Got a remote tune for my 2017 Camaro, does it seem good?

[Cupkicker]

Did some upgrades to my 2017 Camaro RS, I've never tuned anything before and am just learning so I opted for a remote tune so I didn't destroy my engine right out of the gate lol. I did some basic bolt ons: Cold air intake, 3" downpipe with 400 cell cat, 3" straight pipe cat back exhaust, upgraded front mount intercooler, and a gfb turbo diverter. After the 3rd revision of the tune I started getting a check engine light with a code P2270: O2 Sensor Signal Stuck Lean Bank 1 Sensor 2. I told the tuner about it and sent a new scan for him to look at. Got another revision back and all he did was disable the check engine light for that code. Not having much confidence in the tuner at this point but I dont know enough about what I'm looking at to know if it was ok that he did that or if he should have made more changes to the tune. I attached some screen shots of the graphs that he had setup in the layout he sent me.


01 spark advance.jpg02 spark retard.jpg03 lt fuel trim.jpg04 st fuel trim.jpg05 o2 mv.jpg

[Cupkicker]

Here are the tune files from stock through revision a, b, and c. The lastest revision d only differs from c in that the code p2270 was disabled


2017 camaro stock.hptcamaro 17 man s1k ic 93 cd a.hptcamaro 17 man s1k ic 93 cd b.hptcamaro 17 man s1k ic 93 cd c.hpt

[10_SS]

Your 02 B1S1 voltage is around 0.003mv, which is low, is it not connected? Could be bad. You need to add that to the plot, see if it changes. It should be moving 100mv-900mv multiple tiimes per second when idling, or driving. 450mv would be 14.67AFR, they switch back and forth, rich/lean, that's how the ECU controls fueling. That one is bottomed out. Need to figure out why. Disabling the code is the absolute WRONG thing to do, unless you purposely removed the 02 sensor (running open loop all the time).

Your LTFT is around ranges from -20% meaning tune is very rich, and pulling 20% of fuel out, then lean, at higher MAP/load, lower RPM but not bad, but not that lean, but with the 02 not working, then that part is likely not updating.

Could also be just because your showing the beginning of the log, where the 02 sensor hasn't started working yet.

Based on your LTFT, your tune needs LOTS of work. That "Tuner" doesn't know what he's doing.

[Cupkicker]

Yes those screen shots were taken at the very beginning of the log, so maybe it just wasn?t reading yet like you said. I?m pretty sure the b1s1 o2 sensor is working but I can check the log tomorrow to make sure. It looks like he only disabled the check engine light for the b1s2 o2 sensor. I still have both o2 sensors hooked up. The down pipe came with a 90 degree elbow for the after cat o2 and I have that installed. Having it running rich explains why my gas mileage got a little worse. Not horrible but definitely not as good as before the tune. Most people say they actually get a little better mileage after tuning the 2.0 Camaros. Seems like I?m dropping boost when at moderate throttle. Over all pretty let down by the whole process, they make it seem like they have there stuff together in there YouTube vids, maybe I just got unlucky with the particular guy they assigned to my car. Not sure where to go from here

[10_SS]

Yes those screen shots were taken at the very beginning of the log, so maybe it just wasn?t reading yet like you said. I?m pretty sure the b1s1 o2 sensor is working but I can check the log tomorrow to make sure. It looks like he only disabled the check engine light for the b1s2 o2 sensor. I still have both o2 sensors hooked up. The down pipe came with a 90 degree elbow for the after cat o2 and I have that installed. Having it running rich explains why my gas mileage got a little worse. Not horrible but definitely not as good as before the tune. Most people say they actually get a little better mileage after tuning the 2.0 Camaros. Seems like I?m dropping boost when at moderate throttle. Over all pretty let down by the whole process, they make it seem like they have there stuff together in there YouTube vids, maybe I just got unlucky with the particular guy they assigned to my car. Not sure where to go from here

upload your log, the Charts look like averages from all of the data, which are how I made my conclusions... not good.

The after cat O2, not really needed, just used for OBD Emissions compliance check and can be disabled.

The way the system works is the engine runs off of the programed, set fuel tables. They never change unless you "tune" them.
Under normal driving (non-WOT/PE) the 02 sensors sniff the exhaust, and determine if it's lean, or rich. If it's perfect, then no change happens (0% LTFT). If it's Rich, then the computer removes fuel, and increments the LTFT to show how much fuel it is removing. So if it takes 5% less fuel to make it run at 14.67%AFR, then LTFT will show -5%, since it is removing 5% fuel to make it run at the proper AFR. LTFT is like a long Term average, STFT is instantaneous, and not really useful for tuning. Some people actually add LTFT and STFT together, this should give you more accurate instantaneous and Long Term correction being made.. and use that in one of your charts.

So, you have the log showing what cells are rich or lean. Usually 0 to -5% is ideal, but more than that just means you should adjust the MAF and VE tables to have closer fueling. Higher (lower) than -10% and something may be wrong, or your modifications changed it, and it needs tuning. -20% then tuning needs to be done ASAP. Beyond something like 25%, no further correction will be made and stock tunes throw a Check Engine light. Your Tuner disabled the very important Check Engine light that is there to make sure the 02 sensors are working.. not good!

