Hellcat timing and knock sensors

[Speedy!]

I've spent the past couple weeks reading through all the threads that a search term "Hellcat" brought up. This one was particularly helpful so thanks to @jay@hap for that.

https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...hlight=Hellcat

So I think I fully understand fueling, stoich, and how PE effects fueling and by adding an amount to stoich.

I'm still a bit confused on timing and how the knock sensors impact STKR. It seemed in that thread some were suggesting multiplying the knock sensor threshold settings per cylinder by 1.5x or 2x especially on pullied Hellcats since the blower gets louder. That doesn't seem like a good idea, unless you can test the car with a ton of octane to know it's false knock for sure.

I did some road testing this weekend with some results I didn't expect and am hoping you guys in the know can help. Stock Hellcat running 93 octane (have tried Shell, Speedway, and Kroger) and all had the same results of 3ish degrees of consistent STKR bone stock at WOT. Kinda crazy considering these things are tuned to run on 91 from the factory. I would normally drop in a gallon or two of 109 and re-test, but I didn't have any so I put 2oz of Boostane Pro in about 5gallons of Speedway 93 to retest which would make about 98-99 octane according to their mix chart.

Logs showed a significant reduction in STKR (almost none), BUT the knock sensor volts didn't seem to be any lower between the two logs. I was still seeing 1.3 - 1.5V from the sensors in a few places I'd normally see STKR in 93 octane logs, only there was no STKR, or .5 deg vs the normal 3 deg I'd see on just 93.

So, is there something else influencing STKR besides the knock sensors themselves and it adds up these variables to determine the multiplier to use for STKR or ? I expected to see not only less STKR but also a reduction in knock sensor volts.

Finally, the knock sensor threshold table per cylinder...assume the value is in volts?

The knock sensor tables I'm referring to are in Engine -> knock sensor -> cyl 1, cyl 2, etc.

[spoolboy]

This video is pretty good at explaining how (some, most, ?) modern ECUs detect knock vs noise.

It has to do with the timing (as in crankshaft degrees) of the sound of knock that the sensors pick up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uJqk3m-I9hg

[JoshCP527]

I could go over it with you in person todd mentioned it before. Dodge uses the knock sensors to "tune" for 91 bad 93 and the odd mishaps in the temp timing modifiers that are pretty crude in their control.

[Speedy!]

Thanks Josh, Todd's got my number just let me know when you have the time. Would love to pick your brain on this a bit.

[Speedy!]

This video is pretty good at explaining how (some, most, ?) modern ECUs detect knock vs noise.

It has to do with the timing (as in crankshaft degrees) of the sound of knock that the sensors pick up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uJqk3m-I9hg

That guy was a bit difficult to watch, but I get the gist of what he was saying LOL. I've got the stock Demon and Demon Crate files to compare as well as the stock Hellcat and can see the differences in the Knock window angle.

[Speedy!]

Anyone know the Hellcat PID to log for crank angle the correlates to the "Window End" table in the tune file?