Results 1 to 12 of 12

Thread: Tuning with meth injection on a coyote

  1. #1
    Tuner
    Join Date
    Apr 2020
    Location
    Moline, IL
    Posts
    79

    Tuning with meth injection on a coyote

    Just wondering who out there has tuned successfully with meth injection? (on the Coyote)

    Last year I attempted this and found that water injection only was much easier to tune with little to no meth being injected. I was having issues with it throwing off IPC torque. The more fuel being added that the ECU doesn't account for the bigger the issue. I ended up being able to achieve what I was hoping to with water injection only. This year I have much bigger plans and I have seen some photos of guys running meth with success. I would really love to hear a successful strategy. Any insight would be greatly appreciated.

  2. #2
    Tuner in Training
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    24
    Quote Originally Posted by Relentless View Post
    Just wondering who out there has tuned successfully with meth injection? (on the Coyote)

    Last year I attempted this and found that water injection only was much easier to tune with little to no meth being injected. I was having issues with it throwing off IPC torque. The more fuel being added that the ECU doesn't account for the bigger the issue. I ended up being able to achieve what I was hoping to with water injection only. This year I have much bigger plans and I have seen some photos of guys running meth with success. I would really love to hear a successful strategy. Any insight would be greatly appreciated.
    Are you getting ipc torque error because your adding more timing or because your A/F is falling on its face? I run 50/50 water meth and tune via nozzle and ramp rate. I check my logs and see where im leaning out. if i pulley down i nozzle up and adjust timing. if not running boost and just water meth youll need to either adjust your maf curve or your sd tables.

  3. #3
    Tuner
    Join Date
    Apr 2020
    Location
    Moline, IL
    Posts
    79
    Quote Originally Posted by ishyne22 View Post
    Are you getting ipc torque error because your adding more timing or because your A/F is falling on its face? I run 50/50 water meth and tune via nozzle and ramp rate. I check my logs and see where im leaning out. if i pulley down i nozzle up and adjust timing. if not running boost and just water meth youll need to either adjust your maf curve or your sd tables.
    I am getting IPC torque error due to a foreign fuel being added (ends up rich and doesn't know why). When I use water injection only I have no issues whatsoever. I feel like I could somewhat minimize this with adjusting the MAF curve, but it would be a bandaid at best. I doubt the throttle response would be smooth, predictable or have proper drive ability.

  4. #4
    Tuner
    Join Date
    Jan 2021
    Location
    Northern Virginia
    Posts
    143
    Quote Originally Posted by Relentless View Post
    I am getting IPC torque error due to a foreign fuel being added (ends up rich and doesn't know why). When I use water injection only I have no issues whatsoever. I feel like I could somewhat minimize this with adjusting the MAF curve, but it would be a bandaid at best. I doubt the throttle response would be smooth, predictable or have proper drive ability.
    I'm curious to this as well since I'm planning on adding port fuel injection to my Focus for E85 (similar strategies), and was worried about exactly this. I'm wondering if the STFT are able to lean out enough to correct the AFR in your case? I'm cautious about adjusting the MAF curve as well. The only other thing I was thinking of would be allowing the injection system to handle 100% of the fuel enrichment and finding a way to make the car okay with a richer mixture than commanded (basically making it open loop WOT).

    You may find some answers looking at conversations about ecoboosts with aftermarket port injection (Focus ST and 2.3 Mustang). Although it's MAP based, they still have to deal with the IPC system, and I know they've got it down to a T.

  5. #5
    Tuner in Training
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Posts
    28
    I swing the MAF curve all the time for wet nitrous shots, so far no issue. Log your and TQ error with load on the Y axis and RPM's on the X axis.Take those values scale them and adjust your TQ tables accordingly.

    tq.JPG

  6. #6
    Tuner
    Join Date
    Aug 2015
    Location
    San Antonio, TX
    Posts
    179
    What problem does IPC torque error cause? I have a 2015 gen 2 and I don’t even log IPC torque because I’ve never had a problem with it. Car is turbo e85, so maybe I haven’t experienced problems caused by water meth injection?

  7. #7
    Tuner in Training
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Posts
    28
    Quote Originally Posted by Plimmer View Post
    What problem does IPC torque error cause? I have a 2015 gen 2 and I don?t even log IPC torque because I?ve never had a problem with it. Car is turbo e85, so maybe I haven?t experienced problems caused by water meth injection?
    The problem people notice most is the TB closing or surging.

  8. #8
    Tuner
    Join Date
    Apr 2020
    Location
    Moline, IL
    Posts
    79
    These can be a subjective thing. Some people don't mind or don't notice the throttle fluttering or surging. I only slightly noticed it before, but when it was eliminated/minimized it seemed like a drastic improvement. Some days I wish I didn't notice it, hell I drive bone stock fords and notice issues that could be tuned out. kinda feels like a curse...

  9. #9
    Tuner
    Join Date
    Apr 2020
    Location
    Moline, IL
    Posts
    79
    interesting, do you have this progressively inject based on throttle/RPM?

  10. #10
    Tuner in Training
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    24
    Quote Originally Posted by Relentless View Post
    interesting, do you have this progressively inject based on throttle/RPM?
    you should only be injecting at WOT. I ramp mine in starting at 5lbs and full spray by 10lbs. Go into your PE tables and lean out your WOT lamda where you plan to spray.

  11. #11
    Tuner
    Join Date
    Jan 2021
    Location
    Northern Virginia
    Posts
    143
    Here's what I don't understand. At least in my case (and I believe in the 13+ Coyote's), the car stays closed loop during WOT. So as you add meth, the fuel trims would start pulling fuel to hit the target lambda, right? Not sure if it happens quickly enough to matter. If it was open loop, modifying the PE tables makes sense to me.

  12. #12
    Tuner in Training
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    24
    fuel enrichment pedal. you are correct robcat030 2011+ operate closed loop at wot. stft should be compensating for the fuel addition but if he is not ramping it in then the o2 sensors probably cant keep up. One could manipulate using PE table.
    Last edited by ishyne22; 05-18-2021 at 09:25 PM.