Results 1 to 16 of 16

Thread: Can I swap a EGS52 with an EGS53?

  1. #1
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    539

    Can I swap a EGS52 with an EGS53?

    I know it works I've done it but took it back out. \
    I'm just not sure of the PWM button under the General tab. And the 27 torque converter settings under the torque management tab. Otherwise they are nearly identical as far as what can be seen.

    Also I guess these hold DTC's? I have 3 of these and when I swap them in and read codes I get 5 out of one, one out of another, and one has no codes. Can't erase them under any function in the scanner, P codes or U codes.

    I want to do this because I can't get vcm editor to write to an EGS52. Support has no solution and when I search google I see the big announcement all over the place about how this can now write EGS52 and EGS53.

    These are the TCM's I'd be swapping out. An '06 magnum hemi police car with a 52 and an '08 charger police hemi police car with a 53.

    Any information would be greatly appreciated.

    Attachment 85722

    Attachment 85723
    Last edited by Jason B; 12-28-2018 at 08:42 PM.

  2. #2
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Apr 2014
    Posts
    704
    I wonder why you aren't able to write to your EGS52 TCM, I have no issues writing to mine in my '06 Jeep GC SRT-8. Are you on an up-to-date version of HP Tuners VCM Suite?

  3. #3
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    539
    Quote Originally Posted by B00STJUNKY View Post
    I wonder why you aren't able to write to your EGS52 TCM, I have no issues writing to mine in my '06 Jeep GC SRT-8. Are you on an up-to-date version of HP Tuners VCM Suite?
    I've been in contact with support and they sent me a beta version to try, it didn't work and they have no idea why. I can read an EGS52 tcm and write to it one time, after that one write things are weird like so far some things I changed were written some were not. And the car does weird crap afterwards, like falls on it's face with wot, autostick may or may not work. It even bricked one tcm, it doesn't even see it when I try to read or write it and the car slams into gear (obviously I never drove it with that one afterwards).
    Tried three different laptops and a desktop, different cables, different battery in the car.

    I wish someone would respond about this. I can write a EGS53 just fine. Now in their big announcement about being able to tune EGS52/EGS53 tcm's they say some older versions of the EGS53 are not supported so editor will automatically update the OS on those and it will work. It seems strange because the 53 is the newer version. It seems it's updating every one of my 52's with a corrupt OS, because, like I said, it will write to each of the 5 that I have one time. Only one time, then it's screwed up.

  4. #4
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    539
    If you want, read this.
    The quotes at the end are interesting, I'm not the only one who has had this problem apparently.

    https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...514#post553514

  5. #5
    Tuner in Training
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Posts
    30
    Well, I am planning on experimenting with an NGC4 ECM and EGS53 TCM in my 06 300c. I was googling and it seems the swap from egs52 to egs53 is common. The Mopar Performance TCM, commonly referred to as MTCM, is apparently just an egs53 from what I have read online. So when I am able (I broke my leg and am somewhat immobile now), I plan on doing this swap myself. It seems you have more parameters available to adjust with the 53 anyway as you have found. It doesn't seem worth the hassle to mess with the egs52 if the Hptuner software is buggy.

    I also plan on trying to bench tune the TCM. It should be possible now that I have gotten ECM bench tuning working.

    Also, I don't believe there is anything special about the fact that your TCMs came out of police package cars. For 05/06 egs52 there are only two tunes. One generic and one SRT tune. For 2007-2008 there is only one egs53 tune for all cars. In 2009-2010, another egs53 tune for all cars. In 2011, that is the first year of a police specific tune, and a separate tune for everything else. Another in police specific 2012 and 2013.
    Last edited by Rockhound; 12-29-2018 at 11:56 AM.

  6. #6
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    539
    The only thing I have noticed about the police tcm's is the autostick appears differently, maybe because police vehicles use a column shifter. I have the original tcm out of my car and one out of a 1-06 build 300 hemi. Both have the same exact numbers on the sticker except the serial number. With the 300 tcm I can put it in autostick when not moving and run the gear position up to 4th. Not sure if it'll start in fourth I didn't try. And you're right, the programming you see is identical, so is that programmed somewhere that can't be seen... Like a parameter we can't access with hptuners.

    Maybe I'll just swap the 53 in.

    Any chance you'd share the wiring for bench tuning a tcm? I have the plug ends for the tcm and the aldl connector. I use one on gm pcms and it's only 4 wires. Can't be that easy could it?

  7. #7
    Tuner in Training
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Posts
    30
    Well you can use this site to see the pinouts on the connectors. http://connectors.dcctools.com/home.htm The transmission is called Module-Transmission control. It looks like 5 wires. Positive, ground and the two can bus wires. You will likely need to use a 120 ohm resistor between the can+ and can- wires otherwise the can bus will not activate.

  8. #8
    Tuner in Training
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Posts
    30
    Quote Originally Posted by Jason B View Post
    The only thing I have noticed about the police tcm's is the autostick appears differently, maybe because police vehicles use a column shifter. I have the original tcm out of my car and one out of a 1-06 build 300 hemi. Both have the same exact numbers on the sticker except the serial number. With the 300 tcm I can put it in autostick when not moving and run the gear position up to 4th. Not sure if it'll start in fourth I didn't try. And you're right, the programming you see is identical, so is that programmed somewhere that can't be seen... Like a parameter we can't access with hptuners.

    Maybe I'll just swap the 53 in.

