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Thread: Not hitting 100% throttle right away

  1. #1
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    Not hitting 100% throttle right away

    I'm not getting 100% throttle when I give 100%.

    Here's the log let me know if that's normal or not thanks

    c63 log.hpl

  2. #2
    Senior Tuner BackyardTurbo_FTW's Avatar
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    There has to be some delay table that we don't have access to.

    Couple notes:
    Work on your MAF trims
    You are pulling timing WOT, a good amount too!

    Ive found 21-22* seems to be the sweet spot above 5500-6k area. I made the most power with that amount without knocking.

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    Sounds good will be on the dyno with this car again tomorrow

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    having the Same issues. I'm only seeing about 88% max throttle opening. Also it Doesn't fully open until We reach 4800 RPM.

  5. #5
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    87-89% is full throttle btw. It doesn't go any higher than that.

    As for 4800rpm I suppose that's another issue, but a valid one.

    If it makes you feel better, my car has Eurocharged V6 tune and only hits full throttle in the last 5-600 rpm of the power band.

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    Logged an Upsolute Tuned car and it Doesn't hit 100% throttle as well. we were Able to sort out the torque dip by fixing our intake manifold

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    Senior Tuner BackyardTurbo_FTW's Avatar
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    I think I saw your post on the c63 owners facebook group. What was wrong with the intake manifold?

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    The Socket the plugs the Air intake butterflies were not locked so the Valve was not opening.

  9. #9
    Senior Tuner BackyardTurbo_FTW's Avatar
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    That's what I was figuring what happened. Looks like you made good power with it! Did you work on cam timing?

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    Has anyone figured this out or has gotten 100% commanded throttle when you floor the pedal during a test pull? I've done multiple 1st to 3rd gear pulls and have not gotten 100% commanded throttle. Tried adjusting Table 13192 Pedal Characteristic, Var 2 to values on attached screen shot. This seamed to help but then I started throwing P061B codes, which is a torque calculation based error code, and then go into limp mode. I've raised the Permissible Tq in Tables 12492, 12498, and 12499 for the cells on the 11.3 & 22.7 y-axis for Torque %. I did limited testing yesterday with the raised Permissible Tq values but didn't throw the P061B code. I'll try more datalogging later today to see if the code comes back. Attached is my Wheel Torque Max vs. Vehicle Speed (Table 44783) so I'm not limiting torque. I also have Spark Retard Allowed for TqMgm and Torque Request Limiting both disabled. I submitted a ticket with support but from my research on the forum looking at other's C63 HP Tuner tune logs, that they are not hitting 100% commanded throttle either. Attached is the Eurocharged V7 tune log with 1st to 3rd gear pull for comparison (notice Commanded Throttle % is 100 and Throttle position % is 87.1 throughout the pull).
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  11. #11
    Senior Tuner BackyardTurbo_FTW's Avatar
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    Post the tune file

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    Whooops, forgot to attach it on the last post.
    Last edited by quaalude; 2 Days Ago at 11:15 PM.

  13. #13
    Senior Tuner BackyardTurbo_FTW's Avatar
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    Airflow -> Electronic Throttle -> Desired throttle

    Torque Management -> Driver Demand -> Pedal Characteristics

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    Quote Originally Posted by BackyardTurbo_FTW View Post
    Airflow -> Electronic Throttle -> Desired throttle

    Torque Management -> Driver Demand -> Pedal Characteristics
    Thanks Backyard Turbo! I haven't adjusted the Desired Throttle table yet. Looks like only small increments (0.5 to 1.0) should be added to this entire table.

    Pedal Characteristics - I've adjusted it to values in Screenshot009. I'm commanding 95% throttle at 70.2 % accelerator position and goes to 100% throttle for next two cells. My Pedal Table Select is Variant 2.
    Last edited by quaalude; 4 Days Ago at 10:27 AM.

  15. #15
    Senior Tuner BackyardTurbo_FTW's Avatar
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    I would just adjust the desired throttle table for the higher cells, see if that helps. Also, the new version of HPT has a max throttle rotation table that wasn't in previous versions
    Last edited by BackyardTurbo_FTW; 4 Days Ago at 02:39 PM.

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    Ok, I'll adjust from 897.2 to 4597.3 to see if that helps.

    Yeah, I seen those Max Throttle Rotation tables but haven't adjusted any of them. All the tables are maxed out (100%) except for Variant 6 table, which I thought doesn't apply to my car since I'm supposed to use Variant 4 (see configuration screenshot).

