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Thread: High Flow Direct Injection Fuel Injectors and Pumps are here.....Redline Motorsports

  1. #1
    Advanced Tuner Redline MS's Avatar
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    High Flow Direct Injection Fuel Injectors and Pumps are here.....Redline Motorsports

    After a years worth of pushing we are finally making headway with the fuel system hardware for the DI motor. Now that SEMA is in full swing we are officially at liberty to discuss this. We are working close with Nostrum Energy and LPE with a set of 22 gram/sec injectors that are specifically designed for the LT platform. LPE has been doing all the injector characterization on there in house engine dyno and we are working it from the field side. We have a pre-production set in our 2016 TT 427 Camaro as well as the LPE High Pressure pump.

    Applications for these injectors are noted below;

    High horsepower GM Gen V V8 and V6 direct injection engines including LT4, LT1, L86, L83 and LV3
     E85 conversions of GM Gen V V8 and V6 engines
     2014-2017 C7 Corvette (LT1)
     2015-2017 C7 Z06 Corvette (LT4)
     2016-2017 Camaro SS (LT1)
     2016-2017 CTS-V (LT4)
     2014-2017 Silverado and Sierra with 4.3L LV3, 5.3L L83 and 6.2L L86 engines
     2015-2017 Suburban, Tahoe, Yukon and Escalade with 5.3L L83 and 6.2L L86 engines



    These high flow gasoline direct injection injectors are specifically designed for use in the GM Gen V V8 direct injection engines (aka ?LT? engines). At 22 grams per second flow rate these injectors provide the needed fuel flow for high horsepower applications without having to resort to auxiliary fuel systems. These injectors feature Nostrum?s patented K-DI? kinetic nozzle geometry which provides high flow rates without sacrificing atomization. Spray targeting is designed for optimal combustion quality. These features combined with the supplied injector characterization data this insures that these injectors will perform well at low RPM light load idle all the way to high RPM peak power/load conditions. The injectors are also E85 compatible allowing higher output engines to take advantage of the availability of E85 fuel.

    Features:

    Patented K-DI? kinetic nozzle geometry that provides high flow with short liquid length & small fuel droplets.
     Spray targeted to produce the specific spray plume shape for the GM Gen V V8 engine's combustion chamber and intake charge motion.
     Optimized spray plumes, controllability and response for easy integration.
     Built & tested to OEM durability & performance specifications.
     Flow tested, sorted and marked by flow rate for improved injector matching.
     Flow characterization data is provided for calibration purposes.


    Benefits:

    Easy installation.
    High flow rates.
    Allows E85 conversion of stock and modified L86, LT1 & LT4 engines ? providing an easier and more cost effective way to obtain higher octane pump fuel.
    This product allows tuners to increase HP w/o sacrificing full range performance.
    Flow characteristics can be easily calibrated with aftermarket tools using supplied data.
    Eliminates the need for secondary fuel systems.


    Specifications:

    Rated flow of 22 gram/second at 10 MPa
    80% more flow than the production L83 fuel injectors
    44% more flow than production LT1/L86 injectors
    24% more flow than production LT4 injectors


     E85 compatible.

    Further details on our field testing will be updated on our Facebook Page( https://www.facebook.com/permalink.p...d=212805857665) as well as trying to get stuff here as well. LPE will be the lead supplier for this product and of course we are a dealer as well. Get used to the costs its the big leagues now.

    HT
    Full Service GM Late Model Performance Facility

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  2. #2
    Tuner in Training
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    That is excellent news!

  3. #3
    Senior Tuner Ben Charles's Avatar
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    Hell yea
    Nice work!!

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    Awesome! Much needed
    Post a log and tune if you want help

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  5. #5
    Advanced Tuner Redline MS's Avatar
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    Here is some further information on the LPE pump;

    Description:

    Mechanical fuel pump flow has been one of the primary limiting factors for the aftermarket when trying to increase the power output of the GM direct injection V8 engines. The Lingenfelter Big Bore direct injection fuel pump for GM Gen V V8 applications provides an increase in fuel flow capacity over the stock LT1/L86 and LT4 fuel pumps, expanding the range of performance of these engines. At 12.0 mm in bore size, the Lingenfelter Big Bore pump flows over 30% more than the stock L86 & LT1 pump and nearly 10% more than the LT4 pump.
    Tested to provide over 1100 horsepower of fuel flow for a turbocharged LT4 engine on gasoline and nearly 900 hp of fuel flow for the same engine on E85.

    Features:

     Precision machined and assembled fuel pump assembly using brand new production LT1 fuel pump cores (no used cores).
     12.0 mm bore
     DLC coated bore and piston
     Compatible with production LT1 and LT4 fuel pump lobes and with aftermarket higher lift fuel pump lobes
    o Note - some aftermarket higher lift fuel pump camshaft lobe designs may require a lash cap to compensate for the smaller camshaft base circle.
    o Note - some aftermarket higher lift fuel pump camshaft lobe designs may require a higher load spring on the pump to maintain fuel pump lifter control a revised spring on the pump
     100% hot tested pump assemblies to confirm performance and functionality
     Individually serial numbered

    Benefits

     Increased fuel flow allows higher power levels without having to resort to auxiliary fuel systems.
     Direct fit replacement. No modifications required.
     Stock appearing.
     E85 compatible.
     Can be combined with higher lift fuel pump lobes for even great flow rate increases.

