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Thread: 05 trailblazer ve table

  1. #1

    05 trailblazer ve table

    Tuning my first 4.2. Bone stock with no mods. Trying to set up a chart on my scanner to mirror my ve table. I have calc load in my channels and scanner but it wont populate any of the cells in correlation to engine load. Is there a better way to chart and correct in the ve table?

  2. #2
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    Post up tune and log

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by TCSS07 View Post
    Post up tune and log
    I cant seem to get my knock to go away. I have charted separately for base and pe and pasted special subtract. also notice the timing drops on gradual acceleration like ive missed some torque management somewhere. any help is appreciated
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  4. #4
    i know my spark tables are a mess but that was me trying to prove false knock. Going to put wide band on, put spark tables back to stock and leave the torque management like it is. and see what it looks like.

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    i believe you want to log absolute load not calculated engine load in the histogram at least thats how i have my lnf config file setup so make sure you have absolute load in the channels list and re check

  6. #6
    ok ill try that next week when i get it back. here is another scan and tune.
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  7. #7
    Do you see the timing drop on tip in? where is that coming from? My knock retard is almost untouchable. Ive tried everything but removing fuel in those cells. Pulled timing until it was anemic. Did not get opportunity to put wideband on it but im certain almost at this point that its false knock

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    You need to add a little more to the scanner channel list. Injector duty cycle, injector pulse and don't forget absolute load. i'd probably stop doing any pulls if you are until you get the wideband up and running. Return the spark back to stock. What fuel are you running? You can try some higher octane fuel and see if it calms down any. If not then its probably false picking up whatever noise it may that is the same frequency and if it does then its either real or the knock sensors are too sensitive but your ecm doesn't have the ability to desensitize them so you'll just have to ignore it at that point. You can go to a dyno and get some real knock check ears on it would be the best way.
    Last edited by TCSS07; 07-28-2019 at 09:45 PM.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by TCSS07 View Post
    You need to add a little more to the scanner channel list. Injector duty cycle, injector pulse and don't forget absolute load. i'd probably stop doing any pulls if you are until you get the wideband up and running. Return the spark back to stock. What fuel are you running? You can try some higher octane fuel and see if it calms down any. If not then its probably false picking up whatever noise it may that is the same frequency and if it does then its either real or the knock sensors are too sensitive but your ecm doesn't have the ability to desensitize them so you'll just have to ignore it at that point. You can go to a dyno and get some real knock check ears on it would be the best way.
    Appreciate it TCSS07. Was a fresh full tank of bp 93. For some reason(and didnt spend alot of time on it until i ran out of time.) was having problems getting the injector data to the scanner list. I put some spark back in it and left a heavy pe until i can get it figured out. Appreciate your input and would love any other ideas u may have. One last question, is it possible it could be a rich knock?

  10. #10
    Also did you look at the ve tables? Do you think the areas that are maxed out are covering most of the cells where my knock is the worst?

  11. #11
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    Yes rich knock is 100% possible. When i get back to my pc ill double check the ve

  12. #12
    Senior Tuner cobaltssoverbooster's Avatar
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    tune pe to 12.5 and play with the enrichment ramp in rates until the afr in transition targets a lower 12-12.3 afr. that should eliminate any rich detonation. assuming N/A application since i dont see boost mentioned in this thread.
    2000 Ford Mustang - Top Sportsman

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by cobaltssoverbooster View Post
    tune pe to 12.5 and play with the enrichment ramp in rates until the afr in transition targets a lower 12-12.3 afr. that should eliminate any rich detonation. assuming N/A application since i dont see boost mentioned in this thread.
    na bone stock

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by cobaltssoverbooster View Post
    tune pe to 12.5 and play with the enrichment ramp in rates until the afr in transition targets a lower 12-12.3 afr. that should eliminate any rich detonation. assuming N/A application since i dont see boost mentioned in this thread.
    By ramp in rates are you referring to the rpm multiplier?

  15. #15
    Senior Tuner cobaltssoverbooster's Avatar
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    You should have access to an enrichment ramp in value. It works similar to an accelerator pump on a carburetor. Typically a single value adjustment. It's usually named enrichment ramp in or ramp in, sometimes enrichment gain. Not usually rpm based in early gm stuff

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by cobaltssoverbooster View Post
    You should have access to an enrichment ramp in value. It works similar to an accelerator pump on a carburetor. Typically a single value adjustment. It's usually named enrichment ramp in or ramp in, sometimes enrichment gain. Not usually rpm based in early gm stuff
    Im familiar with the ramp in but couldnt find in the tune file anywhere. maybe i just overlooked it.

  17. #17
    Senior Tuner cobaltssoverbooster's Avatar
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    I'll look when I get back from lunch

  18. #18
    Senior Tuner cobaltssoverbooster's Avatar
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    i didnt know your ecu was the old alpha n format. just set pe to target 12.3-12.5 and then play with tps vs. rpm to set an activation point that does not cause any stumbling or bogging. you may be able to move it around to avoid KR based on cylinder load during transition cycle.
    try using an activation tps around 55% to start. as you accelerate about mid throttle you want it to add fuel but you dont want it to be active with small movements in tps during cruise. usually around 50-60% is where i start and monitor things like map value an cylinder g/sec airmass load to determine if im bringing it in at the right time. each car is different so youll have to move it around to figure out what yours desires.
    2000 Ford Mustang - Top Sportsman

  19. #19
    Senior Tuner cobaltssoverbooster's Avatar
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    i should note that your ignition maps are no good. these tables need to be smooth with no pronounced pockets (dips) or spikes. right now you have a bunch of heavy dips. probably due to your registered kr and the fact you are tuning by removing X amount of kr from the ignition map using a copy paste method. Not that there is anything wrong but you need to use those smooth features and make smoothing corrections manually to retain a proper ignition map shape.

    the n/a engine in these years are fast burn. your maximum ignition for a stock motor will likely be around 19-22*. i would go back to the stock ignition maps and try again. this time as you increase ignition and witness kr your should examine your recording to see where the kr registers in the ecu. remember that kr comes from a knock sensor which is a listening device. this means there is some inherent delay from when the event physically occurs to when the sensor picks it up and reports it back to the ecu. you should be adjusting kr based on the event just prior to the kr showing up in the ecu and when the kr shows up. this widens the correction zone when making kr based ignition changes and should help you more accurately target the event causing kr.
    2000 Ford Mustang - Top Sportsman

  20. #20
    Appreciate all the great info cobaltssoverbooster. I smooth most of my stuff almost last. The timing tables were severe because I was trying to chase the knock. I only reduced timing and never added any at all. The stock tables were higher. I only added fuel removed some tm and adjusted pe. I then started removing timing to try to verify real or false kr. I will go back at it the way you suggest when i get the truck back. Will also put on wideband although my cruising fuel trims are liveable. What are your thoughts on it being a rich knock?