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Thread: A/C tuning with Vintage Air.

  1. #1
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    A/C tuning with Vintage Air.

    I have 2 trucks I tuned. Both C10's one Gen3 and one Gen4 OS. Both trucks have Vintage Air A/C that is not linked into the pcm system. Both truck have Speartech harness and are show trucks so don't really want to go back and run new wires and back pin into the pcm. Is there a way to tune around this to help fix the Idle surge/drop when a/c engaged without the PCM knowing there is an a/c system just engaged? I asked on the facebook page and everyone just said wire it in to the pcm..
    04 Single cab Lq4/243 228r 112lsa, Long tubes, catless, Yank st3000.

  2. #2
    Senior Tuner cobaltssoverbooster's Avatar
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    no wire it to the pcm. you need the ecu to trigger new airflow settings for idle and without the ac trigger the ecu wont switch to these tables.
    i don't know why your trying to avoid wiring it in when the gen III ecu's use a single wire ac trigger to signal the ecu of a load increase. I have the 0411 gen III harness from speedway sitting on the floor next to me. it has one spare wire to be piggy backed to the clutch feed wire for 12v ac on signal.
    I'm not familiar with the gen IV wiring but it should be the same.
    2000 Ford Mustang - Top Sportsman

  3. #3
    Advanced Tuner AutoWiz's Avatar
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    If you wanted to gain an added control feature while you are re wiring anyways. The vintage air units all come with a binary pressure switch that trips the compressor if too much or too little pressure is present to save the comp. We are a vintage air dealer and every unit we sell and install is with a trinary pressure switch that adds a fan relay control to its function. You can remove this switch (binary or trinary) and replace it with an ac pressure transducer from something like a 2002 Camaro z28 or other 0411 ecu equipped vehicle. Then build the correct a/c control for your 0411pcm as shown here..



    And now you can command your fans to turn on and off at specific ac pressures, but also there is a turn off speed setting so the fans aren't running when you are doing 80mph. This is a hard thing to create with relays and a trinary switch.

  4. #4
    I know this is a VERY old thread but I'm in the beginning process of adding a Vintage Air System to my 82 Monte and was hoping AutoWize or anyone else can collaborate on how to hook up the system as described above.

  5. #5
    Tuning Addict blindsquirrel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by monte4ever View Post
    I know this is a VERY old thread but I'm in the beginning process of adding a Vintage Air System to my 82 Monte and was hoping AutoWize or anyone else can collaborate on how to hook up the system as described above.
    Which PCM? Cause P01/P59 use (or can be set in the tune to use) a plain high/low wire to request A/C, but everything E40 & newer can only do it via Class2 serial data and require an add-on box of some kind to speak the right language.

  6. #6
    I'm using the P01 ECM. I would like for the ECM to control RPM, pressure, and fans cut-off and on.
    Last edited by monte4ever; 10-19-2019 at 08:23 AM.

  7. #7
    Tuning Addict blindsquirrel's Avatar
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    Look at System > A/C > Hardware > Type Fitted, make sure it's set to Analog.

  8. #8
    Will do. Should I hook-up a pressure sensor and binary sensor?

  9. #9
    Tuning Addict blindsquirrel's Avatar
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    You should copy the factory layout that matches whatever platform & operating system you're using. The binary/trinary junk is for when you need to control stuff without using the PCM.

  10. #10
    Ok. I'm in the beginning stages of notching my frame for compressor clearance and ordering the AC system itself. Just trying to get a heads up on which pins I have to add to the wiring harness and sensor/s to get so this doesn't become a big ass headache lol.

  11. #11
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    theres 3 wires total. 2 for fan relay grounds and a plain high/low wire to request A/C

  12. #12
    I'm using the 2002 Avalanche OS 12216125. Will the above 2002 Camaro pressure transducer work?

  13. #13
    Tuning Addict blindsquirrel's Avatar
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    The 2002 Avalanche operating system is expecting to see this arrangement - discrete high pressure switch on the high side, and discrete low pressure switch on the low side.
    2002 Avalanche manual HVAC.png

    The 2002 Camaro operating system is expecting this. Single 0-5v sensor that only enables compressor operation in a window between 35 and 414psi, plumbed only into the high side of the system. No discrete pressure switches.
    2002 Camaro manual HVAC.png

    This was what I kept trying to explain - use the wiring diagram and parts combo that matches your operating system! You can't change anything in the tune to make the Camaro OS understand that you have wired it up to discrete switches instead of a sensor, and you can't make the truck OS understand that you've connected a sensor instead of discrete switches. PICK an operating system, and then FOLLOW the wiring diagram that matches. Or do it the other way, pick a diagram that best suits your physical setup, and then use the OS that matches the diagram.

  14. #14
    Looking at those diagrams it would be easier for me to just use pin 17 (AC request) and a binary switch. I'm guessing this will cut the fans on and off plus AC pressure safety with the binary switch.

  15. #15
    Made a mistake about which vehicle the file is from. It's a 2002 5.3 Tahoe for its flex fuel capabilities but the OS is still 12216125. I see the wiring is the same as the Avalanche thou.

    I found this on another forum:
    Serial and Serial Cycling - I don't know, I've never used them
    Analog - Stock 2002 F-Body (Camaro / Firebird / TA) stock 2002 Y-Body (Corvette)
    Analog Cycling - (stock 2002 truck) I'm using this on my Thunderbird with the f-bomb compressor and hardware controlled by the GM PCM.
    Passive - I would ASSUME this means AC is fitted, but the PCM doesn't control it
    Not Fitted - self explanatory.

    Looks like through HPTuners you can select the proper switching format that you are using.
    Last edited by monte4ever; 12-21-2019 at 07:10 PM.

  16. #16
    Tuning Addict blindsquirrel's Avatar
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    If you have the stock G-body compressor wire from the A/C panel to pin 17, and the stock G-body low pressure switch on the accumulator, and the stock LS truck compressor with the built-in high pressure switch in the back, and the PCM controlling the compressor and fans, what the hell are you going to use a binary switch for??? Decoration? Hang it from the rear view mirror?

  17. #17
    Lol........Nooooooo!!! I'm using a complete kit from Arizonagn.com and I'm using a Sanden 507 compressor. I dont have anything left from the G Body AC system.
    Last edited by monte4ever; 12-22-2019 at 09:36 AM.

  18. #18
    Tuning Addict blindsquirrel's Avatar
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    If the kit is designed to be a stand alone you use whatever they include per their diagrams, you don't wire anything to the PCM and set the system options in the tune to 'not fitted'.

  19. #19
    Yea, that's looking like the best way to go.

  20. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by AutoWiz View Post
    If you wanted to gain an added control feature while you are re wiring anyways. The vintage air units all come with a binary pressure switch that trips the compressor if too much or too little pressure is present to save the comp. We are a vintage air dealer and every unit we sell and install is with a trinary pressure switch that adds a fan relay control to its function. You can remove this switch (binary or trinary) and replace it with an ac pressure transducer from something like a 2002 Camaro z28 or other 0411 ecu equipped vehicle. Then build the correct a/c control for your 0411pcm as shown here..



    And now you can command your fans to turn on and off at specific ac pressures, but also there is a turn off speed setting so the fans aren't running when you are doing 80mph. This is a hard thing to create with relays and a trinary switch.
    Just an update, using the above schematic solved all my Vitage Air wiring installation using a 2002 Camaro pressure sensor.