Calibrated success DVD SOI explanation and fuel pump help

[supercowboy]

Im having a bit of confusion on how to set up the SOI fuel timing and fuel pump. Ive been watching Gregs video and trying to understand this.
Here is the setup;
2018 Camaro
Prc heads, Headers, cat back, Msd Intake manifold, texas speed cam, Comp cam lock out, Lt4 fuel pump

Cam profile as follows;
duration at .50 Intake 235 Exhaust 239
lobe lift Intake .358 exhaust .358
valve lift @ 1.8 Intake .645 exhaust .635
lobe separation 116
intake center line 112
Fuel lobe 32%

Now Ive gone in and copied over all the axis and tables for the fuel pump. Tables include
:Fuel Pressure Tab
regulation pressure
Desired fuel pressure normal
High pressure desired base and catalyst heating
integral min and max
pressure limits max
hpfp maximum oring max

:Fuel pump Tab
min duty cycle
duty
Fuel flow temp corr
leading edge angle
peak duration
peak duration temp

?1. Do I add 32% more fuel on top of the changes to the leading edge angle? This would be due to the 32 % increase in the cam lobe that is advertised?

?2 Do I adjust the leading edge angle and get fuel rail pressure actual and desired to match?
Since the injectors are the same I did not want to manipulate the flow rate to compensate for this.

?3 Am I over killing the pump values and should just increase the the leading edge angle by 64% (32% cam and 32% pump)

I am a bit confused because LT4 engines are supercharged and converting the pump and scalers for the car. Car is not boosted but scalers are for boosted app.

?4 Does this close the gap on resolution of tuning for the vehicle?

In the video Greg talks about increasing values for pump by percentage but the car is supercharged already.

?5 Is the increase due to cam lobe or for the bigger LT4 pump?

SOI timing:
From what I gather from the change in cam the exhaust valve closes at 4 ATDC. This would allow me to adjust the SOI all the way to 356 degrees. would this be correct?

Not sure that I would want to do this and push it to 356. At Idle the car is around 315 degrees and wot is 335 from factory.

?6 Should I move the table closer to the 356 degrees or farther away due to valve opening?

This car has cam lock out and The cam advance has been deleted. Now the Map is way out in certain areas which need to be corrected I would assume. I was looking at the Lt4 map and I know there is no cam advance in the car. I was Thinking copy the LT4 SOI profile over and adjust from there.
?7 Would this make sense to start here?

?8 What am I logging for when adjusting for this?

?9 What am I looking for to get proper results?

At the moment the car is running on the fuel pump values that I have changed. I have not touched the SOI table yet. I have been working the vve table and do have the vehicle in forced in open loop. Im noticing the car will like to idle at 14.0(.96 Lambda) at this point. When I turn the trims on car STFT are -14 % and lambda goes to 1. Not sure on the math but it seems to over fuel itself to compensate back to stoich. I was wondering if the SOI has alot to do with this. The other side of this if I lean it out the car wants to stall. The richer mixture keeps the idle smoother and no stalling.

Thanks for any help that people can give.

[HeavyChevy305]

Why did you switch to the LT4 HPFP on an all motor setup?

[supercowboy]

Why did you switch to the LT4 HPFP on an all motor setup?

Customer supplied parts. I didnt know the stock pump would handle the extra fuel for the heads and cam until after. The other thing I did not like was puck under the fuel pump. I thought this was not a good idea.

[Higgs Boson]

for the fuel lobe you increase the y axis by the amount of the fuel lobe increase so multiply the Y axis by 1.32

for SOI set your whole table to 280 and if you feel like you need to increase it then do so in the areas needed, the ecm logic will typically do that for you though as load and rpm rise, it will back the soi up all by itself.

[cmitchell17]

for the fuel lobe you increase the y axis by the amount of the fuel lobe increase so multiply the Y axis by 1.32

for SOI set your whole table to 280 and if you feel like you need to increase it then do so in the areas needed, the ecm logic will typically do that for you though as load and rpm rise, it will back the soi up all by itself.

