Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 21 to 38 of 38

Thread: 2016 E550 I want to try to tinker with, but have concerns

  1. #21
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    348
    I cloned it, and yes it copied my tune over to the replacement ECU. Nothing changed, my issue is still there.
    This is disappointing because I believe there is a high probability it's a software glitch, if so, it copied that too.
    At least now I have a spare ECU to tinker with using the HP Tune
    '16 E550 Coupe RWD - C207.373 / M278.922 / MED17.7.3 / 722.909

  2. #22
    Tuner in Training
    Join Date
    Jul 2021
    Posts
    28
    Quote Originally Posted by outlaw_50 View Post
    Yes Chinese will do.

    sometimes the culprit is this Pressure valve if it turned black or too old, replace it

    Attachment 116782

    While clones can work well, still got to be careful. Find one with a good board/chipset if you can.

  3. #23
    Advanced Tuner outlaw_50's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2020
    Location
    United Arab Emirates, AlAin
    Posts
    204
    Quote Originally Posted by r2r View Post
    While clones can work well, still got to be careful. Find one with a good board/chipset if you can.
    I've tried the red PCB but I have other tools I don't use it much only if necessary
    Xstages Motorsport

    Tuning inquiries:

    ECU, TCU, CPC Online Tuning
    Whatsapp: +971503383340
    Email: [email protected]
    Insta: @xstages.motorsport
    www.xstages.com

  4. #24
    Advanced Tuner outlaw_50's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2020
    Location
    United Arab Emirates, AlAin
    Posts
    204
    Quote Originally Posted by chevota View Post
    I cloned it, and yes it copied my tune over to the replacement ECU. Nothing changed, my issue is still there.
    This is disappointing because I believe there is a high probability it's a software glitch, if so, it copied that too.
    At least now I have a spare ECU to tinker with using the HP Tune
    Could you post log file of your problem
    Xstages Motorsport

    Tuning inquiries:

    ECU, TCU, CPC Online Tuning
    Whatsapp: +971503383340
    Email: [email protected]
    Insta: @xstages.motorsport
    www.xstages.com

  5. #25
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    348
    You mean a log file via the VCM Scanner? I didn't buy it until the ECU swap proved a failure, so I just rec'd it last night. I played with it for a bit but since it has no instructions I don't really know what to do yet.
    I had to do some ECU update before I could use it, which some said HP Tuner no longer needs.
    Now I need to figure this thing out. For example, I have two MAP sensors but I only see a choice for one in the VCM Scanner app, and it's not the one I need. I couldn't get it to read my O2 sensors, which was a problem with other devices as well.

    I was hoping to find the boost command, but I have never found that in any program. I can only watch the command output (pulse width modulation) via Xentry.
    The VCM Editor looks far more complicated and I do not look fwd to learning that. Instructions would've been nice.
    '16 E550 Coupe RWD - C207.373 / M278.922 / MED17.7.3 / 722.909

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by chevota View Post
    You mean a log file via the VCM Scanner? I didn't buy it until the ECU swap proved a failure, so I just rec'd it last night. I played with it for a bit but since it has no instructions I don't really know what to do yet.
    I had to do some ECU update before I could use it, which some said HP Tuner no longer needs.
    Now I need to figure this thing out. For example, I have two MAP sensors but I only see a choice for one in the VCM Scanner app, and it's not the one I need. I couldn't get it to read my O2 sensors, which was a problem with other devices as well.

    I was hoping to find the boost command, but I have never found that in any program. I can only watch the command output (pulse width modulation) via Xentry.
    The VCM Editor looks far more complicated and I do not look fwd to learning that. Instructions would've been nice.
    The first thing you need to do in VCM Scanner is add all the Channels. If a Channel is not active, logging will not gather any data for it.

    For O2 sensors, you want the WB Lambda sensors, bank 1 and bank 2.

    Why do you say the MAP sensor you see isn't the one you need? Is it logging the wrong data, or no data?

  7. #27
    Advanced Tuner outlaw_50's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2020
    Location
    United Arab Emirates, AlAin
    Posts
    204
    Its only one MAP sensor before the throttle, the two sensors you are refering are Barometric pressure sensors.

    O2 you can log only the voltage but the ones you are refering are the lambda sensors just add new channel and search for WB.

