(14.534883 / 1.1889534294)= 12.2249388753

[MarkTucker]

Here is a awesome spreadsheet made up by 06300CSRT8.

http://www.hptuners.com/forum/showth...-YOUR-OWN-RISK

[gtaion]

Would one of you be willing to share your VCM scanner layout that you would use for a vehicle like this? I'm still a little lost on which graphs are most helpful.