2014 Focus ST Tuning

[MrTurbo]

Hey guys,

Just picked this up on Sat for a daily to get better MPG. I have a fair amount of GM / Chrysler tuning under my belt, I read the full 20 page thread on Ecoboost tuning. Im going to read it again, but was hoping that someone would go over what I've done so far, definitely feeling improvements, unless those are just related to cooler ambient air out today...

My main concerns are that the Fueling is not consistent with the commanded, I dont want to go much further until I can get it to be.

But of course any pointers on the tune as a whole and what I am missing to increase boost more and keep throttle open longer would be greatly appreciated.

If someone wants to work directly with me I am not opposed to paying for your time.

Thanks

Stock File, Current tune, Current Log

First Read.hpt
1.2.hpt
1.2 log.hpl

[Puggyberra]

Hey guys,

Just picked this up on Sat for a daily to get better MPG. I have a fair amount of GM / Chrysler tuning under my belt, I read the full 20 page thread on Ecoboost tuning. Im going to read it again, but was hoping that someone would go over what I've done so far, definitely feeling improvements, unless those are just related to cooler ambient air out today...

My main concerns are that the Fueling is not consistent with the commanded, I dont want to go much further until I can get it to be.

But of course any pointers on the tune as a whole and what I am missing to increase boost more and keep throttle open longer would be greatly appreciated.

If someone wants to work directly with me I am not opposed to paying for your time.

Thanks

Stock File, Current tune, Current Log

First Read.hpt
1.2.hpt
1.2 log.hpl

My laptop is out of commission right now, I’ll look at those files when I can get to another computer with HPT on it (probably later tonight). If you haven’t also check out the thread ‘all kind of limits’, there is a lot of good info on there.

[MrTurbo]

My laptop is out of commission right now, I?ll look at those files when I can get to another computer with HPT on it (probably later tonight). If you haven?t also check out the thread ?all kind of limits?, there is a lot of good info on there.

Thank you very much, will check out the limit thread! appreciate your help!

[Puggyberra]

Thank you very much, will check out the limit thread! appreciate your help!

Working through a few things

-Fuel: you need to raise your enrichment rate under fuel -> power enrich, you can generally raise it quite a bit to something like .3->.5, that should help quite a bit with your leaning out during turbo spool. You should also look into raising your fuel rail pressure under fuel sys -> fuel pump -> normal. You probably only need to raise the bottom 2 cells in the 3000 rpm column, though you can raise all 6 of those cells to a higher number to help with fueling.

-Spark source cylinder pressure limit: You're logging SAE Spark advance which only reports to the nearest .5 degree instead of .1, but you can still see you are riding the cylinder pressure limit table for the entirety of the pull, raise the last 2 rows for the rpms you want increased spark in the engine -> spark -> advance -> cylinder pressure limit table.

-Combustion Stability Limit: To get around that raise max brake torque under engine -> torque management -> combustion stability limit. The easiest method is just raise that to a number the car can never hit so that it is never triggered.

-Popcorn/LSPI tables: I'm glad you didn't max these tables as I see many people do, you can return the 180 degree manifold temp row to stock though, unless you want to allow 2.0 air load when your charge temps are 180 degrees. I actually redefine that table a little to give me (in reverse order) 180->150->140->100 and then use the 140->150 as my 'soft' air load reduction for heat and my 150-> 180 as my hard limit with a max air load of somewhere in the 1.1->1.3 range. If you raise your torque tables to allow more than 2.0 air load then you'll also need to raise these tables.

If you want to see air loads higher than 2.0 you will have to redefine the labels on your indicated engine torque mapped points to a number higher than 2.0 (yes, all the tables individually 0->14 + OP). There are a few different schools of thought on how to do that with the most accurate numbers, short of using a load dyno though its all guessing to some degree. Going along with that you probably want to revert the changes you did to the inverse tables setting the cells to 2.5. The inverse tables are the ECU's 'lookup' tables for how much air load it expects to need to make a certain torque number when at Ford's test conditions (which include MBT spark and 100 degree ambient). Due to those reasons the numbers in those tables will not be the same as what you log, but they should trend similarly. Increasing the air load in those tables should result in the ecu requesting more air load, but you should make smaller incremental changes or you will cause issues.

Lastly your logging looks pretty good in that you have good resolution of the parameters you are logging, you need to log air load though. A few others you probably want to log are fuel rail pressure (that one loses resolution very quickly if you have too many parameters going), injector pulse width, octane modifier, and knock per cyl. As the ecoboosts use per cyl knock advance and retard you generally won't see anything with just the knock retard parameter logged.

Let me know how that all works out.

