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Thread: Cammed 2016 Camaro Re-working "Tuner's" tune - LONG POST

  1. #1

    Cammed 2016 Camaro Re-working "Tuner's" tune - LONG POST

    Hello All,

    First post here on the HP Tuners side (used EFILive for a long time on Gen 3). I had my vehicle tuned by a professional well-known tuner after a bunch of performance upgrades (232/240 cam with +32% fuel lobe, ported MSD, 103mm NW, Greg Good ported heads, headers, exhaust, basically everything NA).

    After getting the vehicle back, I put about 600 relatively easy miles on it and was frankly not satisfied with the way it shifted and it didn't feel like it pulled really hard. Dyno also showed it was pretty low on torque, although made 520rwhp on a mustang dyno, but only 413 rwtq. After much consideration, I contacted the tuner (who is a 5 hour drive away) and they advised I needed to purchase HP tuners and make some logs, etc...

    Long story short - I also installed a wideband to see how things looked. Driveability was good, however at WOT car was running PIG RICH, with Lambda's in the .6's or below (or AFRs from 7-8's). It was so rich, I was actually getting knock retard, I was pretty stunned. Tuner returned an updated file with some reductions in the MAF calibration, but still was extremely rich. I decided to take things into my own hands at this point.

    Currently, I'm working on VVE calibration and have it relatively close at this point.

    My plan is to work through the VVE calibration (it was waaay off), go through MAF calibration, then lastly fine tune the virtual torque tables. I will then return to CL operation with only STFT's. However, I have some issues I'm trying to work through that I need some help:

    1) EXTREMELY LEAN Cold Starts
    With the first start from cooling overnight, the car runs extremely lean until it comes up to temperature. Many times seeing lambda's in the 1.2-1.3 range despite lambda commanded in the .88 to 1.00 as car warms. Idle is rough. After coming up to temp, fueling returns to "normal".

    QUESTION: How do I address this extremely lean start-up issue? I have searched through the calibration and haven't found anything that sticks out to me. I also read here that you have to start-up more than once from cold after writing a new calibration as it will search for a MAF signal until and needs to "learn" the MAF is failed, is that true? Log attached.

    2) VVE Table Changes
    After I make, what I believe to be pretty small changes to the VVE table, the resulting affect is much greater than the adjustment made when making another log. Over time, this resulted in my VVE table getting pretty far out of wack and caused some really wacky issues (such as fueling basically cutting out at 2,500 rpms, despite the VVE table in the 2,500 column remaining unchanged). In the end, I went back quite a few changes and did an overall "smoothing" on the table, which seemed to help a lot. However, after making the adjustments noted in log for 15.4 (multiplying by half since too rich), the result was then being lean by 10% or greater - hair pulling moment...

    QUESTION: When making adjustments to the VVE table, what processes have the best results for everyone? Multiply by half and then do one smoothing, then calculate? Or, just multiply by half and then calculate? I feel like i spend a lot of time tweaking the VVE table and its not getting dialed in as easily as I imagined. Small changes are resulting in much larger swings in the direction of the change.

    3) MAF Re-scaling
    In my logs, on WOT runs, I am going beyond the 8,500 frequency in the stock file. I've searched on how to re-do the scale, but nothing really clear.

    QUESTION: Does anyone have a re-scaled MAF that extends the stock 8,500 frequency to say, 10,000? Or a spreadsheet that I can use to readjust? I may build one myself for this purpose.

    4) FLASHING CEL after WOT
    In several instances, I will get a flashing CEL that lasts about 1 or 2 minutes, and then goes away. It does not happen every time, seemingly on random. I have no DTC's when I check after a run and the flashing CEL.

    QUESTION: What could be causing the flashing CEL? This occurred both with the original tune and after i've made modifications and randomly occurs after a WOT run (not all runs get the CEL).


    5) Guidance on other tables changed by Tuner

    There are a couple tables I have had to return to stock values to get things running a little cleaner, mostly on the transmission side of things. However, looking through the tune file, there are a couple other tables I am curious why was changed:

    a) ECM 33913 Injector SOI Base - the tuner completely modified this table, I'm assuming this is due to the 32% fuel lobe? What effect would changing this table have on VVE calibration - if any?

    b) Knock Retard / Sensor changes - tuner adjusted these quite drastically from stock setting, is this normal? I made no changes to the knock sensors.

    c) ECM 32447 Engine Torque Coeff EQ Ratio - changed some of the EQ ratio from 1.0313 to 1.0625. Does this make it richer or leaner?