    Specifications:

     12.0 mm bore
     Over 30% more fuel flow than the stock L86 and LT1 fuel pump
     Nearly 10% more fuel flow than the stock LT4 fuel pump
     Compatible with higher lift fuel pump lobes
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  6. #6
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    You have rails and lines too Howard or is the pump alone enough to keep the rails at full capacity during sudden drops or demands?

    Great news on everything Howard
    2010 Vette Stock Bottom LS3 - LS2 APS Twin Turbo Kit, Trick Flow Heads and Custom Cam - 12psi - 714rwhp and 820rwtq / 100hp Nitrous Shot starting at 3000 rpms - 948rwhp and 1044rwtq still on 93
    2011 Vette Cam Only Internal Mod in stock LS3 -- YSI @ 18psi - 811rwhp on 93 / 926rwhp on E60 & 1008rwhp with a 50 shot of nitrous all through a 6L80

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  7. #7
    Advanced Tuner Redline MS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GHuggins View Post
    You have rails and lines too Howard or is the pump alone enough to keep the rails at full capacity during sudden drops or demands?

    Great news on everything Howard
    At this point the factory rails are not an issue. You'd be surprised how well a given size pipe will flow relative to how small it may look.
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  8. #8
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    I apologize if I misread or just plain overlooked it, but are the new design pumps capable of putting out higher than OE pressures? I'm just wondering how much you could possibly delay injection timing now with a setup like this??? I mean I'm sure it would be overkill or even just not cost effective on smaller hp builds, but obviously the later you could delay it - the more focused and better burn could come from it - possibly anyway - this is one way I get better fuel economy out of the DI setups with mild mods and the more delayed during wot - the far less chance of it spraying down the cylinder walls = much longer and better engine longevity... I also assume the springs and lash caps will be available on request with the orders if needed? All OE seals still used to seal the injectors into the heads and rails?

    Thanks Again Howard
    2010 Vette Stock Bottom LS3 - LS2 APS Twin Turbo Kit, Trick Flow Heads and Custom Cam - 12psi - 714rwhp and 820rwtq / 100hp Nitrous Shot starting at 3000 rpms - 948rwhp and 1044rwtq still on 93
    2011 Vette Cam Only Internal Mod in stock LS3 -- YSI @ 18psi - 811rwhp on 93 / 926rwhp on E60 & 1008rwhp with a 50 shot of nitrous all through a 6L80

    ~Greg Huggins~
    Remote Tuning Available at gh[email protected]
    Mobile Tuning Available for North Georgia and WNC

  9. #9
    Advanced Tuner Redline MS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GHuggins View Post
    I apologize if I misread or just plain overlooked it, but are the new design pumps capable of putting out higher than OE pressures? I'm just wondering how much you could possibly delay injection timing now with a setup like this??? I mean I'm sure it would be overkill or even just not cost effective on smaller hp builds, but obviously the later you could delay it - the more focused and better burn could come from it - possibly anyway - this is one way I get better fuel economy out of the DI setups with mild mods and the more delayed during wot - the far less chance of it spraying down the cylinder walls = much longer and better engine longevity... I also assume the springs and lash caps will be available on request with the orders if needed? All OE seals still used to seal the injectors into the heads and rails?

    Thanks Again Howard
    These pumps don't really raise the pressure but more address a volume issue. Being that the HP pump works based upon RPM; you can only generate so much volume per stroke of the pump. These larger pumps have more bore (12 mm) and when combined with the proper fuel lobe lift (stroke) will move more volume. Much like boost in a forced induction application, you can have high boost and low volume and your not going to make power. The problem with the pumps is both having more volume at lower speeds and also not having volume fall off.
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  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Redline MS;458285[B
    Specifications:[/B]

    Rated flow of 22 gram/second at 10 MPa
    80% more flow than the production L83 fuel injectors
    44% more flow than production LT1/L86 injectors
    24% more flow than production LT4 injectors


    These numbers achievable with the stock cam with just new injectors and HP pump?

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redline MS View Post
    These pumps don't really raise the pressure but more address a volume issue. Being that the HP pump works based upon RPM; you can only generate so much volume per stroke of the pump. These larger pumps have more bore (12 mm) and when combined with the proper fuel lobe lift (stroke) will move more volume. Much like boost in a forced induction application, you can have high boost and low volume and your not going to make power. The problem with the pumps is both having more volume at lower speeds and also not having volume fall off.
    Know that all too well Howard Welcome to our LSA Magnuson Heartbeat scenario - spinning it's guts out - makes 19psi, but only puts down 911 to the tires on a 416 stroker more or less tuned to the limits - still need to find out what it's going to do on 93 and E85, but not keeping my fingers crossed or anything like that Would much rather have a higher volume / lower boost blower making over a 1000 Good to know the new pumps are that well at supplying at higher rpms... I know your not going to post prices on the forum, but do you mind letting me know what everything is roughly going to cost via pm or email that's if anythings been decided yet?

