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Thread: TuningSchool Dodge transmission book

  1. #61
    Senior Tuner Jim P's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spoolboy View Post
    I'd be interested in a used copy if someone wants to recover some of their purchase price.
    Honestly, don't even bother at all. Basically just gives you some values to put in in a few fields, increase duty cycle by "x" percent for this then tune the shift and lockup to your desired feel. Pretty much sums up the entire book.

  2. #62
    Senior Tuner Jim P's Avatar
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    Lockup on the 6 speeds they just say to block it out from even occurring in gears 2nd through to 4th. I very much enjoy having lockup in 3rd and 4th. Lockup in 2nd I use if I?m running full locked shifts.

  3. #63
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    @spoolboy Agreed. Hard to learn when the decoder ring is wrong...

  4. #64
    Senior Tuner Jim P's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gfertig View Post
    @spoolboy Agreed. Hard to learn when the decoder ring is wrong...
    Decoder ring? What kind of cryptics are we talking about here?

  5. #65
    Advanced Tuner JaegerWrenching's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim P View Post
    Decoder ring? What kind of cryptics are we talking about here?
    Decoder ring.PNG

  6. #66
    I was hoping for more info, but Oh well.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim P View Post
    Attached is my shift scheduling spreadsheet I use for the 68RFE. If you look in the 3-4 & 4-3 Shift tab you'll see an error in there if you look at the graphs, why I like to have graphs to look at to be sure I don't have any up/down shifts intersecting each other.
    How would you modify this for the 545RFE 5 speed? Basically just ignore the 6th gear stuff or is there more to it than that?

  8. #68
    Senior Tuner Jim P's Avatar
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    Yea you can just ignore 6th gear. Change your tire size, transmission gear ratios, axle ratios, etc.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim P View Post
    Yea you can just ignore 6th gear. Change your tire size, transmission gear ratios, axle ratios, etc.
    I actually ended up going through the entire spreadsheet and changing the layout to match what I see when I'm looking at my shift schedule screen. so more tabs for each section and different stuff and changed 6th to 2p.

    There may have been some errors on the original though because it looks like on the original spreadsheet has a lot of cells for different gears that are referencing 1st gear for the RPM and MPH calculations.
    For instance 5-4 downshift low is referencing first gear for the engine/vehicle speeds but the table is for 5th gear.

    I also don't have anything that I can change for "Low", the only settings I have for low are under "drive" and it's only for 1-2 and 2-3 low shifts.
    So basically I reworked the entire spreadsheet for my specific purposes.

    I am curious about the engine/vehicle speeds though, because the speeds that are shown/calculated when I enter the information as shown in my tune are kind of insane.
    like for my overdrive 3-4 settings, according to what HPT shows in my table for my truck,when entered into the chart, is showing 131mph at 100% TP.

    So what is it that's moving at 131mph? because I sure as hell can't drive that fast lol.

    MPH.PNGMPH2.PNG

  10. #70
    Senior Tuner Jim P's Avatar
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    It?s possible there are errors in it but the information in the setup tab isn?t correctly entered it will give bad results in the other tabs. You can?t use the 6th gear spot for 2prime, 2 prime is equivalent to 3rd gear. Information needs to be entered in order. 1, 2, 2Prime, 3, 4, 4Prime.

  11. #71
    Senior Tuner Jim P's Avatar
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    As for the low range shift tables in that workbook, the 68RFE, you can change the low range shift points for all gears, and that?s the transmission I built the workbook for. You can use the workbook for the other RFE transmissions, you just not to change the gear ratios and stuff to match your vehicle and things need to be in order, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 or 1, 2, 2Prime, 3, 4, 4Prime. Each shift schedule tab is referenced to the gear ratio cells it?s for in the setup tab. The resulting information in the 1-2 shift tab is literally linked to the 1 and 2 gear ratios cells in its original format.

    You?ll just have to recognize at your discretion that in your tune file you may not have all the same shift tables as what?s in there if you use that workbook.
    Last edited by Jim P; 1 Week Ago at 09:43 PM.

  12. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim P View Post
    It?s possible there are errors in it but the information in the setup tab isn?t correctly entered it will give bad results in the other tabs. You can?t use the 6th gear spot for 2prime, 2 prime is equivalent to 3rd gear. Information needs to be entered in order. 1, 2, 2Prime, 3, 4, 4Prime.
    What do you mean? I changed the formulas to use 6th as 2 prime instead of 6th gear, anything that referenced 6th gear was altered to 2prime.

    The information is entered right on the initial setup tab though, the MPH info is just super high and I'm wondering what it is that's moving that fast.
    even if I enter the data into the 68rfe spreadsheet it comes out to the same values.
    the TP% numbers, and OSS speed were taken right from my stock tune.

