2000 5.3 Truck Norris Cam

I am helping a friend with a truck that had a cam swap in it, BTRtruck norris int 212 exh 22x lsa 107.5 int lift .553 exh lift .553. So its a P01 setup and I am trying to figure it out, obviously here I am because its not working out as I had hoped.
I have attached the as-read before doing anything, a short log of it trying to stay running with it dying a few times after foot from pedal, then the other I tried uping the base setpoint for the target idle speed, tried giving the primary VE extra for more fuel, adjusted cranking VE, startup, cranking spark changed, main spark high octane table.

It is junk, took a deep breath and stepped away from it to seek guidance.

When I hit the key to start, not sure why its not on log file, it spins up and starts to run and dies, which I am not sure how quick it transitions from startup table to main ve table.

I am interested to find out more

Thanks in advance.

Well just talked to the guy that swapped wanting to know what I was running into and come to find out he swapped a 6.0 into the 5.3 with this cam. Told him it would explain the huge discrepancy in air volume. So today, we will tell it that the LG LSDs cylinder volume is .75. My question now is will the VaE adjust or am I starting all over in the table. Last one I did when I was aware I just changed cylinder volume and then drove and tweaked here and. There and it was good.

Thanks
Steve

This should get you started. You will still need to disable equipment that is no longer on the vehicle. I would recommend you go up in injector size or you will be maxed out by 5400ish rpm. Get injectors and dial in ve and maf, dont forget this os uses a secondary ve table when maf is failed. You may swap to the 1 bar sd os to utilize 1 main ve table.

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Originally Posted by 04silverado6.0

This should get you started. You will still need to disable equipment that is no longer on the vehicle. I would recommend you go up in injector size or you will be maxed out by 5400ish rpm. Get injectors and dial in ve and maf, dont forget this os uses a secondary ve table when maf is failed. You may swap to the 1 bar sd os to utilize 1 main ve table.

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So I compared this file to mine and made the adjustments that showed up. Truck doesn't want to start cold but once it starts getting some heat in it, it still stumbles but does better. I have attached a log file and a cfg file to see if this helps.

I was watching the log file and when starting cold I think I may need to expanded the startup fueling maybe as the map is in the 90kpa range and I think I may have been trying to target the less than 1200 rpm and 60-45 kpa range.

I appreciate the help this far and hopefully I can get this thing out of the driveway before Sunday morning and we can go to DragWeek Tech day and see some cars and old friends.

Thanks

steve

You need to add stft and ltft bank 1 and 2 to your log. Try a write entire with this file, it has a sd enhanced operating system.

working 3am-3pm sucks so sorry for the delay.
I did a write entire with your file and add the stft and ltft for both banks in the scanner config. This file has a start or two and a few low rpm revs. It, from what I can tell with the stft and ltft, is trying to pull 12-18% fueling out of it. In my other truck I plot the WB feedback in lambda to a chart with the same column and row labels as the main ve table in the tune to adjust the cells needing correction.

I am looking for a pdf around here that told me what to plot in the same manner to know where to multiply by 1/2 but being this far out could probably be safe with a full to get closer.

I appreciate the help. I am actuallu off of work this weekend so this is my goal from now till saturday is to get this thing out of here.

The wife will be happy.

Thanks
Steve


Add the file goober.....Attachment 137358

Quote:

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Originally Posted by showelljr

working 3am-3pm sucks so sorry for the delay.
I did a write entire with your file and add the stft and ltft for both banks in the scanner config. This file has a start or two and a few low rpm revs. It, from what I can tell with the stft and ltft, is trying to pull 12-18% fueling out of it. In my other truck I plot the WB feedback in lambda to a chart with the same column and row labels as the main ve table in the tune to adjust the cells needing correction.

I am looking for a pdf around here that told me what to plot in the same manner to know where to multiply by 1/2 but being this far out could probably be safe with a full to get closer.

I appreciate the help. I am actuallu off of work this weekend so this is my goal from now till saturday is to get this thing out of here.

The wife will be happy.