This is all I did too for my 32% fuel lobe, I just increased the axis by the 32% like Higgs said, but I guess you are asking if you should do it again since you are copying over LT4 values to your tune since you put on a LT4 fuel pump as well as the increased fuel lobe on the cam?

Also Higgs are you saying that you now recommend setting the SOI Base table to a constant 280 throughout? and then leaving the modifiers stock to let them do what they are going to do? I think I remember you recommending to make changes then after further testing the consensus was that it doesn't do anything changing injection timing?

It would seem logical to me that changing SOI would have a very big effect given mixture motion and evaporation and combustion quality, I haven't noticed anything from messing with the SOI table, so I guess it still holds true that you just make it whatever makes you feel good as long as you don't advance it past your exhaust valve closing so you don't lose fuel out the exhaust.

[supercowboy]

This is all I did too for my 32% fuel lobe, I just increased the axis by the 32% like Higgs said, but I guess you are asking if you should do it again since you are copying over LT4 values to your tune since you put on a LT4 fuel pump as well as the increased fuel lobe on the cam?

From my understanding the 32 percent increase in axis brings the resolution back in to the map and also corrects back to oem function.

Also Higgs are you saying that you now recommend setting the SOI Base table to a constant 280 throughout? and then leaving the modifiers stock to let them do what they are going to do? I think I remember you recommending to make changes then after further testing the consensus was that it doesn't do anything changing injection timing?

It would seem logical to me that changing SOI would have a very big effect given mixture motion and evaporation and combustion quality, I haven't noticed anything from messing with the SOI table, so I guess it still holds true that you just make it whatever makes you feel good as long as you don't advance it past your exhaust valve closing so you don't lose fuel out the exhaust.

You have to move it away from the exhaust closing. The bigger cam can move that 10 or so more degrees depending on overlap. by adjusting this it brings it back to "factory" values. At this point were trusting are gm calibrators.

[supercowboy]

for the fuel lobe you increase the y axis by the amount of the fuel lobe increase so multiply the Y axis by 1.32

for SOI set your whole table to 280 and if you feel like you need to increase it then do so in the areas needed, the ecm logic will typically do that for you though as load and rpm rise, it will back the soi up all by itself.

What I did was I copied over the LT4 SOI map. I took the whole map and decreased till I saw many 280-290 values in place. I wanted to keep the same shape. I have adjusted VVE map. I did notice the VVE map was pretty close. Needed more adjustment in Idle range rather than cruise and full throttle. With correction off the Wot was pretty close without needing more than 2 or 3 percent adjustment.

[cmitchell17a]

So apparently the LT1 stock cam is a 200/207 on a 116.5:
Capture.JPG

My cam is a 228/236 on a 114:
Capture.JPG

Considering the stock cam phaser is advanced up to 10 degrees starting at 6000rpms at WOT:
Capture.JPG

Then the stock cam should have this situation (I think the stock cam is supposedly "parked" at an advanced or retarded position? but im not sure?):
Capture.JPG

In reality I guess we shouldn't have to worry about the cam phaser advance or retard since we are modifying the base SOI table and I think there is a modifier table for the SOI for the cam phaser action.

So anyway it appears the stock cam closes the exhaust valve 13 degrees before TDC and my new cam closes 4 degrees after TDC, so does this mean I need to shift the entire SOI base table 17 degrees? Is that way you are saying? So from my understanding I would then SUBTRACT 17 degrees from the entire base SOI table since the tables is in degrees after TDC?

Edit: Actually thinking about this more I need to ADD 17 degrees?

Edit 2: Ok actually wait, I think I was right the first time and I do in fact subtract. My Understanding is that increasing the degrees in this table is going in the opposite direction the crankshaft is moving? I am referring to the way its described in the Calibration success video where he talks about this, but what I got out of that video is that we just need to ensure that the stock timing (or whatever timing we put in this table) isn't so high to where it allows the injection event to be at the same time the exhaust valve is open. I don't think he ever said its a good idea to shift you injection event everywhere? Not trying to doubt you though.