In a nutshell, if your 0 to -5% off in fuel (LTFT showing 0 to -5%) then your good, because when you go WOT, then that fueling is now "Open Loop" - not using 02 feedback (since 02 sensors can only detect 14.67 by switching though 14.67), and will theoretically be off only the amount of your LTFT (-5), so the ECU does nothing to change fueling at WOT, it uses whatever the fuel tables are asking for. Since richer is safer, it uses whatever is in your fueling tables, with no correction. If your Lean, (LTFT showing a positive number, like 5%), then this means ECU is adding 5% more fuel than the fuel tables are asking for, and it thinks it could be lean at WOT also, so when you go WOT, the ECU will add 5% more fuel there also (remember, if LTFT is negative, then ECU will not change WOT/PE fueling at all).

So, if your LTFT is adding any amount of fuel (positive numbers) then you want to tune it to fix that since your WOT fueling will not be consistent, and could be lean.
If your LTFT is removing some fuel (negative numbers) but only something like -1 to -5% then your OK, WOT should be ok (assuming it is tuned ok).

The problem with your LTFT table is it's completely inconsitent.. it shows the fuel tables are set real rich down low (-20% LTFT), and lean out up high (+ LTFT). You want to get that fixed. Also upwards of 20+ LTFT, it will set a Check Engine light due to it adding way more fuel than you should be adding. Tuner probably just disabled that as well.

YOur 02 will also sit low and not move if your AFR is below something like 15.0AFR, or something is wrong with it. The 02's are really only good for 14.67AFR, which is around 450mv on the 02 reading. That is why the ECU switches back and forth between rich (>450mv = Lower than 14.67AFR) and lean (<450mv higher than 14.67AFR) all day long.

The fact that the ECU is correcting your bad fuel tables should be making it drive the same as having perfectly dialed in tables, since it is still below the limit of something like 25% LTFT. But, the large amount of error you have means either something is wrong (bad 02, manifold/header leak, etc) or the tuner just hacked up your tune. I would not go WOT, ever, until this is sorted out. Also, if you have logs that you have gone WOT, you should see the 02 reading somewhere around 900mv (rich). Anything less than 850-900mv at WOT is very unsafe, for now I would avoid it completely, maybe even work on getting a Wideband 02 installed to do it right.


One more possibility would be your Tuner is still tuning your setup.. which would mean he is intentionally disabling the Check Engine light, and asking you to gather LTFT fueling data, which he plans to make corrections too, then have you upload the new tune, and get your LTFT closer to 0 to -5%. But, didn't sound like that was what is happening.

[Cupkicker]

I ordered the parts and the tune all together and before I started reading and trying to learn about tuning. Most of what I’ve seen also says it should be done with a wide band, so that is something I am looking into getting, just trying to research a little first cause I have never messed with them before and have no idea what to get lol. This also has made me start to question how well they will even be able to tune it.
As far as if he is still working on the tune or what he is doing, I have zero idea. I’ve asked him what he needs to see or how I should be driving for the logs and to let me know what he needs me to do on my end and he has said absolutely nothing. Every email from him simply says “revision” with a file attached. The last email didn’t even say that, just a blank email with a file attached. The only real text in the email is the copy and pasted company info with a request to give a review of how they did lol. I figured going with what seemed like a very active company that a lot of people seem to be using would be a good way to go.
At this point I’m not sure if I should just get a wide band and start over from scratch myself and learn as I go or see if they will have one of the other tuners look at my files and help me out. Don’t really feel confident in the guy they have given me anymore. Feels like he either doesn’t know what he’s doing or doesn’t care.

Thank you for the info though, the way you laid it out was very clear and easy to understand

[Cupkicker]

I’ll upload the most recent log file as soon as I can. I don’t have my laptop with me and I won’t be home to get it till tomorrow evening. I tried downloading the log from my email to my phone, but can’t seem to get the file to upload from my phone to the forums

[10_SS]

You can easy tune your normal driving with LTFT. Easier and just as accurate as a Wideband with less work since it's already telling you how much correction you need.

Wideband is most useful for WOT tuning since that's where the stock 02's cant read very accurately.

I use the AEM 30-0334, easier than any other. Plugs into the CAN OBD Data stream, HPTuners reads over CAN, not analog input.
https://www.aemelectronics.com/produ...and-uego-obdii

[Cupkicker]

That’s probably what I’ll do is just try to tune it myself. Do you think it would be better to use the tune I have so far or just start over with the stock tune?
And the AEM 30-0334 is one that I was considering, I saw in the description that besides the obd connector, it also has additional wiring for a 0-5v or RS232 Serial output. Would this mean that I could also use this same wide band on an older vehicle that doesn’t have CAN? Reason I ask is I also have a 1999 corvette with an ls1 and I was actually planning on starting to learn to tune on that car since it seems to be a simpler setup than the newer gen v stuff. The vette is basically stock with the exception of long tube headers, high flow cats, and straight pipes. Been comparing the tine file I pulled from the vette and comparing it to some stock tunes I found on line and it doesn’t look like much has been done to the tune except disabling the after cat o2 sensors

[dr.mike]

The 0-5v output on the 30-0334 is available, if you add the pins for it, to the main connector.

The serial output is there, too. But, is a bit flaky and slow, as the gauge is shipped, from the factory. I have a firmware update for them that improves the serial performance.