[MrTurbo]

Working through a few things

-Fuel: you need to raise your enrichment rate under fuel -> power enrich, you can generally raise it quite a bit to something like .3->.5, that should help quite a bit with your leaning out during turbo spool. You should also look into raising your fuel rail pressure under fuel sys -> fuel pump -> normal. You probably only need to raise the bottom 2 cells in the 3000 rpm column, though you can raise all 6 of those cells to a higher number to help with fueling.

-Spark source cylinder pressure limit: You're logging SAE Spark advance which only reports to the nearest .5 degree instead of .1, but you can still see you are riding the cylinder pressure limit table for the entirety of the pull, raise the last 2 rows for the rpms you want increased spark in the engine -> spark -> advance -> cylinder pressure limit table.

-Combustion Stability Limit: To get around that raise max brake torque under engine -> torque management -> combustion stability limit. The easiest method is just raise that to a number the car can never hit so that it is never triggered.

-Popcorn/LSPI tables: I'm glad you didn't max these tables as I see many people do, you can return the 180 degree manifold temp row to stock though, unless you want to allow 2.0 air load when your charge temps are 180 degrees. I actually redefine that table a little to give me (in reverse order) 180->150->140->100 and then use the 140->150 as my 'soft' air load reduction for heat and my 150-> 180 as my hard limit with a max air load of somewhere in the 1.1->1.3 range. If you raise your torque tables to allow more than 2.0 air load then you'll also need to raise these tables.

If you want to see air loads higher than 2.0 you will have to redefine the labels on your indicated engine torque mapped points to a number higher than 2.0 (yes, all the tables individually 0->14 + OP). There are a few different schools of thought on how to do that with the most accurate numbers, short of using a load dyno though its all guessing to some degree. Going along with that you probably want to revert the changes you did to the inverse tables setting the cells to 2.5. The inverse tables are the ECU's 'lookup' tables for how much air load it expects to need to make a certain torque number when at Ford's test conditions (which include MBT spark and 100 degree ambient). Due to those reasons the numbers in those tables will not be the same as what you log, but they should trend similarly. Increasing the air load in those tables should result in the ecu requesting more air load, but you should make smaller incremental changes or you will cause issues.

Lastly your logging looks pretty good in that you have good resolution of the parameters you are logging, you need to log air load though. A few others you probably want to log are fuel rail pressure (that one loses resolution very quickly if you have too many parameters going), injector pulse width, octane modifier, and knock per cyl. As the ecoboosts use per cyl knock advance and retard you generally won't see anything with just the knock retard parameter logged.

Let me know how that all works out.

Wow! thank you so much for taking the time to walk me through all of that! It is greatly appreciated! I will get going on this stuff and report back in the next few days!

Brandon

[MrTurbo]

Alright! all that worked like a charm! Thanks again Puggy

I started hitting "3 exhaust temp" limit but raised the Flange Temp INV under Fuel>COT and got passed that.

I'm thinking im at max turbo efficiency at this point, at Denver altitude baro is 12.2psi (82kpa) so I'm hitting about 21-23 psi.

Looks like the turbo just runs out of efficiency above 4000 rpm at these boost levels? Or is there more thats making it drop off like it does in the log at 2:34

I plan on doing meth injection next, not meth/water, but true M1 methanol since I have a barrel of the stuff and being oxygenated it will offer more power gains in addition to benefits of basic meth. Am I right to expect that the WB/ECU will detect it and compensate pretty quickly? Hopefully that will help with the few degrees of KR I get.

Anyone experience any distribution issues with spraying 12" before tb? I haven't looked to see where it is yet but would like to get it before the Manifold Charge temp sensor so it senses the temp drops. Thoughts?

1.6.hpt

1.6.hpl

[Puggyberra]

Alright! all that worked like a charm! Thanks again Puggy

I started hitting "3 exhaust temp" limit but raised the Flange Temp INV under Fuel>COT and got passed that.

I'm thinking im at max turbo efficiency at this point, at Denver altitude baro is 12.2psi (82kpa) so I'm hitting about 21-23 psi.

Looks like the turbo just runs out of efficiency above 4000 rpm at these boost levels? Or is there more thats making it drop off like it does in the log at 2:34

I plan on doing meth injection next, not meth/water, but true M1 methanol since I have a barrel of the stuff and being oxygenated it will offer more power gains in addition to benefits of basic meth. Am I right to expect that the WB/ECU will detect it and compensate pretty quickly? Hopefully that will help with the few degrees of KR I get.

Anyone experience any distribution issues with spraying 12" before tb? I haven't looked to see where it is yet but would like to get it before the Manifold Charge temp sensor so it senses the temp drops. Thoughts?

I haven’t tuned meth yet, so I can’t really comment on it unfortunately.

That boost psi sounds pretty close to maxed based on what I’m used to, do you have a log with the limits out of the way just to be sure?