    6) Virtual Torque Adjustments

    QUESTION: After I get VVE Table and MAF re-dialed in - will making changes to the Virtual Torque tables require re-adjustment of the VVE table or MAF? This GEN V stuff is quite complex!

    Thanks for all and any help on all of this!!
    Attached Files Attached Files

  2. #2
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Central, LA
    Posts
    737
    1)
    Once you get the fuel models dialed in it should come around nicely on cold starts and follow commanded.

    2)
    On the vve tuning, it sounds like you're having zoning issues if your changes are making it worse over time, either that or you are not filtering out transient data.

    3)
    You can edit the columns. What I normally do is just take a chunk off the bottom of the maf curve that no car ever touches (say from 1083 and below), and slide everything over to the first non zero cel. Then with my extra space I go up 250 hz at a time and keep the 15k at the end and then interp from my last known good data point to the 15k mark and it usually turns out to be a fairly good starting point. Just make sure to slide the data and columns over the same amount.

    4)
    Sounds like misfire detection is still enabled fully. Might have to relax it or disable it. I'm not on a pc with hptuners on it right now, so I can't look at your files but check engine diag > misfires and see if those tables are still stock. Also usually I disable p0300

    5)
    Since I can't look at the files I'm just going to make some guesses as to what's going on

    a) SOI base you can move around a bit to make the injector fire within your valve events for the cam. Every setup will be different but a general rule of thumb is to keep eoi above 180 or so if possible (with an injector MS under 5.5)
    b) It's normal to relax the knock sensors a bit, but use your best judgment. I usually do not put any number larger than 5.5 in anything but the first column
    c) This table effects torque reporting AT the eq ratio in the table. It's a modifier and will not affect fueling

    6)
    No you shouldn't have to re-adjust your fueling if making changes to vt.

    I will look at these files when I get a moment, but I hope this helps.

  3. #3
    This is helpful.

    1) sounds like I shouldnt worry about this for now. Once I get MAF updated and car back into CL mode, this will solve itself?

    2) yea I think you might be right on the zoning. I also was not filtering transient and and had some issues with DFCO not being fully disabled, so I just filtered out any lambda above 1.8. I believe I got the dfco issue resolved though and is one of the reasons I reverted back on my vve table. Not sure how to remove the transients on throttle. It was really easy to do in EFILive, but dunno the formula here, i just try to drive with transients in mind.

    On the zoning, are there any recommendations on modifying those? Or should I really not mess with them? My tuner set idle at 850, and its a massive pain cause idle jumps between 750 and 1,000 column every half second. I may lower it to 750 once I get everything else figured out.

    3) that was along the lines I was thinking, but then thought I should do a full re-scale by re-dividing the frequency steps within a new range (1,000 to 10,000), but sounds like I’m over complicating that. Is it necessary to keep 15,000? I will never get that high.

    4). I’ll check that.

    Really appreciate you taking a look at my file!

  4. #4
    I am continuing to look through my tune and brainstorming ideas to dial in the VVE table in a more efficient manner. The way I setup the columns and rows for the VVE is I switched from the stock ones to the 500 - 7000 rpms and pressure ratio to the .1 - 1.0 x2 version. I decided to try and do a compare between the stock columns/rows values and the additional options provided in the software. Afterwards, I just realized that the stock colums/rows actually have a greater number compared to the other options. For instance, stock number of columns is 31, between 400-6400 rpms and the stock rows total 55, between .3 and .84 pressure ratio. The other options present only 27 columns and 46 rows. The way I see HP tuners handling the differences is it is taking some sort of average between as a method of "filling" in the data. Since you can change between the multiple different options and you are given different numbers.

