Just got off the phone with FIC and he thinks the 1000s could squeak by. It will cost, a lot, to go to the 1200s. Different connectors and everything, so I'll go that route if that bridge needs to be crossed. Calling HHP right now for BAP.Originally Posted by Jay@HAP
Looking at log 2, I first stabbed the gas at 3100 rpm, fuel pressure was at ~77 PSI. Stays between 77~80 until 4600 where it starts to fall gradually as the RPM increases, ending up at 55.3 PSI by 5900 RPM when I chop the throttle. As the fuel pressure starts to fall off, the IDC starts to rise sharply.
Is this the indication that the pumps aren't keeping up? Trying to learn all I can here. BAP on the way and getting wiring documentation from Kenne Bell.
Yup. As boost increases fuel pressure should increase at the same rate to keep the differental pressure the same. If the fuel pump can't keep up the PCM will open the injectors longer. So basically you are maxing out your fuel pump and the injectors are making up for it which is bad for a whole lot of reasons.
When the DC hits a certain %, the PCM will dump boost to protect itself.
Got it.
Jay pretty much covered your fueling issue. Expanding a little on that, I made a chart for you. Your current injectors should work if your fuel system with a BAP can maintain enough fuel pressure but it'll still be close towards peak RPMs. Going from E55 to E85 might push you back over the threshold with your current injectors if you decide to run E85 in the future so keep that in mind.
By the way, the fuel issue is probably not related to the knock retard you're seeing since it's retarding in the 3k rpm range, before fueling becomes an issue. You need to determine, with a reasonable level of comfort, if it's false knock or not and adjust accordingly.
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I love that chart lol I'm going to set it as the background of my laptop for a while haha. Thanks man. And I agree 100% with everything you said. I was looking at my logs from the car bone stock and can see it maintains 80 PSI until fuel cut. It boggles my mind that my tuner didn't mention anything about this and I had to stumble across this.....
Also I was going to bring up the knock thing to Jay, but didn't want to overwhelm him. Yes you can see that the knock is occurring even when no fuel issues are present, which means it's not fuel. The knock comes and goes and I can't figure that out just yet. Once I get the fuel pressure back up and possibly mildly adjust the AF, I will get back to the knock issue at hand. I want all my timing! Not 3 degrees lol
I called FIC and it would be over 1k to go to the next injector (1200). Not sure if the extra bit of HP will be worth that money. I am looking for knock resistance mostly, but HP doesn't hurt. If I will be over 90% IDC with e55 then I don't think there is anyway I can do it with e85. It's just something I will have to think about for a while.
Awesome post man thank you!
Your IDC will be a lot lower once you get the 30lbs of fuel pressure back.
Definitely some good stuff going on in this thread.
I cancelled my order for the BAP and got one locally from a buddy who just traded in his Hellcat. I have a new Hobbs switch from my last build. Kenne Bell sent me a wiring schematic which doesn't show me where all the wires are hidden. I need to figure out how to get to these wires and also where I will tap the blower for the Hobbs. Should have everything installed, including clean side can by tomorrow afternoon unless I hit snags.Your IDC will be a lot lower once you get the 30lbs of fuel pressure back.
Definitely some good stuff going on in this thread.
There's no external vacuum port that I recall to pick up boost for the Hobbs switch. I think you either have to wire it up so it runs all the time, or remove the lid and drill and tap a port.
I'm going to tell you with a bap and leaner afr I am running out of pump at the rpm I want at your afr and slightly richer .78 I was running out of pump like you are now with 1000s and no BAP with a BAP E85 and 1300s. I run the connection injectors not the clinic. With 1000s and .8 lambda I run out of pump and injector on the top end it dips to 60s with A BAP and E85. Two cars both 2.5 upper his has bwoody and I have the lmi intake. We want to spray so we def have to get more pump and he needs injectors. oh and my 1300s now that its cold max IDC with a bap thats how much pump is not keeping up.
The BAP cannot run 24/7 unless someone has figured it out will set high voltage code and put fuel controller into limp mode. I even tried it and tried to disable the code it would still throw it into limp. Drill and tap top port but it wont push 1300s to the top.... injected sells a duel drop in pump setup.
Last edited by JoshCP527; 12-01-2017 at 09:41 PM.
Good info there.
I hear everything you're saying man and I won't argue that you are out of pump. There are plenty of guys out there with a BAP and 1300s with 900 rear wheel though. I should be under 900 due to the e55 and also my fuel demand will be lower because of it as well. I am willing to entertain the idea of 1200cc injectors for sure, but I don't know about the injected setup. It's $1250 and money is tight right now. It looks like the cure-all however and keeps the system returnless which is cool.
I'm not sure what to do but I have a BAP at my finger tips and I think my injectors will make it to where I want to go. Any more thoughts are welcomed.
Last edited by slowSRT8; 12-01-2017 at 11:27 PM.
I have a 900hp e85 (about 75% Content) setup that was on a BAP but after a while it wasnt keeping up. I had ID1300's. Injected Engineering's setup is wayyyyy cheaper than a Fore triple pump setup not to mention labor savings.
I'm thinking to try the 200 dollar BAP, see where it gets me, and then next step is the injected setup when that is needed. Fore is the last resort. I did it on my last car and it was beautiful and worked well, but was a lot of work.
Um holy shit. Curts setup is flex fuel capable and he can tune for lower boost with the black key. Something I've been talking about for over a year and no one seemed to think it was possible. I'm going to send him a PM.
I'd like to go with the injected drop in setup, bigger injectors, and have Curt retune. I just spoke with him over PM.
The only thing that sucks with that route is that I won't be able to continue to learn anything. I wanted to figure this all out on my own so that I can learn along the way.
I'm going with Curts dual drop in setup, his tuning package, and I'm stepping up the injectors. See you guys soon!
I was just trying to help. I drove to their shop just to meet them and pick one up to install later. Wish it was out when i did my bap as the stock pump will do a lot no doubt just not enough for e85.
Thanks man. I'm glad I'm going this route.I was just trying to help
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