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Thread: M177 Stock Turbo Limits

  1. #1
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    M177 Stock Turbo Limits

    Does anyone have some good logs of the stock turbos or turbo upgrades on the M177? I think I am reaching the limit of mine. WGDC is averaging around 80% on the top end and I can seem to get more that about 215kpa in the upper RPM range. My elevation is 4500'. I don't think I would have this question if I were at sea level. Now the questions is do I do some upgrades?
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  2. #2
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    Your Optimum Torque settings would kill my car, so I set it how I would do it. Keep in mind that if does respond to that change I have no idea how much boost it might make because it is a big jump. I vaguely recall tinkering with someones 4.0L tune once and we couldn't get the boost up, like there was some other limiter we can't see in HP? Maybe you have the same problem, I dunno...

    I did a few other things that I would do as well, if it were my car. Up to you if you want to try them, obviously.

    chev mod 4.hpt
    '16 E550 Coupe RWD - C207.373 / M278.922 / MED17.7.3 / 722.909

  3. #3
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    There Is definitely more torque limiters than what HP tuners has. I can't get mine to respond anymore. I would like to get close to 250kpa in the lower rpm but everything I have tried doesn't seem to help. I'll mess a little more with max torque variant 0,1, and 2. Hopefully it will show some sort of diff. This stock AMG GT 630hp files is pretty interesting
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  4. #4
    Advanced Tuner outlaw_50's Avatar
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    Took a look at the tune,

    Why are the Optimum Torque Monitors and Throttle Max Flow zeroed out?

    could you post your stock file so we could get a better look at your changes
    Xstages Motorsport

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  5. #5
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    I'm guessing HP tuners has the wrong address for the throttle angle at max flow map. My guess on the monitoring is that the tuner is disabling it so it can't intervene with torque cut, also notice "testing comparison" and "min max fault" values maxed out.
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  6. #6
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    jacep, I thought you zero'd out the Opt Tq Monitors. I thought it odd but apparently it worked for you so I left it alone. So this was a tune you bought?

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by chevota View Post
    jacep, I thought you zero'd out the Opt Tq Monitors. I thought it odd but apparently it worked for you so I left it alone. So this was a tune you bought?
    Hey Chevota, correct this started as a STG 2 tune, I felt there was still a lot left on the table so I started playing with a lot of things. Unfortunately there are still some critical maps/limiters in that background that are not populated by Hp Tuners. I think these are keeping me from getting it where I want it. I did drop the Nominal torque down to 774 and managed to gain another 10 kpa of boost in 3rd. 4th hits almost 240kpa. The hit is a fair amount better, but peak boost in 1st and 2nd is still pretty sad. I'm going to keep messing more with this it has given the most gains through tuning so far. I wish I knew if logged torque is calculated from nominal torque or some other factor. I am assuming nominal which would be 10-15% lower than actual torque.

    I'll have to get me a tactrix openport and start working on a solution for the Transmission next. I really need to up the limiters for 1st, 2nd, and 3rd.

    I first ran this tune with the stock intake, this was way restrictive. Not changing anything other than the intake gained about 25kpa at the big end.

    Eurocharged on instagram has a good dyno graph of there STG1 on a C63. Based on comparing their hp curve to my curve I wouldn't be surprised if they are upwards of 250-260 kpa down low.
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  8. #8
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    I lowered my Nominal to 800 and it works nice. One day I may try to get full power with it back at 885, just to see if I can.
    My Optimum Torque Monitor values are lowered ~5%, which helped. Also changed the Eng Torque scaling on it from 185 to 191, which is as far as it goes, which also helped.
    I don't need to push anything further because at some point I got my turbo duty cycle to stay at 100%, and since I can't do any better than that I haven't been messing with the torque stuff in a while. A side bennie of my tinkering, for whatever reason, is it doesn't pull throttle in 1st to 3rd gears like it's supposed to. Not sure why, but I'm not complaining.

