First Tune - Car Won't Attempt to Crank

[lee82]

This is with a FRPP control pack Coyote swap. Car has been running and driving fine for a while on the factory calibration.

This was my first time using HP Tuners, so I go through the creating VIN (because these ECU's dont have one) and be sure to pick the TC-1791 ecu, everything goes fine there. I read the ecm and saved it. I copied the file to edit it, made a few changes to idle rpm just to start small, and after I write calibration (again, no issues), turn the car off and back to start, the car will no longer attempt to crank.

I can connect and see channels just fine in the VCM scanner and I can even see the "start request" go from off to on when I hit the start button. I added "crank request" to the list of channels to watch (I'm not sure if that's useful or not?) but it definitely stays "off" when I try to crank it. I can read and write from the ECU no problem, but I just can't crank it!

Any ideas??

[lee82]

Here's a screenshot from VCM scanner. Everything seems to work normally when it goes through start up. Fuel pump primes to 55psi, I can see all of the channel data, throttle body moves and sensors work when I modulate the pedal, and start relay goes to "on" when I flip the momentary starter switch. I get everything but a crank request (I think).

I also uploaded the stock calibration file if anyone can take a look...

Capture3.JPG

[lee82]

Checked the starter solenoid by jumping it, and it tried to crank, so for sure it's not the starter solenoid. Then I did it again by jumping out the starter relay in the power distribution box, car tried to crank, so we have power and the wiring is good there. I then checked the voltage on the switch side of the relay, but it's sort of odd. 5v on one side, 2.5v on the other. This doesn't change regardless of trying to start it or not. Looking at another relay (labeled ignition relay), I get 12v on the switch side, which enables the relay just fine. So is 5v / 2.5v correct? It looks like the switch power is coming from the ECU... so it's definitely the ECU not sending a crank signal.

[decipha]

something got funky somewhere

just write your original tune back in to verify

[lee82]

something got funky somewhere

just write your original tune back in to verify

I agree, something is wrong. I put the original tune back on and still have the same issue. I feel like something in the ECU has locked out the starter, like PATS (which this ECU doesn't have) or something related to the VIN. Super strange.

[lee82]

Something else I realized. Every time I do a read file, the dialog box pops up that says ?your pcm currently does not have a valid operating system ID? do you want to create one so you can read and write to this pcm? I always hit yes. But why is this happening every time? Maybe that?s part of the issue?

[JuiceNA]

You said it cranked and ran before attempting to tune it, so Im positive it is not an electrical issue. It IS a tune issue.
You did not say if this is an actual control pack or control pack strategy flashed to a stock PCM (without pats delete)

I ran into a scenario that sounds exactly like this, but using a different tuning solution (Syked, which I returned)
The device read my tune, I was able to edit it. I flashed it to the PCM, poof, no crank. When I tried to reconnect, I was getting com error, unrecognized pcm. My solution was to flash with the X4 back to my dyno tune. My guy told me that the only way he could bypass pats was to use the Crate_6 strategy.

One of the HPtuner gurus will confirm.

[lee82]

It?s an actual controls pack from Ford Performance.

I still can connect and write calibrations and use vcm scanner and see every PID, and all the sensors seem to be working fine.

[lee82]

So HP Tuners is working on it, but in the mean time I just bypassed the ECU starter controls and ran a switched ground and a momentary switch +12v to the starter relay in the PDB so I can drive it. Everything else works fine, including the changes I made to the tune. I spent an hour with an ECU pinout checking everything that might be wrong, and the only thing wrong (that I can tell) is the starter output from the ECU.

[B E N]

So HP Tuners is working on it, but in the mean time I just bypassed the ECU starter controls and ran a switched ground and a momentary switch +12v to the starter relay in the PDB so I can drive it. Everything else works fine, including the changes I made to the tune. I spent an hour with an ECU pinout checking everything that might be wrong, and the only thing wrong (that I can tell) is the starter output from the ECU.

Was this resolved? I am looking to tune my gen 2 control pack truck and would rather not brick it

[lee82]

Was this resolved? I am looking to tune my gen 2 control pack truck and would rather not brick it

I got the PCM pin-out from Ford and cross checked all of the wiring and the only issue I see is the PCM not giving the correct +12v and ground to the starter relay when it receives a start request. Hp Tuners looked at all of the data I gave them and they say something else must be wrong with the car, not the PCM, even though the car literally was starting fine right before I licensed my PCM with HP Tuners lol. I guess we are going to agree to disagree here. But yes, the PCM works fine, I just had to wire up the starter relay differently.

[B E N]

Weird, ok. Thanks for the response!

[veeefour]

FRPP calibration has different starting logic, you have to HOLD the starting signal/button, not just energize/press briefly.

No way it went south just by reading and licensing...

[The Notch]

any resolution to this issue? im having identical issues as this. car has been cranking and running until i pulled and licensed file now its a no start no injector pulse

[veeefour]

I suspect TC-1791 is a virtual read...this is what I saw using other interfaces while reading those ecu's. So this might be interesting...

[B E N]

I had no issues with mine, just assigned a vin following the prompts and went to town.

[The Notch]

Yeah I've done 30+ of these with no issues of any kind until this one. i believe something install related is going on at this point. this truck has had some very strange things similar happening for sometime, it was just strange that it had been cranking and running for weeks until i pulled file and licensed it then made only maf changes and it would not crank again so after an hour of reflashing back to stock and other things i walked away to clear my head and came back 4 hours later for it to crank and run just fine until i flashed it again lol. pretty much ruled out software issue when it cranks after sitting

[Bear Becker]

Hello Lee82, Did HP ever get back to you? today I took my new build all new FRPP Coyote to a reputable Tuner and we experienced virtually the exact same issue, Car runs fine a bit lean then as soon as we tried to make any adjustments and reload a new tune the car would not start. This shop knows what they are doing and to confirm we would throw the original tune back in and it starts right back up. He sat beside me with his laptop and we drove around and he could read all the information and he could read everything and see I was running a bit lean because of Kooks headers and custom intake etc and as soon as we tried to load the new tune it would not start. The car is wired correctly so we are stumped as well and obviously it is the new tune since we had no issues multiple time going back and getting it to crank. Any news?

[Bear Becker]

Hello Lee, did you use a Key on, Key off Keyed Switch or the newer Push Button style to start the car? I?m having the exact same issue and need to get it resolved.

[cmcmanus2]

when i switched my mustang over, the car cranked and fired up the first time. Next time i went to every thing lit up and it wouldn't even attempt to do anything. I beat my head for awhile and started tracing everything i could think of down. Turned out one of my starter wires were loose! hope this helps