[Jonblarc7]

I'm confused by what you mean Y axis. I know it's probably a simple answer but I got to ask. I compared what my tuner change under the Fuel System to one of my pre cam tunes. And there are no changes to anything under Fuel Systems for my 32% over fuel lobe.

Are you changing this under Leading Edge Angle???

[Jonblarc7]

Is this where you are talking about changing the Y axis. This is under Fuel System>Fuel Pump>Leading Edge Angle

Then right click on the Y axis on the right then multiple that side of the graph by 1.32 which is my 32% over fuel lobe.

leading edge.png

[HNK]

What makes the tune change the SOI other than physically changing it in the tune? At times under wot 1 and 2nd mainly, the log shows the SOI at 363.5 when commanded is 352 to max 358.

[HeavyChevy305]

What makes the tune change the SOI other than physically changing it in the tune? At times under wot 1 and 2nd mainly, the log shows the SOI at 363.5 when commanded is 352 to max 358.

Cylinder Airmass. That's why it's important to get the MAF as close to perfect as possible.

[HNK]

According to the eq err I am 1-2% off, so I guess pretty close.

[supercowboy]

Is this where you are talking about changing the Y axis. This is under Fuel System>Fuel Pump>Leading Edge Angle

Then right click on the Y axis on the right then multiple that side of the graph by 1.32 which is my 32% over fuel lobe.

leading edge.png

yes this correct. This corrects the fuel volume to rpm across the table and brings it back into spec.

[supercowboy]

Cylinder Airmass. That's why it's important to get the MAF as close to perfect as possible.

I have noticed tuning on touring mode I have the MAF as tight as I can. When the car goes into track mode I noticed my trims go over -20 percent. This must be due to the open exhaust. Is there a compensation for this? The other thing I was thinking is the SOI not at the correct spot.

[cmitchell17]

yes this correct. This corrects the fuel volume to rpm across the table and brings it back into spec.

Yes, this is the same way I did it and the way Greg Banish explains in his video on how to correct for a new fuel lobe.

[cmitchell17]

I have noticed tuning on touring mode I have the MAF as tight as I can. When the car goes into track mode I noticed my trims go over -20 percent. This must be due to the open exhaust. Is there a compensation for this? The other thing I was thinking is the SOI not at the correct spot.

I don't see how the NPP could have any effect on it, the difference should be so negligible especially when your in closed loop with trim feedback/correction, at higher RPM's it does enough to give you that 5 extra HP so you should notice it there but you also wouldn't notice it on the trims because you would be in open loop/PE.

The SOI theory makes a lot more sense. I am really curious to know on how much combustion quality (which I am sure SOI has a significant effect on combustion quality/timing/completeness) effects the O2 feedback. I have asked this question on why do we trust widebands so much when it seems like there could be so much sensitivity and dependence on having high quality combustion. Banish talks about in his videos about false lean conditions that are actually very rich because of unburnt fuel due to misfires. I don't trust my stock narrowband or wideband trim feedback at idle with my big cam at lower/idle speeds.

[lt1z350]

To dredge this up again did anyone do the testing they talked about? Or just land on 280 in the whole table and let it adjust on its own? I have seen Brett pray post that he found 20whp on a car heads and cam that had it adjusted wrong. I wound think it would have to me the airmass was way off and it was commanding up into the high 390s or 400. The few cams I have looked at most are grinding them with exhaust closing and intake opening in the tdc range 360 degrees give or take a few degrees at least with the pd blower cams.
If the ecm is adjusting up then going to 280 gives a margin of error for sure and I guess the thinking on this. I might be able to do some dyno testing this afternoon so will test some out just curious if anyone else found anything.
Thanks.

[lt1z350]

Oops double post fixed

[Jonblarc7]

I'm very curios about this too. I don't think my SOI is right on my cammed L86 218/226. No matter what I do to the AFR and try zeroing in the MAF and VE tables. I still get a cloud of black smoke on the hit. Then it clean up, But it's almost embarrassing to look like a diesel taking off from the line.

I under stand Higgs saying to set the whole table to 280 but how do I log to know if I need to increase it in certain area's.