    From what I can gather, that Opt and Opt Monitoring just feed into Tq to Load, and Tq to Load seems to be the ultimate goal. The problem, imo, is the oem Opt settings won't drive to the highest % line in Tq to Load. So if you only raise the #'s in the highest % line in Tq to Load, nothing happens because it never got there on the map. Raise the next lower, or so, % lines, where it is hitting, and it responds. So I can do that but I prefer to get Opt to hit the max % line in Tq to Load, and I'm fairly certain I have. That's why I said your Opt settings would kill mine, because it would fall short on the Tq to Load map.

    Note; which might just be my car, but weird sht will happen sometimes when I load a tune. All kinds of things from it simply not taking the change I did, to upsetting unrelated things, and the most common is a mysterious power loss. Since my turbo DC is 100%, when running right, it's super easy to spot an issue now because it'll drop below 100. So then I load the previous known good tune and make the same changes, or start from scratch and make the same changes. Either way it works and back to normal. No clue why this happens, but if things don't make sense or it's not cooperating, give it a try.

    Tuning is back burner for me since I've been trying to get it to pass smog for months. I have a CEL for P2610 (Engine Off Timer), whatever the F that is, and I just can't make it go away. An unfixable CEL is the demise of almost all the electronic cars I've had, and the only fix is to get rid of them. I really want to keep this one, so we'll see.

    If you can't figure out how to get the power you want, outlaw_50 would no doubt be the guy to fix whatever is holding you back.
    '16 E550 Coupe RWD - C207.373 / M278.922 / MED17.7.3 / 722.909

  9. #9
    Advanced Tuner outlaw_50's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chevota View Post
    I lowered my Nominal to 800 and it works nice. One day I may try to get full power with it back at 885, just to see if I can.
    My Optimum Torque Monitor values are lowered ~5%, which helped. Also changed the Eng Torque scaling on it from 185 to 191, which is as far as it goes, which also helped.
    I don't need to push anything further because at some point I got my turbo duty cycle to stay at 100%, and since I can't do any better than that I haven't been messing with the torque stuff in a while. A side bennie of my tinkering, for whatever reason, is it doesn't pull throttle in 1st to 3rd gears like it's supposed to. Not sure why, but I'm not complaining.

    From what I can gather, that Opt and Opt Monitoring just feed into Tq to Load, and Tq to Load seems to be the ultimate goal. The problem, imo, is the oem Opt settings won't drive to the highest % line in Tq to Load. So if you only raise the #'s in the highest % line in Tq to Load, nothing happens because it never got there on the map. Raise the next lower, or so, % lines, where it is hitting, and it responds. So I can do that but I prefer to get Opt to hit the max % line in Tq to Load, and I'm fairly certain I have. That's why I said your Opt settings would kill mine, because it would fall short on the Tq to Load map.

    Note; which might just be my car, but weird sht will happen sometimes when I load a tune. All kinds of things from it simply not taking the change I did, to upsetting unrelated things, and the most common is a mysterious power loss. Since my turbo DC is 100%, when running right, it's super easy to spot an issue now because it'll drop below 100. So then I load the previous known good tune and make the same changes, or start from scratch and make the same changes. Either way it works and back to normal. No clue why this happens, but if things don't make sense or it's not cooperating, give it a try.

    Tuning is back burner for me since I've been trying to get it to pass smog for months. I have a CEL for P2610 (Engine Off Timer), whatever the F that is, and I just can't make it go away. An unfixable CEL is the demise of almost all the electronic cars I've had, and the only fix is to get rid of them. I really want to keep this one, so we'll see.

    If you can't figure out how to get the power you want, outlaw_50 would no doubt be the guy to fix whatever is holding you back.

    Sure we could get it sort out but as he said tactrix would be better.
    Thanks for the good input !
    Xstages Motorsport

    Tuning inquiries:

    ECU, TCU, CPC Online Tuning
    Whatsapp: +971503383340
    Email: [email protected]
    Insta: @xstages.motorsport
    www.xstages.com