Tons of kr at wot but practically nothing at part throttle. Just headers....any idea

[paulsmithsr]

I can fix tune just IM. Me

[lt1z350]

Like Higgs said direct injection can get fuel kr from being too rich and I?m telling you it?s not heard. I tune a lot of the ltg 2.0t engines and one terminal failure on them is broken rings from being too rich from the factory. It?s never heard I?ve seen up to 9 degrees on those and took someone?s bad tune leaned it way out and all kr gone. Think about it if you do not hear it and your desensitizing the knock sensors and goes away it?s not very loud in the first place but I?m telling you it?s still happening. Many 2.0t melt downs happen due to exactly this and you don?t see what?s going on till the motor pops and you tear it down. Two things on di that are bad for kr. Too much fuel not enough timing. I run way more then I did on port injection on my 2017 zl1 for the same boost and I?m a lot leaner. 27 degree total on 14 psi on e40 to give you and idea of how much timing. I?m up over 15 degrees in some spots on my timing on my 93 tune and I have no kr. I had to raise my knock sensors by 10 percent as had kr caused by the headers I believe as wasn?t there till I did them and it was solid 2 degeees showed up very weird. The last thing you really should do is just desensitize the knock sensors for no reason it?s a patch or cover up really and not fixing any issue. I have a katech tune from a pretty nasty z06 I got from someone to look at and they were up 8-12 percent. Probably the headers and cam causing some more noise.
If weapon x tunes like they build things it?s no wonder that do that. Curious to see what other stuff they butcher from what it sounds like. They probably turn off all the rich and lean codes too any mass air flow codes all that stuff that tells you something is out of wack. Seen a lot of (big ) tuners do this so customer don?t see a code and how far the actual tune is off.
Anyway there are couple other things that can cause the kr on these but normally only see at shift points so won?t bother with all that here. I?m going to bet the car is just too rich though.

[lt1z350]

One other good example 2018 zl1 on the dyno on ms109 a few bolt ons was helping a buddy through email as it was getting 5-6 degrees kr on the 109 with only 18-20 degrees timing. He was seeing .80 on the wideband I had him add 4 degree and told him shoot for .84-.86. Not only did all kr go away it picked up 40whp. It had 4 degrees kr from the moment it hit wot and peaked at 6 degrees and of course heard nothing.

[lt1z350]

Just in case not sure what fuel kr can look like or what it can do on a di motor. This is a 2.0t had what was thought to be false kr couldn?t hear a thing until the major failure. Had some random 2-4 degrees kr. Sometimes didn?t even show up. All 4 pistons had crushed rings in between the top and two totally metlted down. 18-19 psi on 6-8 degree of timing nothing crazy other then way too rich.
I know normal thinking is see kr throw some fuel at it to cool the cylinder. I?m sure in time on a n/a v8 your going to break a ring. No boost sure not this massive failure but still a busted ring is no fun. The fuel seems to puddle and burn in the rings from how it looks. The whole purpose of that spoon in the top is to shoot the fuel back up to burn it. Bad things happen when it?s not where it should be burning.
When my zl1 was stock I saw a lot or random kr from 6-8 degrees all it did was make the car slow and was worse when it seemed to be in cot and black smoking on some runs at the track. First thing I did when tuned it was lean it out turn off any cot or piston protection. No more kr and noticeably quicker on just playing with fuel hadn?t even added any timing yet back then. Really don?t want to see anyone tear a car up. The worst part of di I have found is you cannot even trust what the wideband is telling you as fuel can be going out an open exhaust valve and not being burnt. But not boosted so don?t think that will be a problem on the setup here.

[tunerpro]

If weapon x tunes like they build things it?s no wonder that do that. Curious to see what other stuff they butcher from what it sounds like. They probably turn off all the rich and lean codes too any mass air flow codes all that stuff that tells you something is out of wack. Seen a lot of (big ) tuners do this so customer don?t see a code and how far the actual tune is off.

Ok, we can add another to the list of tuners that lt1z350 has bad mouthed.

[lt1z350]

Tunerunpro, I just tell it how it is if it bothers you then you must be one of them too that fucks people. I surely don’t do this for money but more so to help others learn or fix screwed up stuff to the best of my knowledge and a lot of time it’s with help of other buddies doing the same thing. I don’t know what your problem is but you never add a single useful thing to this form ever. Go back to what ever hole you crawl out when just make snide comments. You obviously must work for someone that tunes just to take money or you don’t even tune just steal from others hard work. What ever it is your fucking useless. Sorry to those looking up a thread and trying to lean that you have to waste time reading crap like this as some just should go away.
As for a company setting the knock sensors completely out of limits to read most kr that shows up that’s butchering the tune. You think GM engineers chose what they did as its way out of the useful range? That alone speaks of your intelligence on the subject. So that on any turbo 2.0t or 3.6tt see what that gets you if some one accidentally gets some bad gas. Most likely the low octane table is matching the high too so has no chance to save itself.

[jpierro79]

id say your runing way to lean your car is tryint to add fuel everywhere your ltft are adding 8 percent fuel just to keep up on cruising trims get it tuned asap you have to have different o2 settings for headers other wise car will run wayyyyy lean!!!!

