high intake air temps!

[Turbo2gnx]

on most days when i start the car. i have about 30 degrees of difference between ambiant and intake air temp. im ridding around with intake air temps at 180-95 degrees! whats the chance im loosing power just from the temp. i believe the high heat is coming from my LT headers. in the begining i had to rap them to make to car drivable! drive for 10 mins, the car would shutdown and would not start and had to be towed.finaly figured that the wires were getting too hot and building up too much resistance. rapped the headers and redid the wiring harness and rapped them as well, no more shutting down but no real power! i called comp cams to see what type of airflow was needed for my cam so i could maybe get close as possible so i could get better performance but comp cams said they never heard of anyone asking about how much air a cam needs? now im asking you guys, what can i do to get my intake air down and how do i go about finding how much air is needed for my cam? HRT stage 2 112-303-11 any help is appreciated

[FstdodgeKY]

First whats the current build stats? Secondly the amount of airflow is determined by cam design, the cam will pull the air it needs as thats how the motor is designed to work. Just like a air pump. Adding a better intake, bigger TB, heads,cam,, and other intake mods as well as exhaust will help the engine breath better. Lastly and probably your most important issue is your IATs. I'd say your losing quit a bit of power due to the excessive high air temps, if this was a boosted application then 30-40 higher than ambient is about the normal from what I've seen. I would suggest looking into a LegMaker cold air. They make one that pulls fresh air from behind the bumper away from any engine heat. Best of luck..

[Turbo2gnx]

the build is, 08chrysler with eagle heads with stock head gaskets,220/230 comp cam,cai,LT headers, xpipe and 2-1/2 exhaust. i was having issues with heat from the start! it would run for more than 15 mins before shutting down from the wires getting way too hot. i rapped the headers and the wire harnness and now we dont have that issue anymore. just need to get the air intake down. the car dosent roar when it revs, sounds more like puttering,i changed airflow to see if i wasnt getting enoght air and nothing change so far as the sound as it revs. issue now is to get the iat a lot lower.

[FstdodgeKY]

Do you still have cats on this car?? Also check your fans, are they coming on when the suppose to? I've not seen a car get so hot under the hood that it causes this type of issue. But stranger things have happened. It really sounds like you might have other issues, if the cats aren't flowing and stopped up this can cause excessive heat and some of the other issues your having. Restrictions in the exhaust can cause heat to build up in the pipes, also try setting the fans to come on earlier to help move the air out of engine bay and look into a hood with heat extractors like the hellcats. Just a few options

[Turbo2gnx]

no cats. 180 stat and fans come one early for the 180 stat. i feel ill have to get a hood or find a way to remove all that heat.

[rays04gtx]

are you using a cold air intake ? the LX cars in general have a tight engine bay, , I know you are running Eagles , but what Intake manifold are you running ? and oddly what color is the 300 ?

[Spray-Cam Hell-Ram]

I think going the Ram air hood route is definitely one of your best options here. I found myself in the same predicament several months ago with my 16 Ram and decided to try the RRK Viper style Ram air hood with heat extractors from Amerihood for around $650. And once installed and then coupled with a custom fab-style air intake set-up, it ended up being one of the most game changing mods that I've added to the truck. And for a key part of my CAI set-up, I went on eBay and purchased the knock off version of the 2013-18 Mopar CAI Active Ram Air Duct Kit used with the Ram Sport Hoods for just under $200. I then altered and customized this kit to work with my Amerihood set-up. It was originally intended to be used with the right hood insert on the Ram Sport hood. I have a few pictures of my set-up and will find them and post them shortly. The addition of this hood, along with the customized CAI turned out to be a complete solution to this very same issue you are facing here. My IATs went from the 25 to 40 degrees F range over ambient air temp, to down in the -15 to 0 degrees F range for the most part (Sometimes even lower than -15 degrees during WOT and high-speed runs) Occasionally, it'll creep up to 5 to 10 degrees above ambient with longer idling, but that's now my worst-case scenario. I see they have quite a few Ram Air hood options for a 2008 300c to choose from. Just make sure the hood you go with has the heat extractors as well.

