Flex Fuel retune

[Hulk408]

I am new to tuning, I upgraded the engine in my car, we bored it 40 over and bigger new pistons. The tune that was in the car was good, just needed some work for WOT. I am attempting to re calibrate my VE table. I have gone through and set up my file for this. I would like to do this with my wideband only. I have turned off my LTFT and STFT and disabled the DFCO. I am not 100% that I got everything. I am going to attach a copy of my file to be looked at to make sure I did not miss anything. I tired this before and was chasing my tail I would gather data and it would be anywhere from 5 to 10% rich so I would look for trends and hand blend the areas. Then my next log everything 180 in the opposite direction 5 to 10% lean. Needless to say it was a little frustrating. I also noticed that the scanner was still displaying LTFT but I had disabled the LTFT learn and was not sure it was actually being applied to the file. I will attach the log files as well so you can see what I am talking about. Another question is what is good time to drive around for. I personally have gotten 500 to 1400 kits per cell within 5 to 10 mins of driving. From what I have read people drive for upwards to 30 mins collecting data. Any help would great thanks in advance. March 10 GTO 410 base.hptmar 9 no futrim run 3 3600rpm ve 93.hplmar 10 no futrim run 1 ve 93.hpl

Like I said I am new to this and was unaware that the initial setup of my Hp Tuners did not allow me change the displacement.(this has been corrected) So the information I gathered was crap but it does not explain why it went 180 in the opposite direction. I also believe I was making correction in the proper manner. For instance if I wanted to add 5% I would Multiply the sections by 1.05 and if i was taking 5 i would multiply it by .95.

[Lakegoat]

From looking at your scan, it is running a little rich. If you multiply sections like you were doing, only use half of what you think you need. After you write the calibration, be sure to clear fuel trims in the scanner with key on before you crank the car. Then it is best to drive a few minutes before you start scanning or you will continue to chase your tail. If you get within 4% either way, that's pretty close. Let the car sit overnight, go out the next day and start logging and it will be off the other way--just the way it goes. You will never get it 0 every day.

[Hulk408]

Thanks for the reply. That makes sense to clear the fuel trims before I make any logs. I will try making the changes by half.

[Lakegoat]

Another thing, If you are running 93 octane now and then go to E85, that same tune will be just about right as far as fuel. I think that I saw you had flex enabled? If you go lean on 93, it will be real lean on corn juice.

[Hulk408]

I do have flex fuel enabled, I just planned on doing the same tuning process when I switch over to E85. Have you seen any better tuning results using a wide band specifically or using fuel trims as well?

[Lakegoat]

Wideband is the most accurate. And you have to have a wideband for wot tuning. If you are just doing some clean up tuning in the lower rpm areas, you can use stft's but still turn off LTFT, DFCO, COT and then tune. My LTFT's are off all of the time.

[Hulk408]

That's what I have heard. I plan on trying to get my tables as dialed on with straight wide band only. I appreciate the advise thanks.

[Lakegoat]

I can't paste a picture on PM's. I changed your ve table a little to get you a head start on leaning it out. Bad part is you have to input in a lot of numbers by hand. If you are N/A, you are not using much of that ve table--only up to about 105kpa. So you could change the numbers up to 120kpa so it won't take so long. when you get the changes done, write calibration, let it idle for a few minutes and check it on the scanner.

[Lakegoat]

This is more likely the shape that your ve table will take once you get it sorted out. Purely for info. I am sure these numbers will be a lot different for your setup.

[Hulk408]

Wow thanks much appreciated.

[Hulk408]

I can't paste a picture on PM's. I changed your ve table a little to get you a head start on leaning it out. Bad part is you have to input in a lot of numbers by hand. If you are N/A, you are not using much of that ve table--only up to about 105kpa. So you could change the numbers up to 120kpa so it won't take so long. when you get the changes done, write calibration, let it idle for a few minutes and check it on the scanner.

I was able to add all the cells information in didnt take that long. I have attached a log file. Its still running really rich at idle. Would there be be any additional tables that are adding fuel. I know the alcohol % is still about 10 but the commanded lambda is still 1.00 and its running about .84.

[Lakegoat]

Do you have 147# injectors in you setup? Return style setup? Sometimes injectors that big have problems idling. Try lowering min fuel milligrams to .015 and see if that helps.
I would turn on STFT's and see what they say at idle. Idling at 80kpa is a little high unless you have a big lumpy cam.
If STFT's agree with your wideband--or close, then pull some more fuel from the ve table in the idle areas. Your wideband says the 1500-1600 rpm area is running at about stoich.

[Hulk408]

Thanks for the reply, I have a set of ID1300 injectors, with a return style system and a good size cam. (specs attached) I did what you said about turning on the STFT and it dropped back to commanded eq ratio. I did turn on the command close loop in the scanner cause at first it was not picking up any readings. I had to restart the scanner cause the initial reading was super lean cause the car was trying to start. After I restarted it the command closed loop was not lit up and i let it run. The STFT were reading zero after about 10 mins of running and the EQ ratio was running about about 2.5% rich. mar 11 410 base lean ve test 15% reduction STFT enabled.hplCam specs comp cam 54-479-11.jpg

[cobaltssoverbooster]

as long as you are utilizing the vacuum port on that regulator then your fuel settings should look something like these. Check the transient fuel section for a fuel min mg setting that has been changed as well.
the rest of the file is a stock 6.0 denali so only the injector and transient fuel min mg are accurate for your app.

injectors starting around the 700 cc range have issues spraying fuel down low. the ecu needs the ability to lower the pulse width and the fuel min mg setting is a min pulse cap. this has to be reduced in order to let the injectors be commanded lower. it could be most of your rich idle issue but according to ID's injector settings i see some small discrepancies. just check the file i posted to see what ID calls for from their calibration sheet when using a vacuum referenced return regulator.
***FYI the fuel pressure must be set to 58 psi with the vacuum line disconnected. after that initial adjustment you can reinstall it and leave it alone.

[Lakegoat]

Is that where you wanted it? Looks like idle is about as good as it will get, pulling only 2% fuel. I would still change the min fuel milligram setting.

[Hulk408]

Yes that is what I was looking for, I just found it really odd that it was running so rich when the STFT were turned off. I know that when I go to adjust the rest of the table I am going to have to turn the fuel trims off to dial it in with the wideband and I dont want it running rich like that again at idle.

[cobaltssoverbooster]

for future readers i posted a file with values for the gen 2 ID1300X injectors. the op's injectors are gen1 ID1300. the data is different.
bumping the injector normal table to around 6.2 at operating temp can help as well.

[Lakegoat]

Try to get some feedback on changing your ve table back to a 1 bar (15-105kpa). If you are planning on staying N/A, I believe it would make tuning easier for you. You can still keep your 3 bar MAP sensor.

[Hulk408]

I'm not N/A I have a F1C procharger.

[Lakegoat]

I didn't see that in your post. Does this car have open headers?