Thanks
Steve


Add the file goober.....Attachment 137358

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Okay here is some more adjustments. It does good on a cold start and hot start up. Idles fine. Put the truck in reverse and its noticeable it went into gear but not violent. Back to neutral is non eventful. Drop it into drive and it jerks into gear and then is in the extreme bottom right of the VE table barely running, back to neutral its fine and reverse its fine. I adjusted the idle rpm a little for the AC ON in gear and park. In park its nice and smooth, very little change, obviously in drive you can't tell because of the crappy idle in gear. I have attached updated tune and a log file.

Thank you for any insight you may have.

Attachment 137452

Attachment 137453

Disable the LTFT's for now. There is quite a bit to do lol. Your RAF looks high. You will probably have to crack your throttle blade with the setscrew to get your IAC counts down and then readjust the RAF.

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Originally Posted by ns158sl

Disable the LTFT's for now. There is quite a bit to do lol. Your RAF looks high. You will probably have to crack your throttle blade with the setscrew to get your IAC counts down and then readjust the RAF.

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Ok, out here on the truck now, after getting my wifi fixed for laptop.

Engine > Fuel > Oxygen Sensors > LTFT is now disabled.

MAF is failed Engine Diag > Airflow > MAF Freq Fail High at 0hz

unplugged TPS and IAC with key off, then key on for 10 seconds, Key off, reconnected, key on, cleared codes.

Key On not running
Throttle Position sensor is at .47v
Throttle desired position .6%
Throttle position 0.0%

Attachment 137495
Attachment 137494

I think this is how to upload the Layout and Channel config files.

Scanner version 4.10.7

Yeah thats fine. Youll need to adjust it a little and when the truck is warm and at idle, youre shooting for around 70-80 counts, (if my memory is right lol). So it might take a few tries. Then keep on dialing in your VE table. That is going to make any airflow adjustments including "garage shifts" that much easier.

So, I still need to adjust the physical sensor on the TB? Ok, just looked at it a little closer and see the screw coming up from the bottom on the flange of the cable guide for the blade.

Question is by looking at the scanner config files, am I plotting the right sensor (ltft+stft) across rpm and map to bring back into the tune( I have used the same column and row points between the two)

I keep seeing knock retard pop up and haven't figure out where its coming from yet, its concerning to me, but may be over reacting to a degree.

Thanks for the info so far.

Yeah it should still be fine. Just using STFT without the LTFT would be better, but it shouldnt make difference. Search on here for filters to keep the "good" data. That setscrew is pretty much the throttle stop. You dont touch the sensor. You will have to do a throttle relearn every time you change the setscrew. Main thing is that is going to help with cold start. I figured do that now so you dont have to redo raf later.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ns158sl

Yeah it should still be fine. Just using STFT without the LTFT would be better, but it shouldnt make difference. Search on here for filters to keep the "good" data. That setscrew is pretty much the throttle stop. You dont touch the sensor. You will have to do a throttle relearn every time you change the setscrew. Main thing is that is going to help with cold start. I figured do that now so you dont have to redo raf later.

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Got to be something I am over looking for the Idle setup once in gear or AC comes on to add more air from the IAC, its bound to still be operating on 5.3 airflow needs and not the extra 6.0 consumption.

Its time for dinner and a beverage.

I really do appreciate the time you have spent today. At least it now, will start without having to pedal it hot or cold.

Thanks again

Well a log would help for that issue. Have to figure out that KR at idle. Either something is loose or rattling and setting them off is the first thing I could think of. I would add a couple grams of friction airflow and startup airflow to get it to start a little quicker. You can change them back down later after you get your RAF sorted.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ns158sl

Well a log would help for that issue. Have to figure out that KR at idle. Either something is loose or rattling and setting them off is the first thing I could think of. I would add a couple grams of friction airflow and startup airflow to get it to start a little quicker. You can change them back down later after you get your RAF sorted.

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These were the last two things I saved before coming in from the garage.