    So this has me thinking:

    QUESTIONS:

    1) Does anyone know what the maximum number of columns and rows this table can have? Stock has 31 and 55, but can it hold more? I'm sure there must be some sort of limit?
    2) With knowledge of knowing the max number of columns and rows, would it be feasible to build out a more "complete" VVE table to adjust? For instance, since my pressure ratio range is between .3 to 1.00, and my rpms between 650 (my idle won't be below 750 ever) and 6,900 rpm (6,800 rpm redline) - can I take those ranges and simply divide by the number of columns/rows to create new values to plot against?
    3) Would doing so provide any benefit?
    4) Would this somehow mess up the coefficient calculations?

    I dunno if that makes sense to anyone, but I'm really just looking to increase the granularity of my data points in the ranges that I will operate in. I would like to know if it will really mess stuff up, or if it is actually a good idea......

  5. #5
    So, I think there might actually be something to this thought. I used excel to re-run the scales and get even spacing between 550 to 6900 rpms (rpm stepping at ~212 compared to my previous 250rpm) and for the rows between .3 to 1.00 pressure ratio (stepping now ~.013 compared to my previous .02). I have attached a screenshot of what my original columns/rows settings VVE table looked like, pretty smooth, compared to the adjusted. There is definitely some pretty wonky parts rearing their ugly head that were completely hidden before. These were likely lurking in the background causing some issues.

    Has anyone experienced this before or seen this?

    These are the different rescalings I input to see how the VVE table changed, depending on your planned idle speed (850 or 750rpms - i used the 750rpm scaling for the screenshot)

    Row Labels
    0.300 0.313 0.326 0.339 0.352 0.365 0.378 0.391 0.404 0.417 0.430 0.443 0.456 0.469 0.481 0.494 0.507 0.520 0.533 0.546 0.559 0.572 0.585 0.598 0.611 0.624 0.637 0.650 0.663 0.676 0.689 0.702 0.715 0.728 0.741 0.754 0.767 0.780 0.793 0.806 0.819 0.831 0.844 0.857 0.870 0.883 0.896 0.909 0.922 0.935 0.948 0.961 0.974 0.987 1.000

    Column Labels with 750 rpm idle
    550 762 973 1185 1397 1608 1820 2032 2243 2455 2667 2878 3090 3302 3513 3725 3937 4148 4360 4572 4783 4995 5207 5418 5630 5842 6053 6265 6477 6688 6900

    Column Labels with 850 rpm idle
    650 858 1067 1275 1483 1692 1900 2108 2317 2525 2733 2942 3150 3358 3567 3775 3983 4192 4400 4608 4817 5025 5233 5442 5650 5858 6067 6275 6483 6692 6900

    Original columns and rows.PNGUpdated Column and Rows.PNG

  6. #6
    So, I just went through a bit of an experiment with the scaling here. I decided to just try a really high number of columns and rows in setting up the VVE table and to my surprise, I was able to add like 120+ columns and 120+ rows. The result was a very high-resolution VVE table using Row stepping of .005 and rpm stepping of 50rpm. Quite interesting! I dunno how all the math lays out, but frankly, it does really show the individual zones pretty clearly.

    As a thought experiment, I pulled up a stock 2016 camaro VVE table to see what it looks like... it looks like a hot mess with the high-res lol.

    Now, to be clear, I have not tried uploading a tune with this many colums/rows as I don't know if that will do something dangerous or if this is just front end math that all figures into the VVE coefficient calculations that are somehow interpolated into the ECM. I frankly just have no clue, but I thought it interesting to see how there are areas in the VVE table that might really throw off fueling while in OL SD mode.

    As a warning, if you were to use the following scales for the column / rows - be sure you have a very capable laptop as it really bogs down the software.