[Spray-Cam Hell-Ram]

Here are the pictures I mentioned in my last post...IMG_3094.jpg

[Spray-Cam Hell-Ram]

One more pic ..... I had to down size it to get it to upload on through.

[rays04gtx]

https://www.carid.com/2008-chrysler-...262811819.html


you won't regret it.

[Turbo2gnx]

are you using a cold air intake ? the LX cars in general have a tight engine bay, , I know you are running Eagles , but what Intake manifold are you running ? and oddly what color is the 300 ?

im using a 2013 charger 5.7 intake and the car is dark gray. the heat generated by the car is bad! you feel it sitting in the car!! around the car!

[Turbo2gnx]

Here are the pictures I mentioned in my last post?.IMG_3094.jpg

thanks for the advise! ill look for that hood, i need to get the temp down!ive seen a few hoods but they were just for looks with no functionality.

[Turbo2gnx]

https://www.carid.com/2008-chrysler-...262811819.html


you won't regret it.

NICE! thanks. i think this will be the one, next to find some plumbing to hook it to the intake. thanks!

[Spray-Cam Hell-Ram]

+1 For the hood in the link above! When I was thumbing through your options myself earlier, this is the exact same one I would go with personally as well.

[rays04gtx]

i called comp cams to see what type of airflow was needed for my cam so i could maybe get close as possible so i could get better performance but comp cams said they never heard of anyone asking about how much air a cam needs? how do i go about finding how much air is needed for my cam? HRT stage 2 112-303-11 any help is appreciated

I wanted to address this part of your Post/Question separately.

220/[email protected] 0.596./0.582 Lift, 113 LSA......... Nice cam, big cam, I have personally seen that cam make 560HP on the dyno in a bone stock 5.7 short block with P.I.E Heads(https://www.performanceinjectionequipment.com/ ported 2005 G3 Hemi heads) and a Indy Modman Intake with 80MM TB SRT6.1 injectors

Take this from a former Employee of Comp Cams, worked there 20 years, my main focus was valve train , retired last year... and Enjoying the golden years.....LOL

your question is not answerable in the way I think you want it answered....... all the cam does is dictate valve movement. think of it like this. Eagles heads , stock flow 325 [email protected],with your cam for less then 20* of duration your engine see max flow(325cfm) , but would see an average flow of 260 CFM for 220* of duration , now the 03-08 OEM heads ,peak flow is [email protected] again for only 20* of duration your engine is seeing 280CFM while the under peak it would see 240CFM for roughly 220* duration.

Now Apache Heads , the #s would be 340 @ .600 for 20* and under peak would average 268CFM

All Numbers are approximate and rounded up......but the point is the cam doesn't care about Air flow , it's all up to the heads, Runner size ,velocity, cross section, how well the ports are matched, the intake manifold also affects air movement.

[rays04gtx]

I wanted to address this part of your Post/Question separately.

220/[email protected] 0.596./0.582 Lift, 113 LSA......... Nice cam, big cam, I have personally seen that cam make 560HP on the dyno in a bone stock 5.7 short block with P.I.E Heads(https://www.performanceinjectionequipment.com/ ported 2005 G3 Hemi heads) and a Indy Modman Intake with 80MM TB SRT6.1 injectors

Take this from a former Employee of Comp Cams, worked there 20 years, my main focus was valve train , retired last year... and Enjoying the golden years.....LOL

your question is not answerable in the way I think you want it answered....... all the cam does is dictate valve movement. think of it like this. Eagles heads , stock flow 325 [email protected],with your cam for less then 20* of duration your engine see max flow(325cfm) , but would see an average flow of 260 CFM for 220* of duration , now the 03-08 OEM heads ,peak flow is [email protected] again for only 20* of duration your engine is seeing 280CFM while the under peak it would see 240CFM for roughly 220* duration.

Now Apache Heads , the #s would be 340 @ .600 for 20* and under peak would average 268CFM

All Numbers are approximate and rounded up......but the point is the cam doesn't care about Air flow , it's all up to the heads, Runner size ,velocity, cross section, how well the ports are matched, the intake manifold also affects air movement.

