Maf adjustments not making any difference? Bad injector data?

[Warner8593]

Hey everyone

I have a 2010 Camaro with a torqstorm supercharger that seems like no matter what I do with my maf calibration I'm still pretty lean or rich no matter how many times I log and make adjustments after.
Originally I had the car Dyno tuned after installing the supercharger and supporting mods(fic 850cc injectors and zl1 pump) the car drove alright after that but since then I put 2" headers and cat delete so I figured now would be the time for me to jump in and try to make the changes myself. So after pulling the tune from the Dyno shop it seems like all they did was a maf calibration and adjust timing along with a few other things. No vve from what I can tell. The car is running in maf only mode. Something I noticed right off the bat was that the injector data I had put in from fic was changed and isn't really close to what they had supplied. This seems like a red flag to me right away. Another issue is as soon as I turn off ltft my fueling is all over the place even at idle (.78 to 1.25) even worse while driving. I'm following the method from grg which seems pretty straight forward but like I said no matter how many times I changed the calibration it's pretty much doing whatever it wants. Even after a short drive I could be rich in whatever hertz range and a couple minutes later in the same range I'm now very lean. Is there something I'm missing or is whatever they put in my injector data causing me to chase my tail on this? I'm still very much new to this. I don't have access to my tunes or logs at this exact moment but I'd be glad to supply any tunes or logs in the morning if that will help.
Thanks everyone.
21-07-23 18-57-19.hpl start
no fpcm read cot off maf tune12 7-21.hpt

7-6-21as found no fpcm read (2) ct.hpt
7-6 run cot off.hpl

[dhoagland]

I know if your injector data isn't right nothing else will be right across the board.

Are you tuning closed loop? You have one closed loop enable table maxed out (ECM12463) and the other set seemly normal (ECM12461)

After you flash, do you go out and log right away? There is a thing called Rich after Flash and it has to do with Injector tip temperature (Yours seems to be modified, it might not be bad to put that back to stock) You should log it while tuning and try to tune at the same temperature (or within the same range) and you might not see such big swings. (For me after a hot shutdown and re flash I have to drive up to 20 min to get it back down to where it was (mine likes to run around 140) Then start your log.
I think you should log:
Engine coolant temp.
Intake air temp
Injector tip temp
o2 voltages
MAP
Fuel pressure (you have fuel pressure requested)
Closed Loop Status

[Warner8593]

I was tuning open loop or at least I thought I was. I have ECM 12463 maxed out and ECM 2502/2503 LTFT maxed and mined out. I need 12461 maxed also? I checked injector tip table and it actually is the same as my original tune from before the install. I was making changes pretty quickly. collect data. shut down. change maf calibration. start car and as soon as commanded eq was at .999 start my log and drive. I am now logging injector tip temp and will put the rest on when I get another chance to work with the car. Could you think of any reason someone would change the flow rate of the injectors? This is what Fic has in their excel for flow ratedata from fic.PNG and this is after it was done being dynoedafter dyno.PNG at this point would I be better starting from my stock tune than working off what I was left with from the dyno shop?

[dhoagland]

On your Injectors
Fuel Injector Connection?
Fuel Injector Clinic?

I believe you need the flow rate, but also the short pulse adder and offset specs to enter into your Tune for your new injectors.

[Warner8593]

Fuel injector clinic. They supply an excel with all 3 of those to paste in. After the Dyno (2nd pic) is what they changed the flow rate to. Offset and pulse adder are still correct. looking at my latest log just at idle it's showing it's flowing 126lbs. These are 94lb injectors. Could I reenter the correct flow rate info pull some timing and start on the maf?

[dhoagland]

Fuel injector clinic. They supply an excel with all 3 of those to paste in. After the Dyno (2nd pic) is what they changed the flow rate to. Offset and pulse adder are still correct. looking at my latest log just at idle it's showing it's flowing 126lbs. These are 94lb injectors. Could I reenter the correct flow rate info pull some timing and start on the maf?

That is where I would start. There might be a reason they changed from the supplied data (like they have had previous experience with them) but I have never heard any of the top guns on here say to do that.

[Warner8593]

Yea seems kinda odd to me for that to be done. Makes me wonder how it even runs decently with that data. I appreciate the advice. Hopefully I can make some progress on it.

[dhoagland]

Yea seems kinda odd to me for that to be done. Makes me wonder how it even runs decently with that data. I appreciate the advice. Hopefully I can make some progress on it.

10-4
I checked your Injector Tip Temp Table against mine, and it appears to be stock. I thought they had added a little pulse width down lower than they do.

Good luck, keep us posted

[Warner8593]

10-4
I checked your Injector Tip Temp Table against mine, and it appears to be stock. I thought they had added a little pulse width down lower than they do.

Good luck, keep us posted

Had a chance to do some logs today. Put in the original injector data and started watching my injector tip temp. Gotta say dealing with that really cut down on how quickly you can make changes. Good news is once I started logging data with the injector tip temp at around 140F I've gotten much more usable data. Before I was 12 changes in on the maf table and my results were getting worse. Now im 5 or 6 changes in and closing my err in within 2 in some areas 5-6 in others. started out MUCH higher. Once is get my partial throttle dialed in id like to start with some full throttle pulls. I haven't turned off PE for any of this. AM I thinking correctly that since im going off eq ratio that PE wont skew my results since im going off of how far away I am from whatever EQ im commanding? So if I was at .999 and actual eq is .93 my err would be -.069 same as if I went into pe and commanded .819 and actual eq was .77 my err would be -.049

Thanks again for the advice. Happy I'm finally able to make progress and not feel like im getting farther away from my goal.
7-31 135 injector tip.hplstart

7-31 tune 6 run.hplend

[dhoagland]

Had a chance to do some logs today. Put in the original injector data and started watching my injector tip temp. Gotta say dealing with that really cut down on how quickly you can make changes. Good news is once I started logging data with the injector tip temp at around 140F I've gotten much more usable data. Before I was 12 changes in on the maf table and my results were getting worse. Now im 5 or 6 changes in and closing my err in within 2 in some areas 5-6 in others. started out MUCH higher. Once is get my partial throttle dialed in id like to start with some full throttle pulls. I haven't turned off PE for any of this. AM I thinking correctly that since im going off eq ratio that PE wont skew my results since im going off of how far away I am from whatever EQ im commanding? So if I was at .999 and actual eq is .93 my err would be -.069 same as if I went into pe and commanded .819 and actual eq was .77 my err would be -.049

Thanks again for the advice. Happy I'm finally able to make progress and not feel like im getting farther away from my goal.
7-31 135 injector tip.hplstart

7-31 tune 6 run.hplend

Yes in general you are correct on your PE error...
I know some will use 2 separate logs at the same time (using filters) to log error in PE and non PE and "average" in the overlapping areas.

[barnyardgarage]

One thing I have found, once you get into the close areas, 5% fuel trims, if you are copy pasting error % only multiply by half, seems the maf table will adjust a little farther than the actual percentage.

[Warner8593]

Yes in general you are correct on your PE error...
I know some will use 2 separate logs at the same time (using filters) to log error in PE and non PE and "average" in the overlapping areas.

I'll have to read into that more. I haven't set anything up using filters on logs.

[Warner8593]

One thing I have found, once you get into the close areas, 5% fuel trims, if you are copy pasting error % only multiply by half, seems the maf table will adjust a little farther than the actual percentage.

I've actually been multiplying by half since I started. Looking back I probably could have used multiply by percent up until these last few runs and saved some time.