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Thread: 4t65e TCM tune for 24 Hours of Lemons/Lucky Dog Racing

  1. #1
    Tuner in Training TheEhTeam's Avatar
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    4t65e TCM tune for 24 Hours of Lemons/Lucky Dog Racing

    We are Endurance Racing a 2006 3.5l Chevy Impala FWD auto. 24 Hours of Lemons Racing dictates that the cars need to be purchased for less than $500US or $550 Cdn. To meet their safety requirements, much more money is then spent to put in the race seat, roll cage, brakes, rims, tires, exhaust, etc. etc. Lemons piles 100 cars onto a track and then has them race against each other for 8 hours on Saturday and usually 7 hours on Sunday. With the closure of the US border and the distance involved in traveling to the Lemons races, we have turned to Lucky Dog Racing Canada. We could not afford the 3.9l Police version nor the 5.3l SS version of the Impala, (they were definitely not $500) we got what we have. However, we now want to "tune" the 4t65e transmission from Granny "maximum economical" mode into a performance tune that meets our race specifications.
    We are racing on Continental Extreme Sport 255/40ZR/17 tires that generate 831 revs/mile. Our 3.5l generates a maximum of 214 ft lbs of torque at 4000RPM and 211 HP at 5900 RPM. The final drive in our transmission is 2.86. The ratios are 1st: 2.92, 2nd: 1.56, 3rd: 1.0 and 4th: .70. Our transmission was completely rebuilt this past summer after overheating the season before. A transmission cooler has been installed. If I use the calculations as per this article:
    http://www.yourdatadriven.com/best-g...-a-racing-car/
    My optimal shift points are: 1st - all the way to red line 6400RPM or 85kph, 2nd - 5500RPM or 140kph, 3rd - 5000 RPM or 190kph, 4th - rarely used maybe at the end of Calabogie Motorsports back straightaway.....
    So, since I'm brand new to HP Tuners and the VCM Editor, could I solicit comments, suggestions and advice regarding the set-up of the TCM based on a successful upload of the OE configuration from the HP Forum? Correct me if I'm wrong but I need to start here at the Speedo page first? The Calibration tab?
    Thanks in advance, Richard.
    Attached Files Attached Files

    Richard Hatkoski
    2006 Impala 3.5l FWD Auto

  2. #2
    Advanced Tuner
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    Post your tune up so we can see what tables are available. I do see a note on the Supported Vehicles page that the Impala 3.5s are only supported from 07+, are you able to successfully read your ECM+TCM out?

    Speedo tab will be used for speed limiter and tire size changes. Shift points/pressure/torque converter will all be under the Transmission tab.

    Look for the BlueCat Transmission Tool on google, it'll pull up the correct threads on the forum here. This software will let you optimize your shift points based on your desired shift RPM and speed/VSS plus the TCC. Then you can copy/paste back into HPTuners.
    ~Erik~
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  3. #3
    Tuner in Training TheEhTeam's Avatar
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    Hello Erik and thanks for your reply.
    I will be able to post the latest tune file Monday, the Impala and laptop are at the shop and I will be there tomorrow. Before I purchased the HP Tuner HPVI2 from Fast Toys Performance, I checked with them to make sure the 2006 3.5l Impala was a supported vehicle. It is but for some reason HP lists it as 07+. I can upload and download into the ECM and TCM no problem.
    I discovered the HPTuners VCM Suite Online Help so it is helping to explain the GM parameters tabs.
    I will download the Bluecoat Transmission Tool - I found a link to it on the Camaro forum.
    Stay tuned!

    Richard Hatkoski
    2006 Impala 3.5l FWD Auto

  4. #4
    Tuner in Training TheEhTeam's Avatar
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    2006 Impala 4t65e tune and Blue Cat files

    Ok Erik, attached are the latest tune and Blue Cat files from today's session on HP Tuners. 5FDP has offered some engine parameter changes and I will input those later tonight. My day job is interfering with my hobby but it pays the bills.
    I inputted as much as I could into the Blue Cat file. I converted it from MPH to KPH (metric) before I saved it. I haven't exported the BC data into the tune file transmission tables yet, I will do that, as well, tonight.
    This video helped explain how Blue Cat works:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8vi7A7RGEs&t=308s
    I have attached the tune file as of today, 1:45PM Eastern.
    The Blue Cat file won't load, email me if you would like a copy of that to comment on.
    Let me know if you see anything obvious, wrong or destructive.
    Regards, Richard
    Attached Files Attached Files

    Richard Hatkoski
    2006 Impala 3.5l FWD Auto

  5. #5
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    Can you post your stock read as well to compare them? I don't know what the stock shift points/pressures/etc are, so comparing will be helpful.

    I'll take a look through the modified file tonight.
    ~Erik~
    2013 Sonic RS - manual, CGM, 6M, sunroof, mods in process
    2008 TrailBlazer 3SS AWD LS2, loaded, dropped, modded, SE22 Performance tuned. And then some...
    2002 TrailBlazer LT 4WD 4.2L I6, lifted, tires, exhaust, SE22 Performance tuned

  6. #6
    Tuner in Training TheEhTeam's Avatar
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    Original 2006 3.5l Impala tune file

    Good evening Erik, here is the original tune file - no modifications to either the ECM or TCM, it was as we purchased it. To my knowledge, the previous owner did not do any modifications. I'm working on the Engine spec changes tonight, will post the results when I'm done.
    Regards, Richard
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    Richard Hatkoski
    2006 Impala 3.5l FWD Auto

  7. #7
    Tuner in Training TheEhTeam's Avatar
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    Latest 2006 3.5l 4t65e tune file

    Latest changes to the tune file incorporating 5FDP's suggestions regarding the COT and my attempt at inputting as much of the BC table data as I could. Feel free to comment, regards, Richard.
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    Richard Hatkoski
    2006 Impala 3.5l FWD Auto

  8. #8
    Advanced Tuner dhoagland's Avatar
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    I'm pretty green Turner.
    The 2 things I see are observations, and kind of questions too...