    Test Rows: 0.300 0.305 0.31 0.315 0.32 0.325 0.33 0.335 0.34 0.345 0.35 0.355 0.36 0.365 0.37 0.375 0.38 0.385 0.39 0.395 0.4 0.405 0.41 0.415 0.42 0.425 0.43 0.435 0.44 0.445 0.45 0.455 0.46 0.465 0.47 0.475 0.48 0.485 0.49 0.495 0.5 0.505 0.51 0.515 0.52 0.525 0.53 0.535 0.54 0.545 0.55 0.555 0.56 0.565 0.57 0.575 0.58 0.585 0.59 0.595 0.6 0.605 0.61 0.615 0.62 0.625 0.63 0.635 0.64 0.645 0.65 0.655 0.66 0.665 0.67 0.675 0.68 0.685 0.69 0.695 0.7 0.705 0.71 0.715 0.72 0.725 0.73 0.735 0.74 0.745 0.75 0.755 0.76 0.765 0.77 0.775 0.78 0.785 0.79 0.795 0.8 0.805 0.81 0.815 0.82 0.825 0.83 0.835 0.84 0.845 0.85 0.855 0.86 0.865 0.87 0.875 0.88 0.885 0.89 0.895 0.9 0.905 0.91 0.915 0.92 0.925 0.93 0.935 0.94 0.945 0.95 0.955 0.96 0.965 0.97 0.975 0.98 0.985 0.99 0.995 1 1.005 1.01

    Test Columns: 600 650 700 750 800 850 900 950 1000 1050 1100 1150 1200 1250 1300 1350 1400 1450 1500 1550 1600 1650 1700 1750 1800 1850 1900 1950 2000 2050 2100 2150 2200 2250 2300 2350 2400 2450 2500 2550 2600 2650 2700 2750 2800 2850 2900 2950 3000 3050 3100 3150 3200 3250 3300 3350 3400 3450 3500 3550 3600 3650 3700 3750 3800 3850 3900 3950 4000 4050 4100 4150 4200 4250 4300 4350 4400 4450 4500 4550 4600 4650 4700 4750 4800 4850 4900 4950 5000 5050 5100 5150 5200 5250 5300 5350 5400 5450 5500 5550 5600 5650 5700 5750 5800 5850 5900 5950 6000 6050 6100 6150 6200 6250 6300 6350 6400 6450 6500 6550 6600 6650 6700 6750 6800 6850 6900 6950 7000

    Hi-Res Stock VVE Table.PNGHi-Res VVE Table.PNG

  7. #7
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Central, LA
    Posts
    737
    I hadn't had a chance to look at your files yet, but I will tonight. and I agree adding resolution should help a good bit. The formulas do seem to get pretty out of whack on the stock calibrations, but you have to consider that some of the numbers come from the cam being able to move several degrees.

  8. #8
    Hello All,

    Providing some updates here. At the end, I am in need of some additional assistance!

    1) EXTREMELY LEAN Cold Starts
    After some more investigation in the calibration, I found a table that effectively offsets the lean COLD start condition. The table of concern is located under Engine / Fuel / General / ECM 33380 Temperature Adder. This table provides an offset to the Pulsewidth of the injectors depending on Injector Tip Temp and Fuel Rail Pressure. You will need to log the Injector Tip Temp, Fuel Rail Pressure, Injector Pulsewidth, and the ERR correction from wideband when in SD mode or the STFT if in CL. Create your Graph in VCM scanner and log the correction factor. Since the table is initially not populated at all, this was the procedure I went through starting with just idle conditions:

    a) You will need to initially disable STFTs/LTFTs or you can use the STFTs as the error correction - both methods should work fine.

    b) Start from a cold start and log the aforementioned PIDs until you reach full engine temperature, and specifically until your Injector Tip Temp reaches at least 158 degrees. I found in my particular setup that the overall error correction when generally logging over time started out with needing +20% range when cold to basically nothing at above 158 degrees for ITT.

    c) Once you have your table populated, you should see a decreasing amount of correction from cold to warm. I decided to put corrections until 158 degrees.

    d) In order to populate the first iteration of the table, I suggest setting each column break to the same correction factor (hence starting with just Idle to get the curve). Note what the average injector pulse width is for your idling, and take the correction factor from each column and multiply that by the pulsewidth. For instance, if your pulse width at idle is 1.2ms and your correction factor is 20%, your adder will be .24 in the table and so on.

    NOTE: Oddly enough, this temperature adder table doesn't seem to have any effect if you start an already warm vehicle, but not completely cold. Not sure why, but thats what I noticed. It might be some other setting in my tune from start-up that is affecting it, but thats what I noticed.