[MrTurbo]

I haven’t tuned meth yet, so I can’t really comment on it unfortunately.

That boost psi sounds pretty close to maxed based on what I’m used to, do you have a log with the limits out of the way just to be sure?

Yes sir, should be attached to my last post

[Puggyberra]

Yes sir, should be attached to my last post

I take back what I said earlier, you're not anywhere near maxing your turbo. Look at your Max Torque Max Gear tables under engine -> torque management ([ECM]44792->44795), the max torque you're allowing is 376 in those tables, that's what is restricting your air load while not showing as a limit. You can see this in your scheduled torque being 420 but your ETC torque request being right at that 376 +- a little bit. Don't max those tables as you want to keep them as a fail safe, but you do need to raise them to make more power.

Likewise right now you're still riding the cylinder pressure limit for your spark, you are getting some knock retard, but your timing at 4600+ is pretty darn close to that limit. If you add meth you will get a small amount of spark increase, but not much. If you want to check what quality fuel the car actually thinks it has log Knock Octane Modifer and/or Inferred Octane. You can set the update rate of each to every 1s as they don't change rapidly and it will save you bandwidth for your other parameters. Keep in mind inferred octane is RON not the R+M/2 on the pump.

[MrTurbo]

The Max Tq Max Gear tables dont allow any value over 376... :-(

Catpure Max Tq Max Gear.JPG

[Puggyberra]

Take a look at this thread: https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...-Torque-Limits

Best guess is disable WOT Clip [ECM] 49996, and raise Desired TIP Max vs Turbo Airflow [ECM]6825.

[MrTurbo]

Take a look at this thread: https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...-Torque-Limits

Best guess is disable WOT Clip [ECM] 49996, and raise Desired TIP Max vs Turbo Airflow [ECM]6825.

Ok I'm back, sorry got swamped with work, and didn't want to push it anymore until I got meth injection on, I also got a catless DP.

I am running 100% M1 through the 500cc/min nozzle.

It seems the throttle closing got worse since my last post, despite no changes to tune until just tonight when I made some tweaks for the methanol, and tried your advice of turning off WOT Clip and Raising Desired TIP.

I'm wondering if its TIP Error being in the negative ( Tip higher than TIP Req)... Will try that tomorrow, let me know if you have any other ideas.

Meth works nicely... I think the Charge Air Temp Sensor is out of the path of the spray, but the Knock went straight to 0n at wot once I started using it in the first log shown, I need to play with it a bit more though.

Thanks again for all your help!

[MrTurbo]

My only issue seems to be the TIP actual exceeding TIP Desired everyonce in a while, every time it does even slightly, the throttle closes significantly.

The only thoughts I have are related to the tables for Max Tq Max Gear, which are limited to 376 ftlb. Wondering if this is something HPTUNERS can raise...?

Any one have any input on raising the TIP Desired?

2.9.hpt

2.9 log.hpl

[MrTurbo]

Ok made a little bit more progress:

I noticed my ETC TQ Req was always 376, suspected it was limiting me...

However the corresponding tables below were all limited in the editor to 376lb.

Max Torque Max Gear (44792)
Max Torque Max Gear Alt (44793)
Max Torque Max Gear OP (44794)
Max Torque Max Gear OP ALT (44795)

HPT awesome support came to the rescue after submitting a request to increase these, on the latest beta they added switches shown here which effectively double these numbers:

Tq Switch.JPG

From HPT:

I have added 4 new switches to your vehicle's OS that will effectively double the torque capacity for those tables. You'll need to set each of them to "On" in order for the limit to be overcome. Additionally, you'll need to adjust the values in your tables accordingly as the new limit will not be reflected in those tables at this time. So if your table shows 376, it's now going to be 752, etc... Hopefully in the future we can make the tables display appropriately, but for now this should get you further with the torque max tables.

These switches are available on the latest BETA software builds 1648 and above. I am working to get these uploaded shortly.

Let me know if you have any questions.

Cheers,
-Braden

****

Thanks CHAD and Braden! this definitely raised up the ETC Req tq, I'm now hitting upper 500's. Butt dyno shows significant increased power! Seems to have got the desired TIP up as well, just a little, but it still helps.

I still am looking for a way to raise the TIP Desired. From what I read it seems to be within the VE table. Unfortunately, the SD calculator seems to be missing in my Beta versions, but I have a ticket open with HPT to get this resolved.


ANYONE have anything to add, please do. I'm so close here.

A few more questions:

There seems to be some missing tables which correlate the allowed AIR load with IAT or ICT, when its cold out (less than 50* ambient) I can hit loads of 2.0. Warmer and I seem to get stuck at 1.7. This would be a good thing to protect the motor usually, but with the 750cc/min of pure M1 meth I am spraying, I know my chamber temps are very safe, I've already inquired with HPT about this, but if any one knows what I'm missing or has thoughts, please share.

