2005 GTO E40 Correct 2 bar MAP PN??

[jaydubb71]

Greeting...

Currently tuning a 2005 GTO with...

LS9 cam
Maggie M112 blower

No matter what I do, whether I load a 1-bar or 2-bar OS, when running 2-bar map sensor (GM 12615136), the car barely will start. And when I do get it started, the scanner says its idling at 104 KPA. Snap the throttle and it comes down to maybe 70 KPA and back to 104 it goes. I used the linear and offset setting from a 2005 or 2006 Cobalt SS. If I put stock settings back in the computer (even with the 2 bar map), the car starts and idles fine. And shows around 40-50 KPA.

What gives? I want the ECM to AT LEAST know the proper KPA being supplied to the engine. Ive NEVER had this issue with E38s (1-bar or 2.5-bar).

Thanks in advance!

[13qtr]

I'm running the 2bar OS...I'm just n/a, running speed density. I'm using the stock map sensor and I put the stock settings back in after I applied the 2 bar.
Map linear..94.43kpa
linearB...31.48kpa
offset... 10.33kpa

[jaydubb71]

I'm running the 2bar OS...I'm just n/a, running speed density. I'm using the stock map sensor and I put the stock settings back in after I applied the 2 bar.
Map linear..94.43kpa
linearB...31.48kpa
offset... 10.33kpa

I would run this car in SD BUT we have to pass emissions in MD so failing the MAF is not an option. But since this is a boosted car, I would like the ECM to at least be able to measure manifiold pressure. The previous tuner left this car with a 1-bar OS and map. Its only running 7 psi but the owner swapped in the LS9 cam and a set of 60LB injectors. Ive got the scaling and everything down but I cannot figure out the weird KPA issue in the scanner. I have the stock sttings and map sensor in now and the car runs fine...

[blindsquirrel]

The Cobalt 3-wire sensor is actually the baro sensor, at least that's what its called in the wiring diagram. The MAP sensor is a 4-wire thingie with the IAT built it.

[jaydubb71]

The Cobalt 3-wire sensor is actually the baro sensor, at least that's what its called in the wiring diagram. The MAP sensor is a 4-wire thingie with the IAT built it.

OK. So which one is the correct one to use? GM #12615136 or AC Delco #213-1631? Im so confused...

[jaydubb71]

Wait... So This would need an old style brick map to work properly? The 12615136 wont work because its a Baro sensor? Hmmm... THIS IS SO CRAZY!

[blindsquirrel]

You can use any sensor that has a max Linear of less than the hard limit of 256kpa, and only sensors with a positive Offset.

What settings have you tried with it? Apparently it SHOULD be correct with 200/8.33. You can check this by setting the tune to the stock values, plug in the stock 1-bar sensor, key-on and record the MAP value. Right quick before the weather changes swap to the Cobalt sensor using 200/8.33, key-on and see if the MAP reads the same.

[blindsquirrel]

FYI the 4-wire part with integrated IAT requires 270.59/-3.30 (per a 2006 Cobalt stock tune), won't work with the odd-duck E40.

[jaydubb71]

You can use any sensor that has a max Linear of less than the hard limit of 256kpa, and only sensors with a positive Offset.

What settings have you tried with it? Apparently it SHOULD be correct with 200/8.33. You can check this by setting the tune to the stock values, plug in the stock 1-bar sensor, key-on and record the MAP value. Right quick before the weather changes swap to the Cobalt sensor using 200/8.33, key-on and see if the MAP reads the same.

Can you recommend a part number? Or a car that one came from?

[blindsquirrel]

What have you been using for linear/offset with the 12615136? Sure it's pinned right? It should 'work' if you give it the right settings and have it wired right. The 4-wire sensor is the one that just flat out can't be used with the E40.

Honestly given the E40's limitations there's one best answer: https://www.dpecorvettes.com/2.5-bar-map-sensor.html

[blindsquirrel]

From the first post:

when running 2-bar map sensor (GM 12615136), the car barely will start.
[...]
I used the linear and offset setting from a 2005 or 2006 Cobalt SS.

But see, the 12615136, being the baro sensor, isn't the sensor in the Cobalt's tune file at Airflow > General > MAP Characteristics, those numbers are dealing with the Cobalt's actual MAP sensor, the 4-wire thing with the integrated IAT. Different sensor than the 12615136, there's no settings available to edit or even display in the Cobalt tune for the baro sensor, it's just fixed at whatever it is.

And anyway you can't enter either 270.59 or -3.30 in an E40 file as they're both outside the hard-coded limits. If you try it the 270.59 changes itself to the max allowed of 256 as soon as you click over to the next box.

Apparently other people who have used the 12615136 baro sensor as a MAP with the E40 have used settings of 200/8.33 and found them to work.

[jaydubb71]

From the first post:


But see, the 12615136, being the baro sensor, isn't the sensor in the Cobalt's tune file at Airflow > General > MAP Characteristics, those numbers are dealing with the Cobalt's actual MAP sensor, the 4-wire thing with the integrated IAT. Different sensor than the 12615136, there's no settings available to edit or even display in the Cobalt tune for the baro sensor, it's just fixed at whatever it is.

And anyway you can't enter either 270.59 or -3.30 in an E40 file as they're both outside the hard-coded limits. If you try it the 270.59 changes itself to the max allowed of 256 as soon as you click over to the next box.

Apparently other people who have used the 12615136 baro sensor as a MAP with the E40 have used settings of 200/8.33 and found them to work.

OK. I THINK I tried those settings with the 12615136. I will try it again.

Thanks!

[Lakegoat]

Yep, 200/8.33 or 200/8.00. I have been running that 5136 sensor for years

[asquinton]

The 2 bar is ACDelco 213-1631 or GM 12615136. I'm running an LS3 intake in my 2005 GTO. I had to make a little flat plate with a hole to mount it to the manifold. The hole diameter is larger in the LS3 manifold so I had to double up O rings to seal it up. Wiring is plug and play.

Map Characteristics for this sensor are:

MAP Sensor Linear = 200.00 kPa
MAP Sensor Linear B = 66.66 kPa
MAP Sensor Offset = 10.33 kPa

[Lakegoat]

Offset is not 10.33

[asquinton]

Offset is not 10.33

Please correct me.

[blindsquirrel]

12615136 is 200/8.33.

I don't know of any sensor with the actual specs of 200/10.33. I think those numbers are just generic placeholders they chose as defaults for the custom OS. 200 = 2 bar, and the 10.33 is nothing but a carryover from the stock 1 bar sensors (94.43/10.33).

[asquinton]

I must have jacked the math up. I just ran it again with the Delphi data and come up with 200/8 based on y = .025x - .2 on the data from their print. I see people using 8.33 now but the data from the print comes up with 8 as the x intercept. Unless I goofed it up again.

Delphi 2 bar MAP Print and Data.pdf

Delphi 2 bar graph.png

12615136 is 200/8.33.

I don't know of any sensor with the actual specs of 200/10.33. I think those numbers are just generic placeholders they chose as defaults for the custom OS. 200 = 2 bar, and the 10.33 is nothing but a carryover from the stock 1 bar sensors (94.43/10.33).

[jaydubb71]

Update:

Went back to 1-bar OS and 1-bar MAP and tuned it...

[saleen9973]

I run the dpe 2.5 in my e40 boosted 2005 gto. It works great