I also want to point out head flow can be cheated by compression, exhaust timing events, overlap, poor flowing intake manifolds(anyone running an OEM 03-08 truck manifold you are giving up 20hp off the bat)

Prostock and Superstock guys are constantly finding ways to make heads flow and act better on a running engine then a flow bench says it's capable of.

[Turbo2gnx]

I also want to point out head flow can be cheated by compression, exhaust timing events, overlap, poor flowing intake manifolds(anyone running an OEM 03-08 truck manifold you are giving up 20hp off the bat)

Prostock and Superstock guys are constantly finding ways to make heads flow and act better on a running engine then a flow bench says it's capable of.

Thanks for the reply with this info! Let me see if I?m understanding you on the head thing. To start off my CR is 12:5:1 using stock head gaskets from the 08 not the 2013 gaskets. Either get higher flowing heads or get a smaller cam? The heads are hindering the cam?s potential?

[rays04gtx]

the Heads are not hindering the cam at all, the Airflow #s I used are just an example of what the engine sees with different heads.
here's what the engine see with different cams
lets say you have a 268H cam, in your car
216/220 @.050 .528/.521

your engine would see peak 325CFMfor less then 10* and roughly 240CFM for 216*.......the short block sees less air flow with the 268H then with the cam your running now....hence the 268H cam doesn't have the power potential that the HRTstage2 cam does.

Keep in mind those are rough #s

All things Perfect at 6700RPMs 345CI engine only needs 230CFM, to make a max HP of 550. the HRT2 cam will pack more Air/Fuel=power potential then the 268h .....the rest is up to other factors which is why tuning is so important along with supporting mods(headers,Intake manifold...COLD air source....(just had to toss that in)

Now the Down side to Eagle heads on a 5.7......with the valve train limitations the G3 platform has , you can not buy an off the shelf cam big enough to optimally use 325CFM at 7500+RPMS . now that's not to say it's a bad thing, the More CFM we can pack in to those 43.125 CI cylinders the better ...which your HRT2 cam does better then a 268H would.

Talking NA, you boosted guys can go sit in the corner while I talk about honest HP.
Generally speaking here ,
325CFM will feed a 345CI engine all the way up to 9800RPMs ,
325CFM has the power potential off 670HP@8300 RPMs or 1.94 HP/CI @100% VE , we can cheat VE#s Super stock and Prostock guys do it all the time, Prostock operate at 125-127% VE, think of it as naturally supercharged, like I said earlier we can cheat the flow #s with Compression ,cam timing and Intake manifold designed, port velocity.
Bob Gliden's Prostock Cleveland's of the mid 70s were 331-347CI had made between 790/845 around 2.4HP/CI with Cam profiles no bigger then .755 lift with 375-390CFM @.750 lift.
Australian Prostock Guys are in the 2.8-3.1HP/CI @ 9500-11k RPMs with 400CI limitations. using 435-460CFM.
I've personally seen my builder (ric3xrt around the web, PurpleRAM here on HP) push a all forged Apache head 347CI G3 to 770HP @ 8700RPMs ...2.22 Hp/CI Na

Will your current cam get there, No, will your current short block get there, Hell no, will your current Valve Trian get there....Phuck no.....but it's not to say you don't have a good combo.....your combo will hit the 7k mark and has the potential of making 550hp.

The point is , your current set up has potential to make 550-580HP which is in the 1.6-1.70hp/ci range which is about as good as the average guy can do NA .. to squeeze 1.8 and higher takes good porting , Solid lifters, High ram/single plane intake.

with all that being said........now you know why sooooo many people go boosted now a days..... 10lbs of boost on 5.7 can get you that 670hp # at 5600RPMs

But For Me it's NA all the way , If I want boost I'll build a dragster.

[szndtuna]

How have you calculated your compression?

[Turbo2gnx]

How have you calculated your compression?

no i havent, i was told that number by someone here and they went off of what i said i have.