    Any chance you'd share the wiring for bench tuning a tcm? I have the plug ends for the tcm and the aldl connector. I use one on gm pcms and it's only 4 wires. Can't be that easy could it?
    Interestingly, I think you are right, and I just found out why. I bought an NGC4 ECM and it arrived today. I just bench flashed it with 07 5.7 300C SRT programming (05094807AK) and the ECM flash file actually does contain extra programming for the TCM. After the ECM finished, it was searching for the TCM to inject some code as well. I was surprised to see that. So that extra programming is actually coming from the ECM flash file and why two same part numbered EGS53 TCM controllers behave differently when you are trying them out. Pretty neat. Well I will experiment with trying some of the various police tunes too at some point to see which feels stronger and which tunes the trans better. I am looking forward to the experimentation.

  9. #9
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    539
    Should I be flashing the ecm and tcm with every change even if I don't change anything in the ecm tune?
    And especially if I swap the tcm only.

    Thanks for the wiring diagram site. You wouldn't happen to have a diagram of your benchtop setup you'd like to share would you?

  10. #10
    Tuner in Training
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Posts
    30
    To make the bench flash cable, you just need to connect the obd2 connector with the trans connector. Can+ to Can+ etc. To make my ECM cable, I followed this thread: https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...7-Hemi-pin-out
    If you follow those pinout connections including the j1850 one, and use a 120 ohm resistor between the can bus wires, you will have made a cable that can read and flash all NGC style Chrysler pcms from 2003 NGC1 to 2012 NGC4. I just used crimp connectors to join the wires, but soldering them is probably better. But I have flashed hundreds using those crimp connectors without any hiccups. I will likely splice in some connectors so I can add the wires for the TCM connectors too so that I can flash those in the future too. It should be quite easy to add TCM flashing.

    As far as flashing both the ecm and tcm after every change in either one; no, you don't need to do that. Sorry I wasn't clear when I was speaking earlier. I was actually using a j2534 pass thru and using the official files downloaded directly from Chrysler's tech authority website to flash the ECM I bought. Inside that official Chrysler flash file for the ECM, there is also TCM programming too; which I didn't know about. The 2006 flash files do not try to program the TCM at all, but the 07 files seem to have TCM code too. Likely the later years all have TCM code included in the ECM flash files too.
    Last edited by Rockhound; 12-30-2018 at 08:32 PM.

  11. #11
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    539
    I may try a TCM only benchtop set up.
    Thanks for the information.

  12. #12
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    539
    Quote Originally Posted by Rockhound View Post
    To make the bench flash cable, you just need to connect the obd2 connector with the trans connector. Can+ to Can+ etc. To make my ECM cable, I followed this thread: https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...7-Hemi-pin-out
    If you follow those pinout connections including the j1850 one, and use a 120 ohm resistor between the can bus wires, you will have made a cable that can read and flash all NGC style Chrysler pcms from 2003 NGC1 to 2012 NGC4. I just used crimp connectors to join the wires, but soldering them is probably better. But I have flashed hundreds using those crimp connectors without any hiccups. I will likely splice in some connectors so I can add the wires for the TCM connectors too so that I can flash those in the future too. It should be quite easy to add TCM flashing.

    As far as flashing both the ecm and tcm after every change in either one; no, you don't need to do that. Sorry I wasn't clear when I was speaking earlier. I was actually using a j2534 pass thru and using the official files downloaded directly from Chrysler's tech authority website to flash the ECM I bought. Inside that official Chrysler flash file for the ECM, there is also TCM programming too; which I didn't know about. The 2006 flash files do not try to program the TCM at all, but the 07 files seem to have TCM code too. Likely the later years all have TCM code included in the ECM flash files too.
    Check this out. I found two resistors that equaled 130 ohms, an old linksys transformer, and some wire nuts. https://youtu.be/QCyGLYKJ5Js

  13. #13
    Tuner in Training
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Posts
    30
    Awesome! I was pretty sure it would work. The resistor is the key. It took me a long time to figure that out. LOL If you don't want to do a read, but just see if it is working, instead of pressing read, you can press "gather info" it will then tell you what controller you have etc without taking the time to do a full read.

    By the way, I scored a used, but supposedly good, Mopar Performance TCM on ebay for $55. It does say EGS53 on it. When I get it and I have scanned it, I will see if I can clone it. I don't see why not.
    Last edited by Rockhound; 12-31-2018 at 08:15 PM.

  14. #14
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    539
    Quote Originally Posted by Rockhound View Post
    Awesome! I was pretty sure it would work. The resistor is the key. It took me a long time to figure that out. LOL If you don't want to do a read, but just see if it is working, instead of pressing read, you can press "gather info" it will then tell you what controller you have etc without taking the time to do a full read.

    By the way, I scored a used, but supposedly good, Mopar Performance TCM on ebay for $55. It does say EGS53 on it. When I get it and I have scanned it, I will see if I can clone it. I don't see why not.
    I'd be interested in a copy of that if you can clone it.

    One thing with this setup I made, so far I have written to an EGS52 once. I'm getting ready to see if I can write to it a few times because for some reason when the tcm is in the car it will only write once. And now looking at how simple this wiring is and how important the resistor is I wonder if the resistance between the can wires in the car is not what it should be.

    Big thanks to you Rockhound, this is exactly what I wanted to be able to do. (I'm going to make it neat later).

  15. #15
    Tuner in Training
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Posts
    30
    You are welcome! I hope you have success. I somehow doubt it will work outside of the car when it wouldn't work in the car but who knows. As you hsve found out, others have had trouble too. So in my opinion it is not worth the effort to mess with the 52. Move on to the 53 and tune to your heart's content. Keep the 52 for backup or something.

  16. #16
    Tuner in Training
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Posts
    30
    I was just reading on the lxforums, and even the resident TCM expert over there does not recommend the 05/06 TCM for tuning:

    Quote Originally Posted by hemituner
    ....I do not recommend using the 05 or 06 TCM as a foundation. It is limited in its capabilities.
    That also goes hand in hand with what Mopar did as well. They didn't bother with the egs52 for their Performance TCM, they went to the 53 also.