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Thread: Anybody else tackling flex fuel tuning?

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    Anybody else tackling flex fuel tuning?

    Just starting to dip my toes into it just curious if anyone else has been toying with it or if you just made an E85 tune completely separate from your E10 tune? I'm learning alot just by observing the results. It was also interesting to find the 93 I've been using is only E5.
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    It doesn't have to be perfect, it just needs to be done in two weeks...

    A wise man once said "google it"

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    do tones of flex fuel tuning on NA cars, on boosted cars I usually do dedicated e85 tunes since the flex fuel tune usually doesn't infers the correct e% on the first fill up bc of the fuel still in the lines and the bucket. It throws off the learning for the first fe minutes until you start to actually move ethanol through them. So e85 could infer as e40 or e50 because of this. You can reset KAM and force a relearn again once you have ethanol in the lines and it will infer semi correct at this point

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    Senior Tuner Higgs Boson's Avatar
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    my raptor (ecoboost) is set up for flex fuel. did you have any specific questions?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Higgs Boson View Post
    my raptor (ecoboost) is set up for flex fuel. did you have any specific questions?
    Not as of yet other than to bring the topic back up as I think E85 tuning could be a huge part of the industry for years to come.
    It doesn't have to be perfect, it just needs to be done in two weeks...

    A wise man once said "google it"

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    Senior Tuner Higgs Boson's Avatar
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    threads about E85 tuning on HPT Forum since 2005 (13 years ago) and in the Ford section since 2008. I think you're right, it could become a huge part of the industry. ;-)

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    Advanced Tuner LastPlace's Avatar
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    What WOT lambda do you guys prefer to command with e85?

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    .85 works really well

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    Has anyone compared cylinder head temps on 93 to E85 at different WOT lambdas?

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    My old Lund flex fuel tune kept CHT down quite a bit. I don’t have any of the logs anymore and they were not normalized for Lambda but it ran about 10 degrees cooler cruising and about 15 or more when pushed at high ambient temps NA.

  10. #10
    interesting topic... can it blend the spark over if your running from 93 to e85 & also cater for cold start ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by b00sty View Post
    interesting topic... can it blend the spark over if your running from 93 to e85 & also cater for cold start ?
    Most operating systems(including mine) have FF specific spark tables ie multiplier & adder tables that will determine how much spark to add for a specific fuel blend. Same thing with cold start there are specific tables IIRC
    It doesn't have to be perfect, it just needs to be done in two weeks...

    A wise man once said "google it"

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    Advanced Tuner bbrooks98's Avatar
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    I think the biggest issue is the inferred stoich. It seems like it takes two fills to really get close to the true value. I would recommend an actual flex sensor to see how close the inferred values are though.
    Last edited by bbrooks98; 11-24-2018 at 08:31 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by bbrooks98 View Post
    I think the biggest issue is the inferred stoich. It seems like it takes too fills to really get close to the true value. I would recommend an actual flex sensor to see how close the inferred values are though.
    You think new o2 sensors would learn quicker?

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    there are settings you can adjust to force a longer learning period. That should help. Biggest issues I had were when the car learned too quickly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Bill@HPTuners View Post
    Most operating systems(including mine) have FF specific spark tables ie multiplier & adder tables that will determine how much spark to add for a specific fuel blend. Same thing with cold start there are specific tables IIRC
    the FFV modifiers and FFV multipliers do not work in 11-17 cars, you're mostly relying on KR to add the extra timing you can get from e85. I have noticed that on the 18+ ECM the FFV modified and multipliers do work though

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    Senior Tuner Higgs Boson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bbrooks98 View Post
    I think the biggest issue is the inferred stoich. It seems like it takes two fills to really get close to the true value. I would recommend an actual flex sensor to see how close the inferred values are though.
    the tune is set up wrong then, my stoich is correct within 30 seconds of one fill.

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    Advanced Tuner bbrooks98's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Higgs Boson View Post
    the tune is set up wrong then, my stoich is correct within 30 seconds of one fill.
    That's a pretty blanket statement. What's wrong about it? How does the all the fuel from the rail and line get burned in 30seconds with a returnless system?
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    Senior Tuner Higgs Boson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bbrooks98 View Post
    That's a pretty blanket statement. What's wrong about it? How does the all the fuel from the rail and line get burned in 30seconds with a returnless system?
    I'd have to see your tune to tell you but it doesn't take TWO FILLS......

    If I had to "guess" your airflow criteria is wrong not allowing you to stay within the boundaries long enough to complete a reading.

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    Advanced Tuner bbrooks98's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Higgs Boson View Post
    I'd have to see your tune to tell you but it doesn't take TWO FILLS......

    If I had to "guess" your airflow criteria is wrong not allowing you to stay within the boundaries long enough to complete a reading.

    Everything so far is copied over from a Flex fuel F150. But i'll give it look thanks.
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    It normally takes a few miles of driving to get rid of the fuel in the lines and the bucket, then it will start to use e85, I set the refill to 10% and th 2 boxes over them that are 5 stock to 10, forget their name, then let is learn, if you leave it at 5 it will "learn" faster, but it normally locks in a incorrect value, you can test the by letting it "learn" after a fill, driving it to hand tank, reset KAM, let it learn again, and see if it learned the same value, if not, then your tune needs more work since it locked in the wrong value too quickly