    Their is no Boost command but you can get boost by using Math (MAP - Barometric Pressure)

  8. #28
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    348
    I just didn't see it the pressure sensor. Probably brain fatigue from hours trying to get it setup and working. The next day it was right there, mocking me.
    I believe I have all the data I need loaded, and it seems like everything is in order. I still can't see why boost is low so I'll let you more experienced people look at it.
    This is the oem unmodified ECU "tune file" with two data recordings, on my way to work (am), then back (pm). I floored it here and there as traffic permitted, which wasn't much.
    Let me know what you think and if you want me to record under other conditions.
    Thank you for helping, it is appreciated

    E550 OEM ECU Load (8 Feb '22).hpt
    E550 oem am (9 Feb '22).hpl
    E550 oem pm (9 Feb '22).hpl
    '16 E550 Coupe RWD - C207.373 / M278.922 / MED17.7.3 / 722.909

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by chevota View Post
    I just didn't see it the pressure sensor. Probably brain fatigue from hours trying to get it setup and working. The next day it was right there, mocking me.
    I believe I have all the data I need loaded, and it seems like everything is in order. I still can't see why boost is low so I'll let you more experienced people look at it.
    This is the oem unmodified ECU "tune file" with two data recordings, on my way to work (am), then back (pm). I floored it here and there as traffic permitted, which wasn't much.
    Let me know what you think and if you want me to record under other conditions.
    Thank you for helping, it is appreciated

    E550 OEM ECU Load (8 Feb '22).hpt
    E550 oem am (9 Feb '22).hpl
    E550 oem pm (9 Feb '22).hpl
    Some thoughts:

    -There is a lot of intermittent knock retard in there, on all cylinders. IATs look decent. Are you running good fuel? The knock itself may be causing the computer to limit boost to protect the engine...
    -Boost doesn't seem to exceed 8 PSI. Abnormal for sure. Your factory calibration is identical to mine and I would hit about 11 psi in 4th gear when stock.
    -Your long term fuel trims are positive by 10-15%, both banks. Do you have a splash of E85 in the tank by chance?
    -Fuel pressure seems normal.

    Are there any OBD trouble codes present now?
    Have you had a boost leak test? Seems like there is a leak, a problematic sensor or boost control solenoid issue. How many miles on the car? Original coils/plugs?

    Please add channels for desired/actual cam angle for the next log session.

    One thing is for sure, your mind is going to be blown once this is sorted out and it's running correctly.
    Last edited by Schnell; 02-09-2022 at 07:54 PM.

  10. #30
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    348
    I saw the knock but it says it's just retarding a few degrees. I should say knock retard isn't retarding much, but what else controls timing I don't know because it's all over the place. I added octane booster once just to see, power didn't change one bit.
    No E85. Never even seen it for sale. Gas is usually from my local 7-11 gas station I've used for 10 years, but I don't know what kind it is. I've tried various gas stations in the past but the only gas that made any difference at all was Trick racing fuel. Not sure what they put in there, but it worked. I don't mean this car, it was about 20 years ago. I also used to put mothballs in my gas, which also made a difference, but of course they banned those about two years after I discovered that trick.

    Help me understand why long term fuel trim is high but short isn't? Isn't long just an average of short? Also, when I checked trims before using other programs, long term was 5 or less. Same basic question on the engine torque, which is clearly not accurate. How on earth does it even come up with that value?

    I can make good boost psi briefly, and power is there when it happens, but we're talking a fraction of a second. I recorded the turbo solenoid pulse width modulation so everyone can see it's the ECU commanding this low psi. Why is the big question. I've also triggered overboost by messing with it, but the point is it isn't leaking, it's commanded.
    No codes, except a low boost code once. I get "U" communication codes, which the dealer saw and said is normal. They believe they trip when the voltage drops on start, and they do all occur at the same time so it makes sense. As always, everything that has codes works and things that don't work have no codes.
    Thanks for looking at my data
    Last edited by chevota; 02-09-2022 at 11:57 PM.
    '16 E550 Coupe RWD - C207.373 / M278.922 / MED17.7.3 / 722.909

  11. #31
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    348
    I did some tinkering but nothing happened. No extra power.
    Does anyone know how the car comes up with the Torque value in VCM Scanner? I suspect this may be my whole problem because it says it's hitting the torque limits but in reality it's not. So if it thinks it is then it'll pull boost/power which is my whole issue. So my assumption is something that feeds into that Torque PID calc is wrong, the question is what?
    As it is now it says my physically stock M278 is making 600Hp and 700ftlb, yet I can barely spin the tires and 0-60 takes a second + longer than stock.

    Any thoughts on that Torque calc? I assume mass airflow, pps fuel, timing, exhaust temp, ???.
    The exhaust temp is next to check, which I'll do tomorrow. The mass air I don't know about but I can't imagine its off? Can't be timing. Frustrated....
    '16 E550 Coupe RWD - C207.373 / M278.922 / MED17.7.3 / 722.909

  12. #32
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    348
    So here's what I tried yesterday: I set Torque limits ~50% higher, plus minor stuff like enriching fuel a bit. I forget what all I did but I did not touch Timing or Exhaust Temps.
    Result: Nothing. It felt a little different and the throttle was more responsive, but boost/power was basically the same.