    2) VVE Table Changes
    I appreciate some of the tips here. I added transient filtering for throttle as suggested, but I also added additional filtering for both ECT above 190 degrees and Injector Tip Temp over 176 degrees. This helped with the VVE table tuning and getting things dialed in. I also setup an excel workbook to focus the adjustments to the areas that needed greater than 2% correction and to do a % compare of the before and after VVE table to ensure the adjustments are inline after Extrapolating Coefficients.

    In addition, the HD columns and rows that I posted above also made a significant difference in getting the VVE table fine-tuned and dialed in properly. Unfortunately the stock columns/rows of the VVE table leaves a lot "hidden" in the details. Expanding these out to the ones I posted above (and creating a graph in VCM Scanner) is what I suggest if your laptop/pc can handle the extra calculations.

    NOTE: You can actually input as many columns/rows as you'd like to have details as this actually does not affect the ECM. The Virtual VE Table is used to calculate the coefficients, so it is an "In-software" function and has no affect on the ECM itself. So there is no "danger" to the ECM as I was unsure about in my previous post.

    3) MAF Re-scaling
    I was able to rescale the MAF table. This one cannot have "infinite" columns, so I just created a custom excel spreadsheet to build out the new MAF table. In the lower rpm/idle areas I created it with smaller distance between each column and grew it to larger distance between frequencies towards the upper RPMs. Doing that seems to have helped quite a bit with smoothness of driveability.

    4) Flashing CEL at WOT
    This seems to have cleared up a little bit, but I did check my calibration and it still has the stock misfire detection.

    NOTE: Does anyone have any suggested settings for misfire detection?

    Those are the updates from my previous questions. I do have the VVE table and MAF dialed in and have returned the calibration to CL with O2's operation.

    ADDITIONAL ITEMS NEEDING HELP:
    Now that those items are dialed in (as far as I can tell in my inexperience), I have begun the process of adjusting my Virtual Torque Tables. I have made those adjustments, including adjusting the external load table, but I am still having a couple issues that I cannot seem to figure out.

    1) When I go WOT, I am having an issue where I get Trq Mgmt kicking in and dropping spark to basically 0, while my throttle goes from like 84% to 50% through the remainder of the run. You can see that my MAP drops when this occurs showing that my throttle blade is closing. You can see this happen at 2min 51 seconds in the Part 1 log I provided. I believe this has to either do with Trans Torque Management or just the Torque model since the Final Throttle Torque Req shows 588ish, but Delivered Engine Torque is 640ish, so seems its trying to get delivered down to final throttle torque request so initially pulls timing and closes throttle blade.

    QUESTION: Can someone go through the log and point me in the right direction? It really is pretty frustrating as I'm definitely leaving power on the table with this issue. Do I need to add MORE torque to the Virtual Torque Tables or do I need to REDUCE the virtual torque tables in those areas?

    2) My original tune has the TCC locking at WOT for 3, 4, and 5th gears. After reading materials, you are supposed to get faster ETs with the converter unlocked, so I switch it to run WOT unlocked. Prior to this the tune would result in a lot of short shifting in the gears, however, after I switched it to unlocked WOT, I am having some issues with hitting the rev limiter (6,850rpm) only during a 4-5 shift. The lower shifts are just fine, but 4-5 seems to be a bit of a problem. I have reduced the shift vehicle speeds to get the shifts happening sooner, but doesn't seem to help much with the 4-5 shift. I was getting shifts taking 1.1 seconds for 4-5...

    Could this be due to the virtual torque tables or trans torque management?

    Thanks again for any additional help!!
    Attached Files Attached Files

  9. #9
    Anybody have any input?

  10. #10
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Aug 2014
    Location
    Central, LA
    Posts
    737
    Quote Originally Posted by Haans249 View Post
    Hello All,

    Providing some updates here. At the end, I am in need of some additional assistance!

