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Thread: Help Diagnose LS3 Timing Drop around 1,000 RPM after dead stop

  1. #1
    Tuner in Training
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    Help Diagnose LS3 Timing Drop around 1,000 RPM after dead stop

    I am trying to figure out why my car pulls timing down to basically 0* when I start from a dead stop and began to moderately accelerate. It doesn't happen every time but I'll say roughly 40% of the time. Does anyone know what tables or parameters could be causing this outcome?


    Car Setup:
    - Drysump Manual LS3 in Grandsport
    - Stock Airbox with Attack Blue Filter
    - Stock Intake & Throttle Body
    - AFe 1-7/8" TRI-Y header with cats
    - Stock NPP Exhaust
    - Upgraded Cam (below specs)

    Upgraded Cam Profile:
    Duration: 216/224
    Lift: 0.553?/0.553?
    LSA: 117* +4 advance
    Overlap: -14



  2. #2
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    Does anyone have an opinion of what's going on? Am I asking the question the wrong way?

  3. #3
    Senior Tuner SultanHassanMasTuning's Avatar
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    log all related spark to narrow it down, i am thinking its possible through the clutch fuel CFCO tables
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  4. #4
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    Thanks for the advice and I was able to narrow it down to Torque Management activating. What I can't determine is why? I've done several experiments and it seems that no matter what I deactivate TRQ management still kicks in right off idle in the 1,000 RPM region. I don't want to resort to hacking the min timing tables in those areas because if the ECU is trying to protect the engine I need to know why.

    Screen shot with everything turned off {Tune 29g}


    Attached Files Attached Files

  5. #5
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    Also I've been able to associate the sub 2* of KR to occur just after the spark dips off IDLE. Below is another tune with my previous TRQ management settings and it happens again just in a slight different place.


    Screen shot of similar KR in different area {Tune 31a}

    Attached Files Attached Files

  6. #6
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    bump

  7. #7
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    Over the week I've been doing various deep dives and I think my issue is related to my O2 sensors switching points & the Virtual Torque Model. I spent about a week reading through and trying to understanding the below HP tuners thread and after incorporating some of their techniques most of the random KR issues have resolved themselves. I'm waiting on warmer weather (+90F) to really see if I'm heading in the right direction. I am also going to spend some time trying to understand the Virtual Torque Model so I can sharpen that up as well.

    Link >> HP Tuners Thread "O2 sensor tuning with Headers"

    So far here is what I think is going on:
    - TRQ management pulls timing allowing additional unused fuel in the cylinder
    - The low exhaust velocity & sluggish O2 switching causes fueling changes to lag behind off Idle load
    - The momentarily build up of fuel causes a spike in combustion that shows up as KR





    For those that are interested here are my O2 setting I'm going with for right now.