    I believe you have a conflict with your Part throttle shift speeds and your WOT shift speeds
    1st gear: I believe you are okay. WOT slightly higher, should not matter which command is chosen...
    2nd gear: WOT is commanded 4 MPH earlier
    3rd gear: WOT is set at 147 but in part throttle shift you have it at 242 (locking it out).. I'm wondering if it will shift at the WOT or not

    Torque converter tables have similar conflicts

    Following, looking forward to a Senior Tuner's feed back
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  9. #9
    Tuner in Training TheEhTeam's Avatar
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    Thank you Hoagland for your comments and for posting the Shift and TC tables. I was able to open those up in a separate window and print them out in colour. Upon closer consideration, I'm going to modify the Throttle Position table to show the following:
    2 -> 3 Shift - I would like it to max at 87mph and for it to increase in increments starting at 67, 72, 75, 78, 81, 83, 85, then 87.
    3 -> 4 Shift - I would like it to max at 123mph and for it to increase in increments starting at 95, 98, 101, 104, 107, 110, 114, 117, 120 then 123.
    When we are on the track, we are are at 100% throttle from the apex of the turn to the braking area at the end of the very next straightaway. We aren't in a traffic situation where you would stomp the throttle, expect it to drop a gear and then accelerate to make the pass. Passes are made only while overtaking at full throttle or if you are lucky catching someone going into or coming out of a turn. A linked series of turns or S turns require a constant throttle position but I want the transmission to remain in gear so we have some engine braking capability. I don't want it to shift up when my foot comes off the gas in the turns and then have it shift down when I apply full throttle. I just want it to stay in gear even if it is revving higher so it comes on again as throttle is applied.
    To create this condition, what should the 3 -> 2 Shift and 4 -> 3 Shift Throttle Position portion of the table look like?
    Looking forward to comments and suggestions, regards, Richard

    Richard Hatkoski
    2006 Impala 3.5l FWD Auto

  10. #10
    Advanced Tuner dhoagland's Avatar
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    I'm plugging your numbers into the shift pattern chart.

    Do you want the torque converter locked at any point? Looking at the WOT chart it will never lock.
    And even off throttle it might not... I'm thinking it could be used for enhancing the off throttle braking effect... But I'm not sure how far you coast and if converter locking isn't ever used in your application...
    2011 Camaro 2SS Convertible L99 Bone Stock for now
    2003 Dodge 2500 5.9 Cummins QC 4x4. Airaid, 2nd Gen Intake, Grid Heater Delete, D-Tech 62/65/12, Magnaflow. Bully Dog: Propane Injection, Triple Dog W/Outlook Crazy Larry. Edge EZ, BD Flow-Max, 48RE: Sonnax Sure Cure/Transgo combination, Derale turbulator, billet input, Triple Disc, Super servo, 4 ring Accumulator. :beer

  11. #11
    Tuner in Training TheEhTeam's Avatar
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    TC Lockout 4t65e Race Conditions

    Good morning Hoagland, our transmission rebuilder recommended that we either have the torque converter switched "off", "disabled" or lock it out. Theoretically, it could get us a couple of more mph more at the top end of 3rd before it shifts to 4th but that is only going to be momentary so it is not worth it. We have installed a transmission cooler and we have a separate transmission temperature gauge on the dash to monitor transmission temperatures while racing. If the temperature creeps up for whatever reason, we will definitely pit and adjust accordingly. If you would like to suggest inputs to "lock out" the TC, please post and I will update on my end as well. Cheers, Richard.
    In Canada, we are in kilometres per hour verses miles per hour so I've been converting back and forth. We have the max speed and fuel cut out set at 220 kph. Our maximum speed so far has been just below 200 kph. Canadian Tire Motorsports Park is our next race in May and we have a track day scheduled there for April.

    Richard Hatkoski
    2006 Impala 3.5l FWD Auto

  12. #12
    Tuner in Training TheEhTeam's Avatar
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    Tentative 2006 Impala 3.5l 4t65e Race Tune Specs

    I have tried to incorporate everything into this version of the Race tune file. The speedo is setup according to tire size, the fuel cut-off RPM and safety speed have been adjusted, the catalytic has been turned off and the SES errors switched off. I've used the Blue Cat tuner to set up the specifications for the Normal part throttle shift, KPH and WOT. I have used this information in the Normal, Pattern A and Pattern B tables. I have not altered the HOT tables. I have set all the TC values high so the TC should be locked out. If anyone has any other suggestions, I would appreciate the input.
    Two files are attached, the original tune file with only tire and max speed adjusted, the second file is the latest RACE tune file.
    Regards, Richard
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    Richard Hatkoski
    2006 Impala 3.5l FWD Auto

  13. #13
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    hey everyone does anyone feel like and helping newbie out looking at my 2010 impala3.5l stock tune and give me some info help getting started spicing up the old girl. lol or can i segswap some table frome this 06 3.5 file and compare? Thanks in advance for any help!
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    Last edited by RUBADOU; 02-08-2021 at 03:05 PM. Reason: att file

  14. #14
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    my recommendation is utilize the sports mode function for racing with following tweaks:
    firm shifts up
    lock out 4th gear entirely
    bump up the downshift speeds while also limiting down shift rpm's i.e prevent a 4-2, 3-1 downshift if someone stomps the pedal
    turn lock up off

  15. #15
    Tuner Onomoto's Avatar
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    hey team. i have had the blue cat tool for a while but only see options for rwd trans and not for a 4t65e. can you share with me how you did it?
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