Couple things on the logged pids. You can take a bunch of those out. Like fuel flow and stuff like that. Do you have a wideband? Trims are more accurate but sometimes a WB helps get it into the ballpark quicker. Need to log either PRNDL or something so its easier to tell when you make the shift. What is happening is it flares so bad it kicks the engine out of Adaptives and then it just amplifies the oscillation. Do you have a stock file to compare against? That idle knock needs to be figured out too. Can you hear or feel any rattles? Loose heatshield or something? Try to smooth out the VE around Idle. Doesnt wholly matter right now if its not perfect AFR, but you can not have peaks and valleys on adjacent cells.

Here is the first file I saved out of the truck before I started doing anything.

I do have a wide band setup. I guess I can just pull one of the narrowbands and put the wideband in it for now? I would have to make up a harness and maybe plug it into the power outlet and wire it back into the pig tail so its logged in the scanner.

I talked with the guy who did the swap. Says the crank was longer on this one and may need the dished flex plate and spacer. I told him if the converter is pushed back into the pump with no pull out, it is destined to bust the pump in the trans. The valve train sounds like a sewing machine, not sure if he went into the top end of the motor before install. It has good oil pressure. I should start checking things, when I went to check and adjust the throttle stop screw on the TB, the air piping from the MAF, clamp wasn't tight and the rubber donut was not on properly either so not sure how much non-metered air it was sucking through.

ah....

Thanks again.

Alright so got the wideband in and finally figured out that one of my mpvi2 interfaces is a pro and one is not so I had to swap to get the WB to log in the scanner. Now, when I go to adjust the tune with this interface, it won't let me, tells me unlicensed vehicle. I grab two credits, resync the interface, they are there now and it still won't let me so I am logging with one and writing with the other trying to get done with this.

The barely running when putting it in drive, it was going 1.24Lambda in those cells so adding in those areas and interpolating and then seeing what the 3d chart looks like and try to smooth a little.


Give me a few and I will post a log with the WB in it.


Thanks

Ok, here is a log and the latest tune from a little fueling added on the in gear portion. I add EQ Commanded and Transmission status. I tried adding AC clutch but it was not working and it may still need to be charged as I am unaware if he broke open the system or not. Transmission has got something up in it. You can watch it in the log, Reverse does fine, doesnt stumble or anything and not much change from idle to in gear, drop it to D4, D3, and D1 and its lean and stumbling hardly running, D2, acts just like reverse so something not happy there.

Ok so a quick glance. You need to bring up the timing in the high load low rpm cells. You can see when you put a load on it, it is going into the negative timing cells. Also I don't know if I would keep going much more until you get that KR figured out. I cant believe they are picking up the cam misfires but maybe. So either there is some rattling around in the engine bay setting them off, or for now, disable all knock learn in the idle areas. I dont think you should be logging MAF in the pids either. Can't remember the details, but i thought it would skew dynamic airflow, I could be way off lol. Youd have to search that.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ns158sl

Ok so a quick glance. You need to bring up the timing in the high load low rpm cells. You can see when you put a load on it, it is going into the negative timing cells. Also I don't know if I would keep going much more until you get that KR figured out. I cant believe they are picking up the cam misfires but maybe. So either there is some rattling around in the engine bay setting them off, or for now, disable all knock learn in the idle areas. I dont think you should be logging MAF in the pids either. Can't remember the details, but i thought it would skew dynamic airflow, I could be way off lol. Youd have to search that.

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Crawled around it a good bit when I was installing the WB sensor and grabbed things to see if they were loose, tapped on things to see if anything sounded loose or such and didn't find anything out of line to make me go back and double check it.

Its dumb early as I am back on the 3a-3p shift again, but does the P01 reliably log misfire data for the individual cylinders? I will pull some of the pids out and add those in to see if its isolated to a cylinder or all of them. My thinking is a single cylinder, I'll start there, but all of them and maybe its just the cam setup?

Sitting there idling it is just a tad rich, its richer on startup, but really never shows more than a 1.01 EQ idling.

Thanks
Steve

You need MAF enabled for misfire detection. I'd do a quick search on idle knock, and/or turn them down/off at idle.