    Thanks Again,
    Keep up the great work Howard...
    2010 Vette Stock Bottom LS3 - LS2 APS Twin Turbo Kit, Trick Flow Heads and Custom Cam - 12psi - 714rwhp and 820rwtq / 100hp Nitrous Shot starting at 3000 rpms - 948rwhp and 1044rwtq still on 93
    2011 Vette Cam Only Internal Mod in stock LS3 -- YSI @ 18psi - 811rwhp on 93 / 926rwhp on E60 & 1008rwhp with a 50 shot of nitrous all through a 6L80

    ~Greg Huggins~
    Remote Tuning Available at gh[email protected]
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  12. #12
    Advanced Tuner Redline MS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GHuggins View Post
    Know that all too well Howard Welcome to our LSA Magnuson Heartbeat scenario - spinning it's guts out - makes 19psi, but only puts down 911 to the tires on a 416 stroker more or less tuned to the limits - still need to find out what it's going to do on 93 and E85, but not keeping my fingers crossed or anything like that Would much rather have a higher volume / lower boost blower making over a 1000 Good to know the new pumps are that well at supplying at higher rpms... I know your not going to post prices on the forum, but do you mind letting me know what everything is roughly going to cost via pm or email that's if anythings been decided yet?

    Thanks Again,
    Keep up the great work Howard...
    The pump retails for $1,495.00 and the injectors are $ 495 EACH. Those PD blowers, especially a TVS2300, becomes a bottle neck to move air mass at numbers you are trying to hit. Its the nature of the beast. Can't emphasize enough its lbs/min that matters not the pressure. Unfortunately the price you pay for too much pressure is inefficiency.
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  13. #13
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    I knew it was going to be pricy - just wasn't figuring on that much - but for someone who is going to need this - they will already be paying a decent chunk for the motor work, so I guess we'll have to see how it goes...
    2010 Vette Stock Bottom LS3 - LS2 APS Twin Turbo Kit, Trick Flow Heads and Custom Cam - 12psi - 714rwhp and 820rwtq / 100hp Nitrous Shot starting at 3000 rpms - 948rwhp and 1044rwtq still on 93
    2011 Vette Cam Only Internal Mod in stock LS3 -- YSI @ 18psi - 811rwhp on 93 / 926rwhp on E60 & 1008rwhp with a 50 shot of nitrous all through a 6L80

    ~Greg Huggins~
    Remote Tuning Available at gh[email protected]
    Mobile Tuning Available for North Georgia and WNC

  14. #14
    Would love to see a screen shot/data log of solid fuel pressure at the 900hp level on E85. Glad to hear this is in the works but I am a bit concerned about the pump keeping up at that level if it's only 10% better than LT4.
    07 ZO6- warhawk 427/APS TT/HPT 2.5bar

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  15. #15
    Senior Tuner mbray01's Avatar
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    10% increase coupled with a optimized fuel lobe, can be all the difference.

    Fuel lobes alone are making huge improvements in fuel volume. I think another 10% over that is a huge difference

    Considering some of the extreme numbers I have seen achieved with fuel lobes alone, and stock lt1 pump/injectors, adding these is going to allow numbers that will far exceed anything possible within the stock block.

    So, when can we expect the ltx, or ltnext blocks to be available?
    Michael Bray
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  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redline MS View Post
    These pumps don't really raise the pressure but more address a volume issue. Being that the HP pump works based upon RPM; you can only generate so much volume per stroke of the pump. These larger pumps have more bore (12 mm) and when combined with the proper fuel lobe lift (stroke) will move more volume. Much like boost in a forced induction application, you can have high boost and low volume and your not going to make power. The problem with the pumps is both having more volume at lower speeds and also not having volume fall off.
    Can the stock lift pump, in tank pump keep up with the gph required. or do you have a replacement for the low pressure side.

  17. #17
    Advanced Tuner Redline MS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charger83 View Post
    Can the stock lift pump, in tank pump keep up with the gph required. or do you have a replacement for the low pressure side.
    At some point the LP will fall off and it will effect the HP pump from performing to its capacity. You actually can kill the HP pump if the LP is keeping up. A low pressure can form at the inlet side of the pump which will make it cavitate. Once this happens there exists a condition in which the coating on the piston can start to pit. Inevitably it will kill the pump.
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  18. #18
    Tuner in Training machineworks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redline MS View Post
    At some point the LP will fall off and it will effect the HP pump from performing to its capacity. You actually can kill the HP pump if the LP is keeping up. A low pressure can form at the inlet side of the pump which will make it cavitate. Once this happens there exists a condition in which the coating on the piston can start to pit. Inevitably it will kill the pump.
    Do you have a file with the injector data and pump data setup? LPE is just about worthless with this info. I have both the pump and the injectors. The desired rail psi stays at 363psi through the run. Their Base psi table looks very weird, super low. Thanks

  19. #19
    Senior Tuner Frost's Avatar
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    Their data did not work for me.
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  20. #20
    4,000$ for 24% more flow... good luck. The average consumer will spend the 500-600$ for lt4 injectors