    Next (last night) I tossed the previous file and tried only one change; lowering Exh Temps in the charts. I decided 6% across the board was the thing to do.
    Boom, power! I only got maybe a third of my power back, but it responded perfectly and this is a big clue.
    So what is telling the ECU to look at what part of said chart? I suppose mass air, fuel, timing, but I can't imagine those being off. What could be wrong that would screw up the est Ex Temp, yet not bother how the car runs at any other time?

    The Torque reading from the ECU dropped with this Ex Temp chart change, from 700 to 600, so I assume once you tinker with any of the values that factor into Tq, it's useless. I hadn't read anything about that before but of course it's ruined. So how do you check Torque after that? And, if I end up making the Tq very low in order to get my power back, won't that lower line psi in my tranny?

    I have some gripes about the software too, which has F'd me and set me back at least a week, but I'll complain about that later.
    '16 E550 Coupe RWD - C207.373 / M278.922 / MED17.7.3 / 722.909

  13. #33
    Advanced Tuner outlaw_50's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2020
    Location
    United Arab Emirates, AlAin
    Posts
    204
    Quote Originally Posted by chevota View Post
    So here's what I tried yesterday: I set Torque limits ~50% higher, plus minor stuff like enriching fuel a bit. I forget what all I did but I did not touch Timing or Exhaust Temps.
    Result: Nothing. It felt a little different and the throttle was more responsive, but boost/power was basically the same.

    Next (last night) I tossed the previous file and tried only one change; lowering Exh Temps in the charts. I decided 6% across the board was the thing to do.
    Boom, power! I only got maybe a third of my power back, but it responded perfectly and this is a big clue.
    So what is telling the ECU to look at what part of said chart? I suppose mass air, fuel, timing, but I can't imagine those being off. What could be wrong that would screw up the est Ex Temp, yet not bother how the car runs at any other time?

    The Torque reading from the ECU dropped with this Ex Temp chart change, from 700 to 600, so I assume once you tinker with any of the values that factor into Tq, it's useless. I hadn't read anything about that before but of course it's ruined. So how do you check Torque after that? And, if I end up making the Tq very low in order to get my power back, won't that lower line psi in my tranny?

    I have some gripes about the software too, which has F'd me and set me back at least a week, but I'll complain about that later.
    Haven't you change the boost solenoid!? I bet that's the issue with your boost
    Xstages Motorsport

    Tuning inquiries:

    ECU, TCU, CPC Online Tuning
    Whatsapp: +971503383340
    Email: [email protected]
    Insta: @xstages.motorsport
    www.xstages.com

  14. #34
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    348
    You'd be ~the 50th person to say that
    Keep in mind that boost is being commanded low. That basically answers 90% of all questions. I know that sounds condescending but that's not my intention. I just means most all the usual reasons for low boost go out the window.

    I did change the solenoid because people kept insisting that's what it was, despite the ECU command.
    The two solenoids I have are the same make/model/part #, but they do act different at no load, which I assume is because they are crude devices. That doesn't matter because once the ECU steps in, it doesn't care how different they are, it will command whatever is necessary to hit the psi it wants. For example, I can drastically restrict air flow into the solenoid and the ECU simply lowers the duty cycle to compensate.

    The other one people suggest a lot is the intercooler pump, but even if I removed the pump it would not cause my issue. For example, if it's 35F outside at 5am, the power is exactly the same as when my IAT is >100F. Well, if it is different it isn't enough to notice, but the point is that isn't the problem.
    I did change out the pump btw. Age wise it was old, per people who have had them fail. Plus I wasn't sure if it had the old or new (better) model, so I swapped it. It did have the better model and it was still working fine so of course the change made no difference.


    Last night I reduced Ex Temps another 6% and it helped a little bit but nothing like the first 6% drop. It also lowered the value of the Torque PID by an equal small %. So apparently I pushed that temp limit far enough out of the way and now something else is holding it up. So again the Torque PID dropped and power went up, which leads me to believe that PID is limiting power, or partially the reason. Makes sense that it sees power is at max so it pulls boost, which is the whole point of raising Torque limits via HP, right? But what is causing it to read so high? Maybe whatever it is is the source of my problem?
    Fyi the EGT Control is Disabled, per the HP Editor. It has always been disabled on both the oem and OE Tuned version, yet the changes affected it anyway. Is that normal or just me?

    So I guess I'll raise the Torque limits again but it's all very frustrating when I'm sure one simple little thing, or bit in the logic, is the cause of it all.

