2014 Mustang GT500 Whipple 3.8L 150mm Throttle Body issues

[Robert00MustangTurbo]

Hello,

I was tasked to dial in this 2014 Mustang GT500 with the following modifications:

Whipple 3.8L Supercharger with Whipple 150MM Roval Throttle Body
3.75 Pulley
ATI 15% Dampener
JLT 148 CAI
PNR Ice Tank -16AN
MFP Crank Support
Fore Innovations Fuel System Level 4 Triple Pump 465
ID1700 Injectors
Kooks Complete Exhaust system Long Tube Headers 11422400
L&M Engines Short Block
ARP2000 Head Studs
TSS Oil Pump Gears
TSS Crank Sprocket
BPS Custom NSR Camshafts
McLeod RXT Twin Disc Clutch kit

My main question: is there any available Throttle Body Data for this throttle body?

I used a Kenne Bell 168 Data I had on file and got it close but this throttle body is definitely something else to dial in. Used 2 different methods of throttle body tuning, but no definite fix.

Tried torque/inverse but minimal luck.

Also started from scratch a few times now.

I also keep running into Driver Demand Limit Source: Combustion Stability Limit and Indicated Torque Limit

I tried searching here and other sources, but couldn't find anything related to these new Gen 5 Whipple Superchargers.





Any Insight would be appreciated.


I will attach more logs tomorrow as I go though this.



Jorge-2014-GT500-whipple-3.8l-150mm-throttle-body.hpt
Combustion-stability-limit.hpl

[Witt]

The combustion stability limit issue, you may be able to enter higher than max value indicated in max map in the combustion stability value (44821). I'm not sure that the HPTuners indicated limit is correct for this, I've seen SCT show higher max values but I don't have it on this PC so I can't say what the theoretical max is.

Indicated torque limit might be table 38136 Inverse Load Clip. You have 2.00 entered in all the cells but are exceeding that in your log.

For throttle errors, I use a chart with ETC Vacuum vs Effective Area and plot ETC Angle Error and enter that into HPT's Effective Area Calculator as described in this post to cure any TB related error if you know your torque and inverse torque tables are decent.

Some of your speed density max map values may need to be raised as well to see the increased boost from the bigger blower.

[Robert00MustangTurbo]

On the other logs I have on my laptop at work, they'll peg at 70inHg and air load would be around 2.60, so I can see trying to enter a higher value may work. I'll have to check on Advantage as well and see where that limit is at.

I did miss that section, those values were there when I pulled the file off of the car before modifying. I'll post the file I pulled off when I go back into work tomorrow, car is on the dyno currently.

I do have that histogram setup, and thankfully the car isn't bucking/surging anymore. Will make the corrections and post tomorrow.

[SultanHassanMasTuning]

you can find the 150mm data on the cobrajet i believe

[MRRPMBRP]

I have a 4.5 whipple on mine, pump gas motor, same tb, was running into all those limits too, but not anymore. It's been so long, I can't remember what all I did to get away from them. I have that same 3.8l blower to try sometime along, so setup may be similar. I'm not at my laptop, but will be after bit, I'll post the tune so you can compare, maybe that'll help

[Robert00MustangTurbo]

The combustion stability limit issue, you may be able to enter higher than max value indicated in max map in the combustion stability value (44821). I'm not sure that the HPTuners indicated limit is correct for this, I've seen SCT show higher max values but I don't have it on this PC so I can't say what the theoretical max is.

Indicated torque limit might be table 38136 Inverse Load Clip. You have 2.00 entered in all the cells but are exceeding that in your log.

For throttle errors, I use a chart with ETC Vacuum vs Effective Area and plot ETC Angle Error and enter that into HPT's Effective Area Calculator as described in this post to cure any TB related error if you know your torque and inverse torque tables are decent.

Some of your speed density max map values may need to be raised as well to see the increased boost from the bigger blower.

SCT for this particular PCM Strategy has the same limit for map combustion stability.

Screenshot (8).png




Here's a screenshot of where map is at

Screenshot (10).png


I will apply the changes this morning and report back.

[Robert00MustangTurbo]

I raised 38136 Inverse Load Clip to 4.0 and raised max map in the combustion stability value 44821 to 70. We're not hitting the Combustion stability limit anymore but now hitting Trans Truncation and Engine indicated torque limit.

Kind of weird I'm hitting trans truncation even when raised.

Throttle is finally wide open at 82 Degrees as commanded, but not going into power enrichment because of the limits.


Also threw the fun ETC FMEM and code P2112.

Jorge 2014 GT500 whipple 3.8l 150mm throttle body Map limit 70.hpt
Engine indicated trq limit 82 degrees throttle 70 map combustion limit.hpl
ETC FMEM.hpl



I did forget to raise the speed density tables mentioned on post 2. I will make those changes and see if there are improvements.

[ghostofnyc]

did you get this situated?

[VCMotorSport]

I raised 38136 Inverse Load Clip to 4.0 and raised max map in the combustion stability value 44821 to 70. We're not hitting the Combustion stability limit anymore but now hitting Trans Truncation and Engine indicated torque limit.

Kind of weird I'm hitting trans truncation even when raised.

Throttle is finally wide open at 82 Degrees as commanded, but not going into power enrichment because of the limits.


Also threw the fun ETC FMEM and code P2112.

Jorge 2014 GT500 whipple 3.8l 150mm throttle body Map limit 70.hpt
Engine indicated trq limit 82 degrees throttle 70 map combustion limit.hpl
ETC FMEM.hpl



I did forget to raise the speed density tables mentioned on post 2. I will make those changes and see if there are improvements.

Hi Roberto, did you get it done?. I would like to talk to you if you let me.. I?m in the same journey now

Thanks