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Thread: SHO / EcoBoost HPT Tuning Guides

  1. #81
    Advanced Tuner metroplex's Avatar
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    That looks like 2.5* knock. Interesting that it is positive. My 2014 SHO shows knock as negative. I didn't know they made a 2.5L MKS? So you're running only about 7 psi boost?

  2. #82
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    It's a 3.5 Ecoboost motor. I'm sot sure why HPTuners misidentifies it in the header. I read the ECM and it shows it's a 3.5L V6.

    TIP and MAP reach up to 26 psi on this run, and BARO is at 14, so it's 12 psi boost.
    Last edited by b4black; 04-18-2018 at 01:35 PM.
    2013 Lincoln MKS Ecoboost
    2002 Regal GS (3800 Supercharged V6)
    1996 Dodge RAM 2500 Cummins Turbo Diesel
    1982 Buick Grand National
    1965 Hemi Barracuda (43 jr)

  3. #83
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    Different Ford Ecu’s report knock correction as different labels depending on strategy. Generally your per cylinder knock correction will be a + value adding timing and a - value retarding timing (it will generally also have the +\- label metroplex was mentioning). The knock retard parameter is the opposite with a positive value indicating knock is detected and timing is being retarded and a - value indicating the ecu is adding additional timing.

    To complicate all this when you log all these different spark parameters they will begin to lose resolution at different rates when you over saturate the interface’s bandwidth. If you see a number that seems odd on a graph make sure to verify it wth the values actually being recorded on your parameters. If you notice they’re not updating at similar rates you probably need to reduce the number of parameters being logged.

  4. #84
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    you say in the guide about the 7100 rpm limit but that snot what you want to rev it to and you will go over it later but I just read the whole thing and didn't see where you spoke about it further or showed what you did to keep limit under that

  5. #85
    Advanced Tuner metroplex's Avatar
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    It has an automatic transmission so your set shift points keep the shift limits under 7100. You really don't want the street EcoBoost 2.7 and 3.5 revving much over 6200 RPM overall especially in higher gears like 3rd or 4th as you just waste time pushing heat through the engine at higher boost levels at high RPMs.

  6. #86
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    oh ok so I need to go it in the shift points, perfect thank you. do you think there is much that can be changed while still running 87 or no? my father in law has a 14 3.5 ecoboost f150 he drivers daily and tows his 30 foot camper behind and just wanted some more power out of it for daily driving and towing. so im not sure I can do anything that would have a positive effect for him with staying on 87 or am I wrong. btw great informative guide. only been doing this a few weeks with my coyote mustang and wish someone would make a guide like this for the coyotes

  7. #87
    Advanced Tuner metroplex's Avatar
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    I am thinking of doing a guide for 15 to 17 (before split injection) since I've been fairly successful with the 2.7 and have some lessons learned.

    Honestly, it is just my feeling to not mess with a tune if you're looking for fuel economy and towing. Maybe increase spark advance a bit in the normal driving region of load and RPM. The use of E85 makes a huge difference with direct injected engines but it isn't always available.

  8. #88
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    he would rather stay 87 if possible but would run 93 if I told him it was necessary. and yea his I looking for some more power out of it in normal driving and when towing but that's about it. that's why I asked if I should even bother trying any of the settings from the guide. I know these aren't the greatest for fuel economy so I told him there probably not much there room improvement wise.

  9. #89
    Advanced Tuner metroplex's Avatar
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    His 14 truck should work about the same as the settings in the guide. I would recommend running a bit less boost than what I had in the guide and you are better off running about E30 instead of 93 octane (mix E85 with 87 octane). If you can't get E85 then I wouldn't really try to increase boost. 93 octane can help but it is only 6 AKI points higher and not worth it. E30 with 87 is like 100 plus octane in a GTDI engine due to evaporative charge cooling, and better than 93 octane in MPFI.

  10. #90
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    yeah where he lives and works there isn't any e85 avail so it would be 87 or 93 only avail.

  11. #91
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    The issue you’ll run into trying to increase boost on 87 is going to be timing... at the increased air loads the ecu will run less timing increasing exhaust temps substantially. The ecoboosts already dump fuel when towing to try and keep the cat cool, when you try to tune for more boost you will quickly run into fuel limits if you don’t lean it out, as well as turbo and cat temp protections.

    If he just wanted a performance tune for around town removing some of the exhaust temp protections wouldn’t be a huge deal, doing the same whole he’s towing would likely burn up the cat and could also likely burn up the turbos as well. Unfortunately the exhaust temps are all inferred, so you can’t even reliably tune around an increased exhaust temp and put a raised limit in place either.