  13. #73
    Senior Tuner Jim P's Avatar
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    I thought I had everything locked before uploading so people couldn?t piss around with formulas and come back saying it doesn?t work. Any you changed in the formulas is on you, I have no issues with it in its original format and all formulas I had in there are standard text book formulas.

  14. #74
    Senior Tuner Jim P's Avatar
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    All tabs are based off the ?new? tire size information so either change the formulas to be based off original tire size information or make the new tire size information the same as the original.

  15. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim P View Post
    I thought I had everything locked before uploading so people couldn?t piss around with formulas and come back saying it doesn?t work. Any you changed in the formulas is on you, I have no issues with it in its original format and all formulas I had in there are standard text book formulas.
    it is locked, excel security is a joke though.
    The only formula I had to change was just to change a simple cell reference for 6th gear, everything else is referencing exactly what it should be as far as I can tell.

    Other than that I noticed that there were a few tables that were referencing first gear on your original document. Maybe I'm mistaken but I don't think calculations for 5th gear should be referencing first gear?

    I can put my numbers into your original spreadsheet and come up with the same values, so there's nothing wrong with the formulas.

  16. #76
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    Here have a look for yourself. I have a lot of time on my hands, and working on this has provided me with lots of information.

    EDIT
    I think I'm misunderstanding something is all.

    so basically, the truck wouldn't shift from 3rd to 4th until 84mph at 25% throttle?
    and if it was 100% throttle it wouldn't shift from 3rd to 4th until the truck was at 124mph?

    Is that a correct assessment?
    Attached Images Attached Images
    Last edited by Killavolt; 1 Week Ago at 07:20 AM.

  17. #77
    Senior Tuner Jim P's Avatar
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    I just checked my original work, what is uploaded, and everything is referencing the correct cells for the respective gear ratios for the shift schedule tabs for hi range. The low range tables are incorrect from 2-3 tab and up but all hi range tables are correct. I missed changing reference cells for the low range tables for the engine rpms at the shift points.
    Last edited by Jim P; 1 Week Ago at 06:32 AM.

  18. #78
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    oh? So did I actually manage to do something useful for once in my life? lol. I do apologize though, I should've mentioned that it was in the low tables and realize now that I didn't specify that.

    is my assessment of how it works above correct though or am I way off base there?
    "so basically, the truck wouldn't shift from 3rd to 4th until 84mph at 25% throttle?
    and if it was 100% throttle it wouldn't shift from 3rd to 4th until the truck was at 124mph?"
    Also keep in mind, my tables might be out of whack due to someone elses tune. I can't really verify it yet, but I think someone has previously tuned my truck, and didn't do a good job. All of the numbers I used in the changeable cells came from my tune file.

    I definitely don't have a full grasp on how the schedules work though, like why is there multiple repeated entries for TP% with the same values, like 0 30 60 100 100 100 100 ?
    The superchips setup is fairly easy to look at, if the lines on the graph don't overlap it should be a good setup, but when I look at the charts for HPT's layout there are lines over lapping all over the place if you graph them together.

    I removed my spreadsheet from the post above, I'm not trying to step on any toes here, I just wanted it setup for my situation/layout.

  19. #79
    Senior Tuner Jim P's Avatar
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    Your assessment is correct although it?s throttle position and oss rpms, not mph. The mph is only a function of all variables combined, engine rpm, trans gear ratio, transfer case ratio, axle ratio, tire size. Each element affects the mph. Having an unlocked converter introduces slip which affects engine rpm and thus will have an affects on mph calculated if slip value isn?t accounted for and slip vary dramatically.

    Your note on tps in your tables is common in the RFE tables and means nothing other than the shape of the curve.

    Your downshift tables are kinda half opposite of the upshift tables. In the upshift tables anything at or above the setpoints of tps and the respective OSS rpm will cause an upshift, in the downtables anything at or above the tps setpoint and at or below the respective OSS setpoint causes a downshift.

  20. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim P View Post
    The mph is only a function of all variables combined, engine rpm, trans gear ratio, transfer case ratio, axle ratio, tire size.
    Right, I do understand that, I just wanted to kind of sum it up in a basic way, because if I was testing a schedule I find it handy to be able to look at my speedo since I don't have anything telling me the OSS, so I can at least look at it and be like "ok, so I should shift to X gear at roughly Y mph" and be able to pay attention if that's happening, at least on a very basic level.

    That all makes sense though, and this is really my first foray into anything on the above-novice side of how newer/automatic transmissions work.
    There are way more variables than I ever thought there would be, like there being different shift tables for being in overdrive or drive and even 4WD, and all the variations of those tables.

    It's really interesting tbh because there are so many variables to determine which shift table the TCM is going to use at any given time.

    When I was told that HPT couldn't tune the 545RFE I was pretty disappointed, but if I'm actually able to change the schedules that are available to me, then that's all I really wanted to do so once I'm able to get my ECU reflashed, if that fixes my problem, I'll be an extremely happy camper.