    1) EXTREMELY LEAN Cold Starts
    After some more investigation in the calibration, I found a table that effectively offsets the lean COLD start condition. The table of concern is located under Engine / Fuel / General / ECM 33380 Temperature Adder. This table provides an offset to the Pulsewidth of the injectors depending on Injector Tip Temp and Fuel Rail Pressure. You will need to log the Injector Tip Temp, Fuel Rail Pressure, Injector Pulsewidth, and the ERR correction from wideband when in SD mode or the STFT if in CL. Create your Graph in VCM scanner and log the correction factor. Since the table is initially not populated at all, this was the procedure I went through starting with just idle conditions:

    a) You will need to initially disable STFTs/LTFTs or you can use the STFTs as the error correction - both methods should work fine.

    b) Start from a cold start and log the aforementioned PIDs until you reach full engine temperature, and specifically until your Injector Tip Temp reaches at least 158 degrees. I found in my particular setup that the overall error correction when generally logging over time started out with needing +20% range when cold to basically nothing at above 158 degrees for ITT.

    c) Once you have your table populated, you should see a decreasing amount of correction from cold to warm. I decided to put corrections until 158 degrees.

    d) In order to populate the first iteration of the table, I suggest setting each column break to the same correction factor (hence starting with just Idle to get the curve). Note what the average injector pulse width is for your idling, and take the correction factor from each column and multiply that by the pulsewidth. For instance, if your pulse width at idle is 1.2ms and your correction factor is 20%, your adder will be .24 in the table and so on.

    NOTE: Oddly enough, this temperature adder table doesn't seem to have any effect if you start an already warm vehicle, but not completely cold. Not sure why, but thats what I noticed. It might be some other setting in my tune from start-up that is affecting it, but thats what I noticed.

    2) VVE Table Changes
    I appreciate some of the tips here. I added transient filtering for throttle as suggested, but I also added additional filtering for both ECT above 190 degrees and Injector Tip Temp over 176 degrees. This helped with the VVE table tuning and getting things dialed in. I also setup an excel workbook to focus the adjustments to the areas that needed greater than 2% correction and to do a % compare of the before and after VVE table to ensure the adjustments are inline after Extrapolating Coefficients.

    In addition, the HD columns and rows that I posted above also made a significant difference in getting the VVE table fine-tuned and dialed in properly. Unfortunately the stock columns/rows of the VVE table leaves a lot "hidden" in the details. Expanding these out to the ones I posted above (and creating a graph in VCM Scanner) is what I suggest if your laptop/pc can handle the extra calculations.

    NOTE: You can actually input as many columns/rows as you'd like to have details as this actually does not affect the ECM. The Virtual VE Table is used to calculate the coefficients, so it is an "In-software" function and has no affect on the ECM itself. So there is no "danger" to the ECM as I was unsure about in my previous post.

    3) MAF Re-scaling
    I was able to rescale the MAF table. This one cannot have "infinite" columns, so I just created a custom excel spreadsheet to build out the new MAF table. In the lower rpm/idle areas I created it with smaller distance between each column and grew it to larger distance between frequencies towards the upper RPMs. Doing that seems to have helped quite a bit with smoothness of driveability.

    4) Flashing CEL at WOT
    This seems to have cleared up a little bit, but I did check my calibration and it still has the stock misfire detection.

    NOTE: Does anyone have any suggested settings for misfire detection?

    Those are the updates from my previous questions. I do have the VVE table and MAF dialed in and have returned the calibration to CL with O2's operation.

    ADDITIONAL ITEMS NEEDING HELP:
    Now that those items are dialed in (as far as I can tell in my inexperience), I have begun the process of adjusting my Virtual Torque Tables. I have made those adjustments, including adjusting the external load table, but I am still having a couple issues that I cannot seem to figure out.

    1) When I go WOT, I am having an issue where I get Trq Mgmt kicking in and dropping spark to basically 0, while my throttle goes from like 84% to 50% through the remainder of the run. You can see that my MAP drops when this occurs showing that my throttle blade is closing. You can see this happen at 2min 51 seconds in the Part 1 log I provided. I believe this has to either do with Trans Torque Management or just the Torque model since the Final Throttle Torque Req shows 588ish, but Delivered Engine Torque is 640ish, so seems its trying to get delivered down to final throttle torque request so initially pulls timing and closes throttle blade.

    QUESTION: Can someone go through the log and point me in the right direction? It really is pretty frustrating as I'm definitely leaving power on the table with this issue. Do I need to add MORE torque to the Virtual Torque Tables or do I need to REDUCE the virtual torque tables in those areas?