    The engine’s cooling is pretty good though, so you would probably be fine on coolant and charge air temps if you kept boost reasonable.
    Last edited by Puggyberra; 05-15-2018 at 10:47 AM.

  12. #92
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    So even on 93 not a whole lot to do for what he is wanting out of it?

  13. #93
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    93 will let you run ballpark 6 degrees more advance, on 93 you could increase power noticeably and still tow. I wouldn’t aim for the 100 ft/lbs increase you can get from tuning, but 50ish should be reasonable.

  14. #94
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    That would be great

  15. #95
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    Hi guys,

    I have being two trying to tune a F-150 2019 3.5 EcoBoost. I've followed all guides, advices, even a tuner from other shop tried to help me and nothing. I have a dyno so I can do all the test you tell me in case I haven't tried them.

    With the stock base map I got 383WHP and from 3,000 RPM the Driver Demand Limit Source changed to "Turbo FMEM" and Throttle Angle Source changed to "TQ Red. < Driver Demand".
    Datalog Stock Map 383.03WHP.hpl
    Stock Map.png

    After like 30 maps modifications, my best dyno run is 409WHP but gain is only from 4,000 RPM and like approximately +25WHP@5,200RPM but now from 3,000 RPM I'm getting on Driver Demand Limit Source = "Comb. Stab. Limit", Torque Airlimit Source = "5 Popcorn", Torque Max Source = "Popcorn", Throttle Angle Source = "TQ Red. < Driver Demand". That just until hitting 3,600 RPM when everything is okay but Torque Max Source is still = "Popcorn". Then at 4,600 RPM Torque Max Source changes to = "Wastegate Airflow Limit".
    Datalog Tuned - 409WHP.hpl
    Map7.png
    Map7 2.png
    Map7 3.png

    As I said I've being playing with all values for Airflow limits, Torque, Driver Demand, Pressures, Combustion Stability Limit, LSPI Reduction, etc. I don't like to max out tables, so I've being just raising these tables progressively one by one. Then, when a change doesn't improve anything a step back. I tried a couple of times increasing turbo values, but it was worse so I haven't increase boost.
    VCM.png

    It's important to say that I'm 2,400 meters above sea level, so my barometric pressure is 76-77 kPa, so remember turbos need to work a little harder to compensate.

    Please, could someone give me any piece of good advice?

    Thanks.

  16. #96
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    Could I add any timing at all staying on 87 or no? My father in law basically would like some better throttle response if nothing else, and if possible some more power down low. How could I play with the throttle response , the truck does not have a sport mode so I can?t see how to adjust it

  17. #97
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    Staying on 87 could I do most of the torque management settings as in the guide and change the fuel enrichment and wot lambda ?

  18. #98
    Senior Tuner Higgs Boson's Avatar
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    I won't even tune a car running 87 if that answers your question. ;-)

    Not everyone will agree, but you get my drift....waste of time.

    87 is for substitute teachers driving their 04 sorento to work.

  19. #99
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    Lol I know I’m just trying to see if I can help him at all. I did a lot of the torque managent settings as the guide shows and change the wot lambda. Just seeing if I can get a little more throttle response for him. The truck doesn’t have a sport mode or that would have worked . Still have to flash and drive to see how it feels with the settings I changed but we haven’t had the best weather here today

  20. #100
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    If you've driven a 15+ with sport mode you can probably attest that it feels much more responsive, and generally faster. Whats ironic is that sport mode doesn't actually change any of the load/torque limits, all it changes is the pedal map ratio and the transmission shift points. The pre-15's don't have the pedal map ratio table, but you could get a kind of similar affect if you take the stock driver demand table and multiply by the scaled % throttle in the 15+ pedal map ratio. I attach a screen shot of the pedal map ratio differences, as well as the shift point and TCC unlock/slip/lock tables so you can see what Ford did to get that feel.

    As for removing the torque limits in the lower RPM's, even on premium tunes I leave those alone, I only raise them starting at 3000 RPM's to try to minimize the chance of any LSPI happening. The only exception to that is the exhaust temp inv table, I haven't had much success trying to leave that one intact without it cropping back up and limiting load when I don't want it to, so I typically max that one. That is also one of the tables I would try to have still functional in a towing tune, especially on 87 octane. I typically explain it as the ~$0.50/gal cost savings will take a really really long time to equal up to the cost of replacing almost any engine component.

    base vs sport.jpg