Learn to tune. "THE RIGHT WAY!"

[ivandrago54914]

2019 C7 Z06. Installed Texas Speed 2" long tube headers (catless), and Haltec fresh air intake. I am looking to learn and understand HP Tuners. I have a better than average understanding of engines and all things mechanical. I used to work in a race engine shop and was responsible for all cnc machining but also assisted with engine assembly, setting up engines and running engines on the dyno. I used some of Mercury Marine's software on some of the offshore racing engines and some other software for off road truck racing engines.

I need to learn the right way to tune with HP Tuners. I am not a trial and error guy. (Even though that's kind of what tuning is.) I am willing to read literature or watch videos to learn the software. What I am not interested in doing is spending 95% of my time trying to find what to read and where to find it.

Another issue I have is this. After I learn the software, I'm really not sure where to find the information as to what parameters the LT4 likes and what will cause damage. Some general guidelines would be nice to know. On pump gas - how much timing is safe, what afr's at what rpm's, how much boost, e.g.

If someone could point me in the right direction as to where I should begin I would really appreciate it. If there are classes available, I am interested. I have no issue paying to learn.

[ivandrago54914]

This is my point. Not 1 reply. Amazing at this rate when i finally get the answers i need the car will be obsolete! Haven't even asked a tuning question yet!!!!!!

[SultanHassanMasTuning]

many of us are willing to help

always post a file and a log

[Jbeemer]

There is tons of info right on this forum...search, That is what I've done the past few weeks to learn gen v.

This guy also has a lot of good videos'. https://www.youtube.com/c/GoatRopeGarage/videos

[smokeshow]

The right way cannot be done on gen 5 with the engine in the vehicle. Period.

Technically, not even since gen 4...but we've been able to work around it given the limited authority of the coordinated torque control system in gen 4. Any claims of proficiency with tooning a gen 5 is nothing but a mix between hack efforts and low standards as modifications become more complicated. That is, unless the engine receives full torque characterization on an engine dyno. I can count on one hand how many companies have this capability and the knowledge to do it and have fingers to spare. I avoid gen 5 stuff with heavy modifications because of this.

The piggyback and standalone ECM is making and will continue to make its comeback in the coming years.

[pisces_0]

https://cartrainingonline.com/courses/gm/
https://thetuningschool.com/

[ivandrago54914]

Can't even figure out how to post log file.

[crankz1]

Click Go Advanced then click the paper clip button. Then click add files.

[ivandrago54914]

21-05-11 11-58-54.hpl

this is what i have so far

[Jonblarc7]

I too started learning HP tuner on a gen 5 L86 with TPS 218/226 and full bolt-ons. Go to Goat Rope on Youtube and watch all his GEN5 videos and most of the ones that aren't GEN5 just becuase you'll pic up little things. That will give you a starting point.

Then come back to the HP forum with very specific problems. And you'll get alot of help. You can't hit these guy's with a general I want to learn to tune because it's to much information. But if you come back and say "My target PE is .89 and my wideband keeps hitting .93 at 2,300 to 3,500" you'll get alot of help.

[HeavyChevy305]

I too started learning HP tuner on a gen 5 L86 with TPS 218/226 and full bolt-ons. Go to Goat Rope on Youtube and watch all his GEN5 videos and most of the ones that aren't GEN5 just becuase you'll pic up little things. That will give you a starting point.

Then come back to the HP forum with very specific problems. And you'll get alot of help. You can't hit these guy's with a general I want to learn to tune because it's to much information. But if you come back and say "My target PE is .89 and my wideband keeps hitting .93 at 2,300 to 3,500" you'll get alot of help.

This

[ivandrago54914]

New plan. I am looking for someone that is familiar with the lt4 and that can edit my tune and email it back to me. I am happy to pay. I will not work with anyone that will lock my ecu!!!!!!!! does anyone have any recommendations for a willing and able tuner?

By going this route I can actually drive my car yet this year!!

[mbray01]

The right way cannot be done on gen 5 with the engine in the vehicle. Period.

Technically, not even since gen 4...but we've been able to work around it given the limited authority of the coordinated torque control system in gen 4. Any claims of proficiency with tooning a gen 5 is nothing but a mix between hack efforts and low standards as modifications become more complicated. That is, unless the engine receives full torque characterization on an engine dyno. I can count on one hand how many companies have this capability and the knowledge to do it and have fingers to spare. I avoid gen 5 stuff with heavy modifications because of this.

