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Thread: Question on Hp tuners DFCO / CFCO 2016 camaro 2SS M6. Need more burble / pops on dece

  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by TriPinTaZ View Post
    Tadge himself didn't tell me so I guess it could not be the reason at all. But looking at the tunes from the 2019+ vs the older ones, there is almost no other changes. At least none that would affect engine operation. The purpose of the minimum spark from what I can tell in my experience is that it sets the floor for Torque Management Advance to use spark to reduce delivered torque. By lowering this table it allows TMA to pull values down into the range that start causing pop and burbles. If you're disputing my theory perhaps you could offer alternate views?




    Yes you should be able to without incident. If you find the car displays any drive-ability issues then I would just keep the stock values at the .20 and higher airmass and maybe blend them into the .16 and lower. .12 and lower are the hard decel areas and it blends into the .16 row at times so you might have to play with it.

    For what it's worth my .08-.16 rows are lower than this table in Minimum Base Spark but are exactly whats shows in the image for Long Term Minimum. I do it this way since I still have DFCO enabled. If you disable DFCO you can just make both tables the same. I get a good amount of nice pops and burbles before and during DFCO entry and then they stop when fuel is cut and the spark references the Long Term Minimum table. Perfect for how I want my Z06 to sound.
    Its extremely surprising to me they went through all the trouble with emissions recertification just to get this ricery sounding exhaust noise. Making any changes to the min spark tables seems like to me it would be a huge bureaucratic hurdle since it seems to me this table ensures emissions compliance no matter what the ECM tried to command torque and therefore timing at. But seeing no other changes as well its got to be why they did it for the noise.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jonblarc7 View Post
    What is the reason for DFCO? Fuel mileage?

    I tried what you posted TriPinTaZ on my L86 with headers and no cats and DFCO enabled. But I didn't really here any difference. I'm going to take 5 more out of if and see what it sounds like. I would like to just get a-little gargle and pop.-

    DFCO is for fuel mileage yes and emissions to some extent. IF it doesn't make a difference you need to verify that on decel that your Airmass is in the area where you are making the changes.


    Quote Originally Posted by cmitchell17 View Post
    Its extremely surprising to me they went through all the trouble with emissions recertification just to get this ricery sounding exhaust noise. Making any changes to the min spark tables seems like to me it would be a huge bureaucratic hurdle since it seems to me this table ensures emissions compliance no matter what the ECM tried to command torque and therefore timing at. But seeing no other changes as well its got to be why they did it for the noise.
    I think it sounds great. And it was a bureaucratic effort to make the change. But there isn't any change in fuel mileage by making the DFCO entry more audible.
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  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by TriPinTaZ View Post
    Reduce the timing in the Minimum Spark Base and Long Term to 5 degrees in the .04, .08 and .12 rows where you want the pops on decel. 5 degrees of timing will make the popping rather aggressive so you can increase the timing values from there to fine tune how much you want.
    Do you mess with the Spark -> Advance -> Base (High Octane & Low Octane) tables at all? Also, where are the tables to retard the cam? I saw you said you were doing a 5 degree cam retard?

  4. #44
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    I did this while tooling around with a friend one night. Heard it was all the rage. Just took zeroing out the spark in low airmass idle coastdown areas and it's pop city. Very ricer, but it was fun while it lasted.

  5. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by M3T1 View Post
    Do you mess with the Spark -> Advance -> Base (High Octane & Low Octane) tables at all? Also, where are the tables to retard the cam? I saw you said you were doing a 5 degree cam retard?
    There are different levels of pops you can make depending on what you modify. I have found most people are satisfied with mild to moderate pops which is achieved by leaving DCFO enabled and only modifying the Minimum Spark Tables. I have made tunes where I changed the Hi/Lo tables as well but usually only when I disable DFCO so that it starts popping sooner than waiting on Torque Management when you lift the throttle. It seems to make the pops a little more consistent. Sometimes I have found that even with these changes the pops don't happen at higher RPM's like if you hold a gear and let off the throttle at 5500 RPM sometimes you get no pops at all. It seems that the cars I have tuned for this all have a little different behavior but its likely the different mods.