    FYI, adjusting the Permissible Tq tables helped eliminate getting the P061B code (knock on wood) when I drove the car yesterday for testing.
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  17. #17
    Senior Tuner BackyardTurbo_FTW's Avatar
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    Yea, Ive been experimenting more and more with increasing throttle response, driver demand in the mid range and then increasing the permissible tq table to suit. I can roast the tires real bad now from a roll, not sure this is a good thing yet lol

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    Throttle from OEM comes limited, there is a few SW numbers with a commanded throttle of 100%, but they are rare... For what Ive seen, this throttle limitation also happens to be the most noticeable improvement when you tune this cars, close if not more than 50% of the gains you can get from the tune, actually comes from commanding the throttle 100%.

    If I am remember correctly, The last row on this table is the one you need to change, Y axis highest value is usually 4500 units (rpm). After looking into HPT tables, I was able to find one, that kinda looks like the one I am referring to (screenshot attached), but for some reason I remember this table having bigger dimensions than what it shows on VCM, but I could be wrong and I am thinking of the other variation of this ECU, that could explain the dimension differences and the axis units being something different than RPM as I recall it.

    Give this table a try, set last row to 95-99%, leave the rest alone. If this doesnt work, maybe We can ask support to add this tables in the case is not already defined by support, which is also possibility. In a hex file I could give you specifics and probably addresses to find it, but on HPT the easiest way is just to bring this to their attention and perhaps they can tell you if this is currently defined or not

    Capture.JPG
    Last edited by kbaldi29; 4 Days Ago at 08:42 PM.

  19. #19
    Senior Tuner BackyardTurbo_FTW's Avatar
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    Thats what I mentioned to Quaalude above, yes that partially controls the throttle limitation.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by BackyardTurbo_FTW View Post
    Yea, Ive been experimenting more and more with increasing throttle response, driver demand in the mid range and then increasing the permissible tq table to suit. I can roast the tires real bad now from a roll, not sure this is a good thing yet lol
    Cool, roasting the tires from a roll is good if you're hotrodding around but not so much if you're racing lol. Thanks for the tip on the Desired Throttle table.


    Quote Originally Posted by kbaldi29 View Post
    Throttle from OEM comes limited, there is a few SW numbers with a commanded throttle of 100%, but they are rare... For what Ive seen, this throttle limitation also happens to be the most noticeable improvement when you tune this cars, close if not more than 50% of the gains you can get from the tune, actually comes from commanding the throttle 100%.

    If I am remember correctly, The last row on this table is the one you need to change, Y axis highest value is usually 4500 units (rpm). After looking into HPT tables, I was able to find one, that kinda looks like the one I am referring to (screenshot attached), but for some reason I remember this table having bigger dimensions than what it shows on VCM, but I could be wrong and I am thinking of the other variation of this ECU, that could explain the dimension differences and the axis units being something different than RPM as I recall it.

    Give this table a try, set last row to 95-99%, leave the rest alone. If this doesnt work, maybe We can ask support to add this tables in the case is not already defined by support, which is also possibility. In a hex file I could give you specifics and probably addresses to find it, but on HPT the easiest way is just to bring this to their attention and perhaps they can tell you if this is currently defined or not

    Capture.JPG
    Thanks Kbaldi29 for the tip also. BackyardTurbo_FTW recommended checking that table before you posted. I understand there is a mechanical limitation to the throttle plate reaching 100% rotation (hence maybe the reason most of us see 87% Throttle Position (SAE)) but when a TP sensor is maxed out at 4.65V, I would expect the ECM to trigger a 100% Commanded Throttle. Log 18-12-06 18-24-59 - 11.844@119.14mph is what I ran at Bradenton Motorsports Thursday night where I added the parameter Throttle Position Sensor Voltage. I adjusted Table 11283-Desired Throttle to the attached screenshot to be conservative (84.70 @ 4597.3 y-axis). At 2176rpm, the TPS voltage spikes to 4.74V because I floored the gas after brake boosting on the line. From then (beginning of 1st gear) until the end of the run (top of 4th), the TPS voltage is 4.65-66V. The Commanded Throttle (white line) is supposed to ramp up, plateau, and ramp down like a trapezoid, same as the TPS Voltage trend displayed in the log. For some reason, the Commanded Throttle follows the RPM trend with its peaks and valleys. Car felt great and powerful. Got in two runs and I ran my personal best time of 11.844 @ 119.14mph on Michelin PS4 265/30/18 tires at stock tire pressure. Eurocharged V7 header tune only got me 12.067 @ 116.30mph (V5 & V6 tune never got me past my stock best time of 11.962 @ 117.14mph). This is only with a street tune running conservative timing so I'm stoked! Can't wait to throw it on the dyno and increase timing and adjust VVT and then I should be in the mid to low 11's on street tires and hopefully hitting the 120's mph range.
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    Last edited by quaalude; 1 Day Ago at 08:01 PM.