    And what's up with all these Variants? HP says "Use the scanner to determine the table used on your application, but I can't figure out how. Am I blind, stupid, or are these variants simply not visible via HP?

    Thanks for continuing to help
    '16 E550 Coupe RWD - C207.373 / M278.922 / MED17.7.3 / 722.909

  15. #35
    I wonder if one of your MAP sensors is bad? I.e. reading a higher pressure ratio from barometric to manifold than what is actually there, causing the PCM to think there's a greater air load, and thus could explain the exaggerated torque reading calculated from said load, and commanded low boost & KR to pull back power. Just a theory. But as you said, this change happened suddenly, so a sensor failure or loss of calibration would make sense.

  16. #36
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    348
    I would make perfect sense but my two map sensors read the same at static pressure and when the throttle is open. And if they both magically went bad at the same time, in the same way, my fuel ratio would be off. Plus the power matches the boost they read, more or less. So I ruled it out.

    I did pick up a lot of power with the tune I loaded last night, but now it shifts and down shifts funny. It also idled ~1200 for maybe 10 sec when I started it this am, and I specifically lowered cold idle to ~600. I had it set low already, and it worked, but apparently it didnt like something I did last night.

    Most of the things I can change make sense, others I can only change and see what happens. Too many to change one at a time so I changed a lot all at once.

    Thanks

  17. #37
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    348
    Well, it's apparent that the different shifting is the torque converter is locking MUCH earlier and staying locked longer. So now when I let off the gas in traffic or coming to a stop, it eng brakes like a stick! In traffic today I hardly had to use the brakes at all, I just let off the gas and it instantly decels, and when it slows to where braking is decreasing, it downshifts It's what I always wanted it to do but never thought it could happen. Now I have it, I rule! (American Beauty quote I finally got to use).
    It also seems to downshift earlier, but maybe I never noticed because of the sloppy converter. Whatever the story is, I don't think I couldn't have asked for better, but I am curious how it happened.

    As for power, I was careful on the way to work because I did not work my way up to this tune, I just put in what I thought might work. So I slowly gave it more gas each time I had a chance and hoped for the best. Finally, almost home from work, I fully floored. F me but I think it's fixed! Power is there, it runs nice, runs cooler and quieter too. Throttle is more responsive, less knock sensor noise/retard. It's a win! Knock on wood before I jinx myself...

    I did screw up the cold idle somehow, as mentioned. It jumped straight to 1200rpm and stayed there for ~10sec, then slowly dropped to ~900, then much more slowly to ~650 over a couple minutes. I think where I screwed the pooch is I changed Idle "Tracking Offset" from 1500 to 500, so when it lit off it went >500 beyond my set point and apparently stopped tracking idle. Duh... I guess from there it didn't know what to do so it just hung ~1200 for a bit?
    Don't ask me why I changed it to 500, I don't have an answer. I did a lot of stuff last night that I don't have answers for. Basically, for most things, I just thought; Hmmm, I think this # looks better, let see what happens.

    Meanwhile, the tune is attached if anyone is curious. I'm sure it's not normal looking, but feel free to comment.
    It's named E63 because it's in the E63 ECU I got from the junkyard. Plus my oem file as a comparo reference.
    Attached Files Attached Files
    '16 E550 Coupe RWD - C207.373 / M278.922 / MED17.7.3 / 722.909

  18. #38
    Advanced Tuner
    Join Date
    Jan 2022
    Location
    Southern California
    Posts
    348
    It seems the cool downshifting was due to my Idle Tracking mistake, because I changed it from 500 back to the oem 1500, which was the only change, and it's gone
    Guess it was too good to be true, and I no longer rule...

    Another problem is my radiator fan no longer comes on, which I can't figure out. I did change a few fan settings from my previous load but nothing drastic and can't see how it would shut the fan down.

    EDIT: Found the fan issue. I understood that "Low Fan" is for low vehicle speeds and "High Fan" is for higher speeds. I also read this online when I wanted to confirm it. What speed it transitions I don't know, but it doesn't matter because Low Fan apparently does nothing.
    While experimenting I plugged the Low values I had (fan starts @ 190F) into the High chart (was starting @ 215) and now the fan works. I can only assume Low doesn't do anything and with only one functioning chart the fan is now On while on the freeway?
    Before I discovered the above; I tried turning the AC On to force the fan On, but apparently AC has little or nothing to do with it, which is also very unusual imo.
    So with all these unusual things happening, I thought I'd share and see if this normal or what?
    Last edited by chevota; 02-26-2022 at 11:14 AM.
    '16 E550 Coupe RWD - C207.373 / M278.922 / MED17.7.3 / 722.909