    I have also learned how to make a machine gun obnoxious pop for the parking lot tools who love to rev their engines and make the loud bangs. I can make the tune have a throttle regulated show off mode in neutral/park. Highly stupid and annoying but that is what they ask for. I've also had a car recently where I had to make Virtual Torque changes because they had a large aftermarket throttle body and Torque Management Advance behavior was limited on decel preventing all pops.

    Some people have reported they only changed the hi/lo tables and not the minimum spark tables and they got pops. I'm not sure how that is the case since the minimum spark tables tells the ECU what the floor is for Torque Management Advance operation. I haven't had that experience myself but I'm not saying anyone who claims this is wrong. Maybe they were messing with a different ECU. I mainly tune Gen 7 Corvettes and Gen 6 Camaros for burbles.

    As for the cam degree retard, I haven't found that it makes any difference as long as the values are 0 or higher(more retard) in the tune. Pretty much every burble tune I've done I leave the cam table alone in that area.
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  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by TriPinTaZ View Post
    There are different levels of pops you can make depending on what you modify. I have found most people are satisfied with mild to moderate pops which is achieved by leaving DCFO enabled and only modifying the Minimum Spark Tables. I have made tunes where I changed the Hi/Lo tables as well but usually only when I disable DFCO so that it starts popping sooner than waiting on Torque Management when you lift the throttle. It seems to make the pops a little more consistent. Sometimes I have found that even with these changes the pops don't happen at higher RPM's like if you hold a gear and let off the throttle at 5500 RPM sometimes you get no pops at all. It seems that the cars I have tuned for this all have a little different behavior but its likely the different mods.

    I have also learned how to make a machine gun obnoxious pop for the parking lot tools who love to rev their engines and make the loud bangs. I can make the tune have a throttle regulated show off mode in neutral/park. Highly stupid and annoying but that is what they ask for. I've also had a car recently where I had to make Virtual Torque changes because they had a large aftermarket throttle body and Torque Management Advance behavior was limited on decel preventing all pops.

    Some people have reported they only changed the hi/lo tables and not the minimum spark tables and they got pops. I'm not sure how that is the case since the minimum spark tables tells the ECU what the floor is for Torque Management Advance operation. I haven't had that experience myself but I'm not saying anyone who claims this is wrong. Maybe they were messing with a different ECU. I mainly tune Gen 7 Corvettes and Gen 6 Camaros for burbles.

    As for the cam degree retard, I haven't found that it makes any difference as long as the values are 0 or higher(more retard) in the tune. Pretty much every burble tune I've done I leave the cam table alone in that area.
    This is helpful. I have disabled DFCO. I was trying to make a machine gun/parking lot ricer tune haha. I ordered an ngauge so I plan on running my real tune (no pops, and DFCO enabled) most of the time and then just switching to ricer mode at car shows and stuff. I felt silly at the last car show I was at because they had a rev/two-step contest, and I couldn't even compete with $2000 kias because my car doesn't pop. I want revenge.

  7. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by M3T1 View Post
    This is helpful. I have disabled DFCO. I was trying to make a machine gun/parking lot ricer tune haha. I ordered an ngauge so I plan on running my real tune (no pops, and DFCO enabled) most of the time and then just switching to ricer mode at car shows and stuff. I felt silly at the last car show I was at because they had a rev/two-step contest, and I couldn't even compete with $2000 kias because my car doesn't pop. I want revenge.

    There is a very specific way to make show off bangs like cannon fire from the rear. If you have cats it will likely destroy them, but if you have no cats you might even get fireballs. You set the tune up so that you rev to redline in park/neutral, then let off the throttle almost all the way but keep it pressed about 5%. Then you get gun fire bangs. It's very obnoxious but effective.
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  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by TriPinTaZ View Post
    There is a very specific way to make show off bangs like cannon fire from the rear. If you have cats it will likely destroy them, but if you have no cats you might even get fireballs. You set the tune up so that you rev to redline in park/neutral, then let off the throttle almost all the way but keep it pressed about 5%. Then you get gun fire bangs. It's very obnoxious but effective.
    I'll give it a shot. That is the goal for car shows. I do not have cats. Would love to shoot fire!

  9. #49
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    Very helpful thread. Thank you all!
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