Any way to reset LTFT's? A button under scanner controls would be great.

Lastly, I cant find any real info about tuning the Variable Cams, I feel theres a lot of power left on the table with the stock settings, I will be experimenting on the dyno soon, but advice prior is welcome.

Latest tune and log:

3.2.hpt
3.2 log.hpl


Cheers!

[Puggyberra]

I’m glad they put a method in to raise those torque tables limits, I wonder if they’re in other os’s too (like the fusion sport maybe). I’ll try to look at the log and tune to see if something stands out as limiting air load with the raised temps or limiting tip.

As for resetting ltft I believe a write entire will reset them (as well as your octane learning). I haven’t played with changing the actual cam timing, here’s a link to a thread from the coyote forums where they’re discussing it. Murfie has some good insights into that system and explains it the easiest way to understand I’ve seen.

https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...l=1#post495749

[Puggyberra]

I looked through the tune and the log and I'm coming up with nothing that's limiting you to the 1.85 air load or 70 in/hg TIP. While nothing will probably come of it if you could do a log and log brake torque and waste gate duty cycle we might be able to find a value we're missing right now. The most telling thing to me so far is your requested air load is high, and your desired airmass from torque control is where you'd expect to see it, but your TIP and MAP desired aren't there. If nothing comes of a second log I'm going to say there's a hidden limiter somewhere.

As for the other limits you're seeing some, cylinder pressure limit you've dealt with before under spark. The exhaust temperature and insufficient fuel limits I suspect are based off your requested air load of over 2.3, not what you're actually seeing (meaning while they show up right now they're not actually limting you). If you want to try and get around them try raising the your compressor outlet temperatures under airflow -> turbocharger. The fuel injector limit you'd have to extend the window, which you probably don't want to do until you get a good log of your injector timing and your fuel rail pressures.

[MrTurbo]

I looked through the tune and the log and I'm coming up with nothing that's limiting you to the 1.85 air load or 70 in/hg TIP. While nothing will probably come of it if you could do a log and log brake torque and waste gate duty cycle we might be able to find a value we're missing right now. The most telling thing to me so far is your requested air load is high, and your desired airmass from torque control is where you'd expect to see it, but your TIP and MAP desired aren't there. If nothing comes of a second log I'm going to say there's a hidden limiter somewhere.

As for the other limits you're seeing some, cylinder pressure limit you've dealt with before under spark. The exhaust temperature and insufficient fuel limits I suspect are based off your requested air load of over 2.3, not what you're actually seeing (meaning while they show up right now they're not actually limting you). If you want to try and get around them try raising the your compressor outlet temperatures under airflow -> turbocharger. The fuel injector limit you'd have to extend the window, which you probably don't want to do until you get a good log of your injector timing and your fuel rail pressures.

Thank you very much for taking the time to look through this, I am working more with HPT to try and find these hidden limits. I am going to try your other suggestions tonight tomorrow, will post results thank you again!

[Gs512mma]

How about friends .. I see this thread slowly, but I am a little new, I say that little is very new in the ecoobost focus st mk3 ... I have read in the forum what several people have done and I have understood very little, almost nothing else good ... but in trial and error I have been able to understand a little and you see backtracking .... I made a tune based on what I have seen and the truth is I was surprised since I achieved a notable difference ... but at the same time Moving some things in raleti I can't stabilize it, it goes up and down and if I accelerate it a little it tends to turn off or turn off completely .... in the run I had nothing of KD and KR in any cylinder .... I have the following modifications.

intake
big intercooler
coolpipes
blowof 100% atm
AEM methanol kit
hybrid turbo
downpipe 3 "
mamba actuator (not installed)

I am attaching the last tune ... I hope you can advise me, greetings friends ..

[skylinedan]

In regards to the Fusion Sport, what are you looking for ? I have a 17, can send you a stock file plus a heavily modded one if you like.

[Gs512mma]

hello skylinedan ... a thousand apologies but it is only the name of my file but actually I am looking for help for my focus ST ecoboost 2013 I have a log and I see a lot of knock retard in the cylinders in the run ... I don't know if my wideband is measuring wrong or there in my tune something is missing for me to refine ... if you could help me it would be great my friend attached my log and my file in case you could take a look at it, I would appreciate it very much ... greetings

my modifications is air intake, big intercooler, blowoff 100% admosferic, hybrid turbo, injection mthanol aem kit and downpipe

focus ST MAXIMO ESFUERZO 100% FINAL (1).hptlog MAXIMO ESFURZO 100%.hpl