The piggyback and standalone ECM is making and will continue to make its comeback in the coming years.

While i may be over simplifying this, you are definitely over complicating this. THese systems are torqued based, yes, but the torque is 100% derived from the airflow model. The base is already set by gm, this engine will make x torque at y rpm, with z timing, and a airflow. When you correct the airflow module properly, specifically the ve tables, the torque tables are almost always dead nuts on. Ive done a few with just absolutely radical cams that the idle torque takes a lot of work(still not sure if those are torque related or large throttle body related). I can log torque on the engine stock, with my dyno, then after modifications have the correct torque modeling without touching the torque tables. getting the airflow 100% is what these need. no reason any competent tuner cant do that.

[5FDP]

Smoke was a GM engineer and for others as well, I'd think what he is saying is pretty well true. We are just good enough at being hacks to make stuff work on these later model vehicles.

[Frost]

The right way cannot be done on gen 5 with the engine in the vehicle. Period.

Technically, not even since gen 4...but we've been able to work around it given the limited authority of the coordinated torque control system in gen 4. Any claims of proficiency with tooning a gen 5 is nothing but a mix between hack efforts and low standards as modifications become more complicated. That is, unless the engine receives full torque characterization on an engine dyno. I can count on one hand how many companies have this capability and the knowledge to do it and have fingers to spare. I avoid gen 5 stuff with heavy modifications because of this.

The piggyback and standalone ECM is making and will continue to make its comeback in the coming years.

OP.

Listen to everything this man says.

[Ghostnotes]

OP.

Listen to everything this man says.

Exactly,

Just to formulate the math for a torque based control system from air and all the other modifiers took who knows how long.... From a process flow perspective it's pretty follow-able. Beyond that is best guesstimate for most.

Hell my car runs great, gets to my planned AFR percentage,torque and PE, no stumbling or surging. To some degree it was done by seat of the pants.....maybe I just got lucky because early on for me, amongst the speculation, I was just trying to spot trends, peaks and valleys...etc

[ivandrago54914]

So nobody knows of a tuner I can use? I'm almost ready to say fuck it and just run it til it blows up. Getting pretty irritated with the whole thing. I work 18 hours a day 7 days a week. Don't have time to maybe get a partial answer every 3 to 4 days. THIS WILL TAKE YEARS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HP tuners is quick to sell you everything you want with little to no help. Or I say 2019 Z06 for sale with complete HP tuner setup to go with it. I am used to cnc machines and programming software where even though each control varies with each machine, (like a car) there ar manuals, tech support, and ways to get the information you need in a very short timeframe.

So long story short. NOT A LOT OF FREE TIME. NEED SOMEONE TO HELP WITH A TUNE. HAPPY TO PAY TO DO SO. WILL LEARN HP SOFTWARE WHEN I DO HAVE MORE TIME.

[Daft]

Exactly,

Just to formulate the math for a torque based control system from air and all the other modifiers took who knows how long.... From a process flow perspective it's pretty follow-able. Beyond that is best guesstimate for most.

Hell my car runs great, gets to my planned AFR percentage,torque and PE, no stumbling or surging. To some degree it was done by seat of the pants.....maybe I just got lucky because early on for me, amongst the speculation, I was just trying to spot trends, peaks and valleys...etc

From what i have noticed all the "good tuners" don't have time to post information on this forum. Most of them have spend endless amounts of hours behind a keyboard and on a load based dyno to figure everything out, especially on the 5th gen stuff. They don't really want to share all that info and even if they could its self taught fro trial and error. have you tried to find a tuner in your area that deals with corvettes ?

[ivandrago54914]

Yes. I know a guy but he will lock my computer. You have to wait 4 to 6 weeks to get an appointment. That doesn't work for me. There is a series of videos out there and I am more than capable of following them and replicating what he is teaching but would just need to know what issue to address first. Maf tuning? A chronological order of what to address would be nice. Any thoughts?

[ivandrago54914]

Also. I guess machinists , cnc programmers look at things completely different. We all pick up little tricks and tips throughout our careers but we are always willing to help other people out. I used to work in the race engine industry and what I noticed about all of the engine builders around me 95% of them are full of shit , lie, and have serious ego issues! That is part of why I got out of that industry.

I have always been willing to help others and that has always reflected positively on me and my company. I guarantee more doors and opportunities have come our way because of that way of thinking. It's common sense - someone helps me I always return the favor. Thats just how I think and it has worked out quite well for us.