my Phantom Codes (?)

[Boost]

These 4 codes are set as permanent despite multiple erasing's and test drives.

They are not causing the engine light to be illuminated or any drivability symptoms I am aware of.

I call them "Phantom Codes".

Any info ??

codes.png

[blindsquirrel]

https://forum.hptuners.com/showthrea...nd-VCM-Scanner

[Boost]

Thanks!

[Boost]

thank you that is great info and new to me - will try it for sure

[blindsquirrel]

If a permanent code is already set and you then go and disable the code that enables the diagnostic to run, it will not clear the permanent code, it will do the opposite - cause the permanent code to NEVER clear, even if you correct the condition that caused the code. The test(s) have to run and pass a certain number of times before the code will go away.

[HartRod]

I just noticed that I have two permanent codes listed under the log details on the scanner, P0960 & P0964. I have no check engine light and we I scan for DTCs they do not pop up. Is this something I should be concerned about? This is a 2017 Silverado L86/8L90 swapped into an 84 C10. I used a Speartech harness and with an E92/T87 (2015 Corvette OS).

PermanentDTC.jpg

[blindsquirrel]

You'll get in trouble trying to use the HPT scanner in place of a tool that was built specifically for diagnostics. It can do some of that but mostly by accident. And also, a text description and a screenshot of the part you think is relevant is not a substitute for the tune file/log file.

[HartRod]

You'll get in trouble trying to use the HPT scanner in place of a tool that was built specifically for diagnostics. It can do some of that but mostly by accident. And also, a text description and a screenshot of the part you think is relevant is not a substitute for the tune file/log file.

I was at work and didn't have access to my files. Here they are.

[gtstorey]

I was at work and didn't have access to my files. Here they are.

And Tune

[HartRod]

And Tune

Log uploaded.

[dassaur]

I genuinely have phantom codes in the VCM scanner. I had 2 codes permanently set related to DOD and rear o2 sensors. I reset the E38 with SPS to remove them - now the permanent codes are gone on every other scan tool (including GDS2) EXCEPT vcm scanner, including a full clear and reinstall. Strange.

[HartRod]

You'll get in trouble trying to use the HPT scanner in place of a tool that was built specifically for diagnostics. It can do some of that but mostly by accident. And also, a text description and a screenshot of the part you think is relevant is not a substitute for the tune file/log file.

Posted

[HartRod]

I genuinely have phantom codes in the VCM scanner. I had 2 codes permanently set related to DOD and rear o2 sensors. I reset the E38 with SPS to remove them - now the permanent codes are gone on every other scan tool (including GDS2) EXCEPT vcm scanner, including a full clear and reinstall. Strange.

Here's the response I received from Speartech when I asked about these codes:

"Permanent codes are extremely common on 2013+ or so engines. These codes do NOT trigger a check engine light nor affect functionality. Our GM MDI module and OEM GM scan tool won't pull permanent codes but HP Tuners and other scan tools will. So there is no problems to worry about unless you're seeing a check engine light on. Some permanent codes may go away after several drive cycles. This is mostly emissions/california related crap so people can't disable codes in a computer and trick the system.

Permanent codes are codes that populate from ANYONE that flashes a computer. We don't dictate what the EPA and California do. Most computers that are 2013+ or so start showing permanent codes. As mentioned in my previous email. THESE CODES DON'T AFFECT FUNCTIONALITY NOR DO THEY TRIGGER A CHECK ENGINE LIGHT. You can google permanent codes and go to the HP Tuners forum to learn more from other folks discussing these. If you had the GM scan tool like we use here they don't populate permanent codes. So you can get proof of them not causing an issue because your check engine light isn't on. If you go unplug the throttle body while the engine is running you will see the check engine light illuminate and then HP Tuners will show that code as Pending/Current. Those are the only codes to worry about."

Rob

[2xLS1]

Permanent codes started in 2010. I've been told that is you use SPS to flash a completely different VIN calibration to the PCM then flash it back to the original VIN calibration that will erase the permanent codes. Disclaimer - I haven't tried it. If it is not a swap vehicle the PCs could effect emission testing if you have to go through that. On swaps I don't know how people deal with emission testing. We don't have them where I live.

[HartRod]

Bump

[blindsquirrel]

If a permanent code is already set and you then go and disable the code that enables the diagnostic to run, it will not clear the permanent code, it will do the opposite - cause the permanent code to NEVER clear, even if you correct the condition that caused the code. The test(s) have to run and pass a certain number of times before the code will go away.

[2xLS1]

Bump

Bump for what? What else do you need to know about permanent codes that you haven't been told.