    2) My original tune has the TCC locking at WOT for 3, 4, and 5th gears. After reading materials, you are supposed to get faster ETs with the converter unlocked, so I switch it to run WOT unlocked. Prior to this the tune would result in a lot of short shifting in the gears, however, after I switched it to unlocked WOT, I am having some issues with hitting the rev limiter (6,850rpm) only during a 4-5 shift. The lower shifts are just fine, but 4-5 seems to be a bit of a problem. I have reduced the shift vehicle speeds to get the shifts happening sooner, but doesn't seem to help much with the 4-5 shift. I was getting shifts taking 1.1 seconds for 4-5...

    Could this be due to the virtual torque tables or trans torque management?

    Thanks again for any additional help!!
    1)
    Nice job!

    2)
    VVE can be an interesting game on these cars. The calculator will sometimes make your table look awful. Don't get too focused on making it "look" good as long as the car is running well.

    3) Lots of approaches here. Glad you found one that works for you

    4)Usually most tuners will just max out the misfire tables on cammed vehicles. By the time you've increased them high enough so that the normal cam actions don't trigger the misfire counter, it often won't detect a real miss anyway. I've tested this before by bringing them up just high enough to run/idle with no misfires, then pull a plug wire and still 0 misfires. You will just have to watch your narrowbands for misses moving forward.


    Additional:
    There needs to be space between peak torque and max torque, and max torque and engine torque. Playing with the virtual torque tables can get you there. I've made a few adjustments for you to try.
    A quick hack to get max torque to go up and not much else is just to raise the vve in that area to see if it helps, also playing with driver demand.

    You may want to try resetting the adaptives on your trans with the vcm controls. Adapt Reset, fast adapt reset, and adapt preset with the key on engine off (you will get no feedback that it's doing anything, but it definitely is). For what it's worth I've personally found depending on the converter that sometimes locking in 2nd-5th helps so you'll just have to figure this one out with some data (dragy/track/etc).
    Attached Files Attached Files

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by sevinn View Post
    1)
    Nice job!

    2)
    VVE can be an interesting game on these cars. The calculator will sometimes make your table look awful. Don't get too focused on making it "look" good as long as the car is running well.

    3) Lots of approaches here. Glad you found one that works for you

    4)Usually most tuners will just max out the misfire tables on cammed vehicles. By the time you've increased them high enough so that the normal cam actions don't trigger the misfire counter, it often won't detect a real miss anyway. I've tested this before by bringing them up just high enough to run/idle with no misfires, then pull a plug wire and still 0 misfires. You will just have to watch your narrowbands for misses moving forward.


    Additional:
    There needs to be space between peak torque and max torque, and max torque and engine torque. Playing with the virtual torque tables can get you there. I've made a few adjustments for you to try.
    A quick hack to get max torque to go up and not much else is just to raise the vve in that area to see if it helps, also playing with driver demand.

    You may want to try resetting the adaptives on your trans with the vcm controls. Adapt Reset, fast adapt reset, and adapt preset with the key on engine off (you will get no feedback that it's doing anything, but it definitely is). For what it's worth I've personally found depending on the converter that sometimes locking in 2nd-5th helps so you'll just have to figure this one out with some data (dragy/track/etc).
    Thank you so much for some feedback here! I wasn't sure how high I should take the virtual torque tables and just tried to guestimate where they should be based on the dyno. I will give this a try and let you know how it turns out. I'm going to try the updated settings before doing the adaptives reset. If I'm still getting some isues with the trq management kicking in, I'll reset the adaptives. Then finally, I'll try running it with the TCC locked for WOT runs if my shifts are still very slow.

  12. #12
    Advanced Tuner
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    Aug 2014
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    Quote Originally Posted by Haans249 View Post
    Thank you so much for some feedback here! I wasn't sure how high I should take the virtual torque tables and just tried to guestimate where they should be based on the dyno. I will give this a try and let you know how it turns out. I'm going to try the updated settings before doing the adaptives reset. If I'm still getting some isues with the trq management kicking in, I'll reset the adaptives. Then finally, I'll try running it with the TCC locked for WOT runs if my shifts are still very slow.
    Hey you're welcome, let me know how it goes.