[djyankees31]

Ok, we can add another to the list of tuners that lt1z350 has bad mouthed.

I appreciate all the help and information provided by lt1z350. Most people usually provide only a few words that not very helpful or suggest you PM them for help only to receive "Send me $250 and I'll help".

Also, everyone that's taken a look at the tune provided by WX, also agrees that the tune was total crap and it was $750. I started over with a tune but used about 10-15% of what was in the WX tune. Plus changed all the untouched or disabled areas that made the car almost not driveable.

[JASON11WS6]

Wow this tread really took off. I think we can all take away that LT motors get a lot of false knock so don't just start pulling timing and over adding fuel to compensate. When we had this knock spike we checked to see if some removed timing would help. It didn't and then we tried to add some fuel..didn't help. Bumped the knock sensors up a little bit seemed to do the trick. Obviously this isn't something you want to practice regularly but when you look to see how sensitive the GEN V sensors are set it make plenty of sense to raise them up a bit (with in reason). This is also assuming you've done your math and the rest of the tune is fine. Obviously if the torque tables and driver demand tables aren't set right you can have a whole bunch of new problems. Those issues should all be corrected before you even get to wot tuning anyway.

[HNK]

One other good example 2018 zl1 on the dyno on ms109 a few bolt ons was helping a buddy through email as it was getting 5-6 degrees kr on the 109 with only 18-20 degrees timing. He was seeing .80 on the wideband I had him add 4 degree and told him shoot for .84-.86. Not only did all kr go away it picked up 40whp. It had 4 degrees kr from the moment it hit wot and peaked at 6 degrees and of course heard nothing.

Would you still recommend going with that mix on a 14-15 lbs c7z06? 20-21deg with a can of boostane

[DGS]

The ring issues on 2.0 LTG is due to spark knock between the rings. Supposedly the original Dexos oil caused precipitation of calcium to build up between rings causing hot spots and predetination. This cracked the pistons between the rings. Now we use full syn 5w30. They also reworked the ecm/tcm tunes, modified timing, reduced redline, and went to colder spark plugs.

[Ghostnotes]

The ring issues on 2.0 LTG is due to spark knock between the rings. Supposedly the original Dexos oil caused precipitation of calcium to build up between rings causing hot spots and predetination. This cracked the pistons between the rings. Now we use full syn 5w30. They also reworked the ecm/tcm tunes, modified timing, reduced redline, and went to colder spark plugs.

I noticed that going with different plugs helped my KR issues with my GENV with a cam change. Heck even worn plugs or improperly gaped will cause it. Was tuning a boosted C6 and KR was killing me, had plugs that were too hot..sometimes it NOT the tune....remember the basics

If weapon x tunes like they build things it?s no wonder that do that. Curious to see what other stuff they butcher from what it sounds like. They probably turn off all the rich and lean codes too any mass air flow codes all that stuff that tells you something is out of wack. Seen a lot of (big ) tuners do this so customer don?t see a code and how far the actual tune is off.
Anyway there are couple other things that can cause the kr on these but normally only see at shift points so won?t bother with all that here. I?m going to bet the car is just too rich though.

Had a tuner pretty much do the same thing to me early on. Was telling him i had knock, I was watching it while scanning, this was before i had a grasp on the GEN-V so i figured it would be a good idea to let a "pro" do it and i could reverse engineer it. He told me it was FALSE knock, im like dude I can hear it!!! He said there is no way i am getting knock at low rpm/high load.....that was the end of that, luckly i only lost $300.00. Looking back, the tune was absolute JUNK. After i got a handle on it, it took me about 10 minutes and 2 scans to get my idle stable on a large cam and gained 60RWHP afterwards. My wife has a 2.0t in her CT-6 and i am thinking of seeing what i can get out of the stock setup..

[Wheeler]

Ouch

Just in case not sure what fuel kr can look like or what it can do on a di motor. This is a 2.0t had what was thought to be false kr couldn?t hear a thing until the major failure. Had some random 2-4 degrees kr. Sometimes didn?t even show up. All 4 pistons had crushed rings in between the top and two totally metlted down. 18-19 psi on 6-8 degree of timing nothing crazy other then way too rich.
I know normal thinking is see kr throw some fuel at it to cool the cylinder. I?m sure in time on a n/a v8 your going to break a ring. No boost sure not this massive failure but still a busted ring is no fun. The fuel seems to puddle and burn in the rings from how it looks. The whole purpose of that spoon in the top is to shoot the fuel back up to burn it. Bad things happen when it?s not where it should be burning.
When my zl1 was stock I saw a lot or random kr from 6-8 degrees all it did was make the car slow and was worse when it seemed to be in cot and black smoking on some runs at the track. First thing I did when tuned it was lean it out turn off any cot or piston protection. No more kr and noticeably quicker on just playing with fuel hadn?t even added any timing yet back then. Really don?t want to see anyone tear a car up. The worst part of di I have found is you cannot even trust what the wideband is telling you as fuel can be going out an open exhaust valve and not being burnt. But not boosted so don?t think that will be a problem on the setup here.